Some GURPS 4e Traveller news

[Morte]

Over in the JTAS forums, somebody asked whether they'd be updating G:T to 4e GURPS when the time comes. Jon F. Zeigler, the line editor, posted a reply which might interest people here:

Probably not in the manner you're thinking of.

I've been waiting for the chat to be posted, but that
doesn't appear to have happened yet (probably waiting
for the big GURPS Fourth Edition chats to be done first).
So here's a *very brief* summary of the plan.

There will be at least one more GURPS Traveller release
before the license comes up for renewal - and I'm hoping
for two.

The one that *will* appear is the Interstellar Wars book.
That will be very nearly a standalone, requiring nothing
but the new Basic Set (or the new GURPS Lite) to play.
There will be rules systems in this book for world design,
trade and economics, and starship design and combat - all
tailored for the Interstellar Wars era. There will also
be quite a pile of new back-story material - as much as
half the book will be brand new, including detailed looks
at the Vilani Imperium and the Terran Confederation.

The goal for that book is to sell not only to existing
Traveller players, but also to bring in new players who
are interested in the setting. That's why it's a standalone,
and while it creates a fair amount of new canon, it will
also summarize all of the old canon on the period - which
should be relatively easy, since there hasn't been that
much.

The Interstellar Wars book will be a big 256-page hardcover.
It should contain everything you need to play Traveller in
the Interstellar Wars era.

The book that *may* appear is a similar big hardcover with
the working title of _Third Imperium_. Again, the notion
will be that this one book will have everything you must
have (other than the Basic Set of GURPS Lite) to play in
the 1120-era "alternate universe" setting.

The Third Imperium book will, of necessity, have a lot of
refurbished material in it - again, the world-design, trade,
and starship rules adapted to the 1120-era setting. Also a
fair amount of material summarizing how the Imperium and its
neighbors work, and possibly a full sector for immediate
play. For the benefit of established players, though, I'm
working on an outline that will also leave plenty of room
for new material.

_Third Imperium_, if it appears, will probably be the book
best suited to serve as the GURPS Fourth Edition conversion
for all the existing GT material. Ideally you could take
that book and any GT materials you already own and be set
for life.

Any in-print products after that depend on a lot of things
that aren't under my control - like whether the GT license
gets renewed again, and how well those one or two books do
on the market. Products that might go to E23 are another
matter, of course.

{E23 is the PDF publishing/sale thingy they've got in the works at SJG}

 

[mike wightman]

I want them both...

 

[kafka47]

Actually, I would want see GT stick to the Interstellar Wars milieu, as this is an area that GT could really help new & old players alike.

New players would get the greatest space epic ever told being dolled out to them in managable bites.

Old players would welcome the additions to cannon. Doing something like Third Imperium sounds like BtC plus the main rulebook with a few extras. While, I do own the whole GT alternative timeline products, I must say my vote would be to leave this area in better hands. This timeline is being replicated in some degree in T20, CT reprints and those of who still own MT.

While, it would be tempting I rather see new things than the reworking of something old.

 

[Morte]

I'm sure they'll renew it.

Before you ask, I just am.

 

[Malenfant]

I don't believe T5 will ever actually be released, and even if it does I don't believe it'll make anything near enough money to be more profitable than GT. I get the impression that GURPS Traveller sells quite well, and the 4e system isn't going to be that different.

Put it this way, I'd be very surprised if Marc was to pull the GT license. Given that SJG are releasing the IW book next year, I'd be surprised if they didn't want to renew it.

Either way, SJG have made it clear on JTAS that what happens with the license is nobody's business but their own and Marc's.

 

[plop101]

from Malenfant:

Either way, SJG have made it clear on JTAS that what happens with the license is nobody's business but their own and Marc's.

My apologies. Prior posting deleted.

 

[daryen]

Originally posted by Malenfant:
Either way, SJG have made it clear on JTAS that what happens with the license is nobody's business but their own and Marc's.

Good grief! What a moronic position to take. Of course it is the fans' business to know if the license will be renewed.

Quite simply, if the license is not going to be renewed, then just about any money a fan spends on GT from this point forward is money spent on a dead product.

 

[Anthony]

If SJG knew that the license was going to be renewed, they might well announce it. If they knew the line was going to be killed they might announce it, though that's less likely. However, if negotiations are ongoing (for example, there is debate over just how much SJG pays Marc), they legitimately don't know and really don't want to say.

 

[hunter]

Umm they just renewed the license last year I believe. Where does this speculation on their Traveller license come from?

Hunter

 

[Malenfant]

The licence that they renewed last year runs til the end of 2005, IIRC. Since GT4e Interstellar Wars is due in Feb 2005, and a Third Imperium supplement would come later on in the year, if it comes at all, then that puts it pretty close to when the license runs out. Hence why a continued 4e3I would depend on whether it was renewed.

To an extent though, it's quite fair enough that they say that the matter of the license renewal is their business. They might not even know whether it will be or not and so are (more wisely) not commenting on it either way. After all, as Daryen illustrated with his comment, if people did know what was going on, they'd lose money as people didn't buy existing books. That's also probably why they only announced GURPS 4e itself when it was pretty much in the can and ready to go, to minimise the time where people think "well, 3e's done with and I want to get 4e, so there's no point in getting any more books til then".

 

[Whipsnade]

hunter asked:

"Umm they just renewed the license last year I believe. Where does this speculation on their Traveller license come from?"

Mr. Gordon,

Jon Zeigler mentioned it during an official chat at JTAS-Brubek's. He was explaining how GURPS 4e would effect the G:T line and mentioned that SJGames' current license runs out in 2005.

The chat log is available at JTAS.


Sincerely,
Larsen

 

[hunter]

Wow! Two years huh? I would have bet on at least 3 on the renewal.

Ah well, hopefully they will renew and continue the line.

Hunter

 

[Morte]

I think that...

how well those one or two books do on the market

...is the real issue over the long term, not licensing.

So far, they say G:T has been profitable but not brilliant. Their line seems to have been improving steadily. If they carry on, they'll be fine.

GT:IW is a novel, exciting product. It will support a fresh style of OTU play since most of the terra is incognita. And it's not hampered by canon. [They don't even have to invent a pathetic excuse for the Terrans winning, as it's set in a lull during the war and that all came later. I hope they'll have the sense not to.]

As for G:T 3i, the problems I perceive with current G:T are about sloppy rush jobs early on and the "so what books do I need and how much of each is useful?" factor. They've had a wealth of input on that, and it's well within their power to resolve it.

 

[Drakon]

I have to disagree with daryen. Many of us have the original LBBs and still use them. That was not money wasted. As to whether CT is a "dead product" or not is irrelevant to the enjoyment one gets playing by those rules.

I like the G:T stuff, and will continue buying it. Whether they renew the license or not, I don't give a flying..., well, you get the point.

 

[daryen]

Originally posted by Drakon:
I have to disagree with daryen. Many of us have the original LBBs and still use them. That was not money wasted.

I never said money would be wasted. I said it would be spent on dead product.

Each purchaser has to make their own decision as to whether buying dead product is wasted money. I will not even take a guess as to which "the majority" would tend to.

However, I still stand by my statement. It is the fans' business to know whether the license will be renewed, or not. BTW, I am not actually critisizing SJG for keeping everything secret (though I don't like it), I am simply saying that the statement I quoted in my previous article that was attributed to Jon is flat wrong.

Saying "We can't/won't tell you," is a legitimate statement. Saying "It's none or your business," is simply incorrect.

 

[Qstor2]

I'm hoping that Imperial Navy and Jon Ziglers's Aldeberran book come out as well. I like the books a lot too and have 95%.

Mike

 

[Malenfant]

Jon said on JTAS that development of the Aldebaran book had been put on hold while IW was being written. He's not sure when or how it would see the light of day, but it may be as an e23 product (or it may not be).

I just unsubscribed from JTAS yesterday though, so someone else will have to update us on any further developments there.

 

[kafka47]

Has anyone heard anything new on the Interstellar Wars front?

Namely, will it be a book that takes us from pre-First Contact to the establishment of the ROM?

Will it be in colour most GURPS books that are hardcover ought to be in colour?

Is there any discussion of a release date?

Is there anything more about Imperial Navy or Third Imperium product or did we just see GT: Starship subsume IN?

 

[Morte]

Originally posted by kafka47:
Has anyone heard anything new on the Interstellar Wars front?

Namely, will it be a book that takes us from pre-First Contact to the establishment of the ROM?

Is there any discussion of a release date?

Will it be in colour most GURPS books that are hardcover ought to be in colour?

No. All very quiet.

I did have the impression that it would be set at a point during the war, with timelines up to then (which would presumably let you play earlier). I was quite pleased about this because it means they don't have to say how the Terrans won -- let's face it, any reason they invent can only be pathetic. I think it's better to just leave the question alone. However, the last I heard they were working on an explanation.

I get the impression the setting is deliberately being left very open -- e.g. they might have maps for half a sector (or something) around the point of contact, and a worldgen system for the rest.

All 4e books will be colour hardbacks, for at least the first three years. Last date I heard mentioned for IW was early-mid 2005, and there has not been not much talk about it recently.

Is there anything more about Imperial Navy or Third Imperium product or did we just see GT: Starship subsume IN?

Nothing definite.

As for 3I, I expect they'll do it if they make good money on the preceding books.

Like I said earlier, it wouldn't be hard to improve the GURPS sales. There's a lot of strategy talked over at JTAS, but at the end of the day I think they sell when they make good books. They have to avoid doing rush jobs like the early line up, produce self-contained books that don't (appear to) require 5 other books for 30 pages each, and maintain the sort of quality they hit in Sword Worlds. If Nobles and IW do that, I reckon they'll sell enough to do a 3I book afterwards.

 

[tjoneslo]

From gleamings of the comments of the principles involved and some random speculation on my part:

IW will be out sometime next year, I think. And it will be a Powered By GURPS 4th edition product. The other GURPS book you may want to look for is Vorskgian. And yes, it will be full color hardback.

And both the 3I book and IN book are on indefinate hold. Mostly because neither have a author at this point.