Maximum Sustainable Population-TNE for Cm-Ba-Resource worlds

[Liam Devlin]

Normally I'd post this there, but as this is a House rule e.g. IMTU, I'll put it here instead. We've been tinkering with the collapse process down below in the 1248 Bearers of the Flame playtest region.

One of the things that Elliot, and badbru and DED and I have kicked about are those worlds that survive all 118 years (1130-1248), yet do not look viable for life. Especially with no starport (or X-class). Another argument to the side for now.
[EDIT-Part I]
Now an old house rule I had based off of extrapolations in UWP went simply like this-
Minimum TL for survival = Pop digit 1. Every level of Tech after that, allowed +1 digit more. Applying MSP modifiers for planetary size and Hydrospheres allowed you to set for your Pocket empire, whose usual Wilds TL max might be 12/C , the maximum pop your PE could support reclaiming this world.


Planet Size
5-7 -1
1-4 -2

Hydrosphere
A -1
0-1 -2

Thus, if you were reclaiming/ recolonizing/ or had survived on a world where Life support is a MUST to get by..say airless world (atmosphere 0 or TL-7)
your UWP would look like this:

E100100-7
E100200-8
E100300-9
E100400-A...and so on, for a MSP of 6
at TL-C

E100600-C .
For New era, I used this for players working the salvage trade setting up/ or shuttling supplies to the boneyard/Cm/"Resource" worlds. Depending on the level of former pop the size of the work colony there.

Now worlds with trace atmospheres were cheaper to start on, as TL-5+ could get you by, right? But in the RC space "safe"/PE, From TL-7 to TL-2 [Spires]or TL-3 [Helios] there wasn't a member world at TL-5. So most projects of tis kind had to start at TL-7 [Lowest TL/ bidder].

So any Cm Ba world with atmospheres 1-3 would look like this:

E130100-5--Minimum TL for LS.
E130200-6
E130300-7
E130400-8
E130500-9
E130600-A-MSP maximum.

Lets take this to the PE's TL-C maximum now--a former major Shipyard Ba world/ lanthanum refinery /mining complex: You wish to reclaim this world and get it back to working order because--
A.- External enemies are threatening you [Vampire fleets, other Human Polities].
B.-Your PE is expansionist minded [RC, Solee, Sufren, others]
C.-Your Starship building/ repair depends upon it.
D.-You have unemployed masses who need the work.

Here i applied the rule again, +1 digit:

E130700-B
E130800-C

Now say Regency opens the frontier in 1202, and TL-D & E [13/14] comes to play.

E130900-D
E130A00-E.
As I ran RCES-Soleean regional campaigns, this did not come into play except as an example.Thus for New era rebuilding purposes tech level as well as numbers of starships played a crucial part in how a polity reclamed barren/ cemetery/ resource worlds.

ANd Salvage, Like any other business, works off contracts. And IN the expanding RC, lowest bidder in budget tight RCSA politics won every time.
Only in reclaiming worlds with B & C Atmopsheres were the expenses higher !

E1B/C0100-8--Minimum TL for LS
E1B/C0200-9
E1B/C0300-A
E1B/C0400-B
E1B/C0500-C--Wilds PE max TL usually.

 

[Liam Devlin]

PART II:

Starport "size" vs Population on CM-Ba-resource worlds.

[Again, this is IMTU, and is in no way OTU. If it works for you, hey great. If not...well, I made you think! If you have a better way, heck--share it!]

Going back to the term "salvage" & salvagers per se, the TNE period sees a lot of reconstruction and rebuilding. Often times as not on the wreckage and items left from the previous Third Imperium.
In My Traveller Universe, the players quickly soured on "Smash N Grab". Too many NPC buddies left on worlds that didn't like or care much for the RCES.
So they took to salvage. They turned out to be very successful at it. Having been my ADnD group, they learned that not all treaure was coins--s too they learned in Traveller the new era, and the Auctions of the RCSA worlds.
[Several who shopped at Flea markets and went to real auctions already were familiar with the process so RP-ing came easy to them].

Upon the clearance to salvage a world within the "AO" as PoT-GDW called it, they set to work. Their initial claims they sold after setting up the clearance of several anti-social AI-CYMs/ Viral lifeforms. They left the place with a working E-class starport [Having that bulldozer blade for their ATV in the modular cutter was a plus].
So the company that bought at auction the rights to complete the salvage of that world set out. The Players drove on...
Now in the Long run of my 7 real-life years campaigns in TNE, it worked like that, with the exception of the planet of Baldur which got into a political tussle with Oriflamme over backface worlds their people descended escaped from.

Generally Cm Ba worlds with former pop of 4 or less were deemed worthy of a survey, and a look see.
Worlds with former pop 5+ were the targets.
They classified as players these into Class I, II, III, IV, V, VI salvage worlds. [Former Pop 5,6,7,8,9,& A].

Class I & II Cm Ba worlds generally got an E-class starport set up on them. The Follow-on salvage company who sent workers there to dismantle factories and machinery generally improved these to D-class, one year after starting.
In simplicity sake, they had a corresponding population of workers [Pop digit 1, 2, 3 & 4]

So generally in the first year of set up, E-class port of call. Most Class I worlds were salvaged in a years time. Two years on the far side of things given J-2 engines, and distance.
Class III-IV worlds [former pop 7 & 8], had more salvage, and in order to get it back into use, needed a prefab D-class port to be added to the work-colony's expense. These worlds tended to have about three years or more of dismantling salvage available, but generally less than five.
The big money and long term investment came in the Class V & rarer (save for B-subsector Alpha Leonis & P-Sitah/Old Expanses) VI worlds. 1st year an prefab D-class port set up & installed, with working towards full blown C-class ongoing as that year ended. So that by the 4th year's end, a working C-class port was available for faster service of goods off/onto the work colony.

Starport worker/colonist Pop.

E-class [initial, 1 year jobs] pop digit 1-3

D-class [2-4years of work] pop digit 2-3.

C-class [5 years+ salvage] pop digit 3-4*

* Generally a world or PE effort to move pop 4 worth of workers there. The Sarid Asteroid belt in Oriflamme subsector IMTU was an example of such, as the mineral ores and refinery's there were needed by RCSA shipbuilders.

More to follow as I dig thru my dead tree notes..
enjoy! YMMV.

 

[Liam Devlin]

Part III--Targetting Cm-Ba Resource worlds for colonizing/ salvage work colonies, and why!.

Based upon my TNE-Players notes for their salvage company "Jumping-Jack-Flash Interstellar Salvage & Mercantile, LTD. Aubaine/Aubaine" and my own "Beyond The Grave, LTD., Lucifer/Oriflamme":

[WARNING-LONG POST]


I. Former starport
A class = +20% - Starshipyard & Spacecraft facilities for rebuilding ones back in home polity. Fuel purification equipment also present.
B class = +15% - Spacecraft construction facilities for use back in home polity. Fuel purification equipment also present.
C class = +10% -STarship Spacecraft maintenance facilities for repairs, tools, and parts in home polity. Fuel purification equipment maybe present*
D-class = +05% - Spacecraft repair facilities [As in class C above].

II. Former Tech Level
9 = 0%, generally a market sold to Oriflamme, and those TL-8 worlds of the Coalition moving tech upwards, and clients like Keipes, & Nova Rhyll.
A = +05%, heavy trade in this tech-level market as oriflamme was pushing to regain prewar tech level. Machinery for spacecraft and starship building bring premium prices from the Technarches. Solee also heavily after said tech level salvage for their PE to regain prewar TL!
B = +10%, all Life support equipment sold offline from auction to Baldur. RCSA set prices, but its a steady check. Trybec and Aurora competitive for it.
C = +15%, Aurora and Aubaine primary buyers.
D = +20%, Aubaine almost exclusively the buyer.
E = +25%, rare mostly military stuff, sold offline at auction to RCN or RCMC. Again, flat rate, but steady paycheck.
F = +30%, Rarest still, the creme-de-la-creme stuff. Due to scarcity of said TL-F worlds, this stuff [once cleared of viral infection] went for top credit.

III. Former bases
Naval base +10%
Scout Base-S +05%
Scout Base-Xboat Waystation +05%
Both Navy & Scout bases +15%

IV. Former Population
Former pop 0-4 = 0, aka, Ruins Only.
Former Pop 5 = +05%, aka Class I Salvage
Former pop 6 = +10%, aka Class II Salvage
Former pop 7 = +15%, aka Class III Salvage
Former Pop 8 = +20%, aka Class IV Salvage
Former Pop 9 = +25%, aka Class V Salvage
Former Pop A = +30%, Aka Class VI Salvage.

V. Gas Giant present [for refuelling]
Yes +10%
No -10%

Thus in Aubaine subsector alone:
Arvid 0131 A9C7866-E Fl 425 Im M3 VI M7 D
X9C7000-0 Ba Fl 025 --
-A Class IV site, [+20% former pop/ +20% former starport/ +25% former tech level/ GG present +10% ] = 75% of founding a work colony to salvage there. Albeit at minmum of tech 8 due to atmosphere! IMTU it was, with much anti-viral cleaning!!!
------------------------------------------------
Savjanni 0135 A330764-E S De Na Po 103 Im K1 V M0 D
X330000-0 De Po Ba 003 --

A Class III Site [+15% former pop/+20% Starport/+25% former tech level/+05% Scout base/GG present +10%] = +75% of founding a work colony there. Done cheaply, workable at TL-5 if need be. With RCSA, at TL-8. IMTU it was.
---------------------------------------------
Svarla 0137 B200765-D S Na Va 201 Im M3 V M4 D X200000-0 Ba Va 001 --

Another class III Site: [+15% former starport/+15% former pop/ +20% former Tech/ +05% former base/ GG present +10%]= +65% of founding a work colony there, at TL-7 min for vaccuum. IMTU, it was.
-------------------------------------------------
Kresek 0236 C8C7675-A Fl Ni 302 Im M0 V M1 D X8C7000-0 Fl Ba 002 --

Is a Class II Site: [+10% former starport/+10% former population/+10% former Tech level/ GG present +10%]= +40% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU, this did not occur. Atmos, Starport and TL were deciding factors.
------------------------------------------------
Peirsma 0240 A000646-D As Na Ni 210 Im M0 V X000000-0 As Ba 010 --

A Class II Site: [+20% former port/+10% former Pop/+ 20% former tech level/No GG present -10%]= +40% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU it was. Starport and TL were deciding factors.
-------------------------------------------------
Buhle 0334 A51099B-F A Hi In Na 404 Im X510000-0 Ba 004 -- K2 IV

A Class V Site well within the RCSA AO: [+20% former starport/+25% former pop/+30% former tech level/+15% former two bases/GG present +10%] = +100% being recolonized for salvage work colony. IMTU it was.
------------------------------------------------
Adrian 0432 A42667A-E Ni 103 Im M7 VI X426000-0 Ba 003 --

A Class II Site:[+20% former starport/+10% former pop/ +25% former tech level/GG present +10%]= +65% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU, it was.
-------------------------------------------------Conner0840 A31058A-A S Ni 303 Im X310000-0 Ba 003 -- M1 V

An example of a Class I site:[ +20% former starport/+05% former pop/+05% former Tech level/GG present +10%] = +40% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU it was, subsidized by Oriflamme for obvious reasons!
_________________________________________________

Now in Oriflamme Subsector, compettion was fierce between Baldur, Oriflamme.

Bestor1131 A110663-E Na Ni 904 Im X110000-0 Ba 004 -- G1 V

A class II Site: [+20% former starport/+10% former pop/ +25% former TL/+10% GG present]= +65% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU, it was, by a Balduri business combine.
------------------------------------------------
Corrig1331 C622620-9 Na Ni Po 803 Im X622000-0 Ba Po 003 -- F4 V M9 D

A class II Site: [+10% former starport/+10% former Pop/ +0 former TL/ +10% GG present]= +30% of being founded as work colony. IMTU, this did not occur.
-------------------------------------------------L'steich1333 A9A4975-F S Fl Hi 414 Im X9A4000-0 Fl Ba 014 -- K4 V

The only Class V site in the subsector, and Baldur's former Homeworld: [+20% former starport/+25% former pop/+30% former tech level/+05% former base/+10% GG present]= +90% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU it was, exploited by Oriflamme-a Bone of contention with fellow centrist Baldur.
-------------------------------------------------
Sarid1532 B0007A5-D As Na 604 Im X000000-0 As Ba 004 -- K6 D

A class II Site: [+15% former starport/+15% former pop/+20% former Tech level/+10% GG present] = +60% being founded as a work colony. IMTU it was, by Baldur for the lanthanum and refinery machinery of the once subsector Capital system. This in tit for tat of the colony on L'Steich.
-------------------------------------------------
Coast1540 C400320-B Lo Ni Va 913 Im X400000-0 Ba Va 013 -- M3 V M8 D

An example of a Lo pop world. [+10% former starport/+0 former pop/+10% former TL/+10% GG present]= +30% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU, it was not.
-------------------------------------------------
Nimz1633 C222664-B S Na Ni Po 200 Im X222000-0 Ba 000 -- G8 V

A Class II Site: [+10% former starport/+10% former pop/+10% former Tech level/+05% Former base/-10% No GG's present]= +15% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU, it was not.
-------------------------------------------------
Tuer1636 B8C2733-E A Fl 113 Im X8C2000-0 T Fl Ba 013 -- A1 V

A Class III Site: [+15% former starport/+15% former pop/+25% former TL/+15% two former bases/+10% GG's present] = +80% of being founded as a work colony. IMTU, it was, albeit at TL-8 due to Atmos by Oriflamme.
_________________________________________________

Alpha Crucis/Alpha Leonis Sector, Subsector A, Lazzerton, Joint efforts between JJFISM & BTG Salvagers [all within the 10 parsecs of the RCSA AO by the way!]:

Pack0102 C200747-A Na Va 803 Im
X200000-0 Ba Va 003 -- F3 V M7 V

A low priority Class III site:[10% port/+15%pop/+05% TL/+10% GG's present] = +45% chance of being founded. IMTU, it was not.
-------------------------------------------------
Ximenes0105 B110884-D Na 113 Im
X110000-0 Ba 013 -- G7 V
An important Class IV site: [+15% port/+20% pop/ +20% TL/ +10 GG's present]+65% being founded. IMTU it was. Goods sold primarily at Aubaine's auction.
-------------------------------------------------
Iamir0208 C100AAB-F S Hi In Va Na 304 Im X100000-0 Ba Va 004 -- M2 V M7 V
At the far end of the AO, but a Class VI site! [+10% port/ +30% pop/+30% TL/+05% base/ +10% GG's present] = +85% of being founded. IMTU it was, a far flung effort but worth the expense to the RCSA.
-------------------------------------------------
Wulfe0303 A434964-F Hi 602 Im
X434000-0 Ba 002 -- M0 V
A nearby Class V site: [+20% port/+25% pop/+30% TL/+10 GG's present] = +85% of being founded. IMTU, yes.
-------------------------------------------------

Faro0502 D100AAC-F Hi In Va Na 310 Im
X100000-0 Ba Va 010 -- M0 V
Nearer than Iamir, the closest Class VI site to the RC polity. [+05% port/+30% pop/+30% TL/-10% no GG's] = +55% to found, not a high as Iamir's criteria, but its proximity paid for itself.
-------------------------------------------------
Phlegethos0503 C6B0562-C Ni De 621 Im
X6B0000-0 Ba 021 -- K4 V K4 V
AN example of a class I site in the rimward AO: [+10% port/ +05% pop/+15% TL/ +10% GG's] = +40% of being founded. IMTU, No.
------------------------------------------------
Brandon's Rock0603 C100587-E Ni Va 300 Im
X100000-0 Ba Va 000 -- G1 V M7 V
Another class I site in the rimward AO: [15% port+ 05% pop + 25% TL -10% no GG's] = +35% of being founded a work colony. IMTU It was not.
------------------------------------------------
Hubishag0608 C8C4620-A Ni 123 Im
X8C4000-0 Ba Fl 023 -- M4 V
A class II site in the rimward AO:[+10% port + 10% pop + 05% TL + 10% GG's present] = 35% chance total. IMTU, nope.
-------------------------------------------------
Marathon0804 B110850-F N Na 803 Im
X110000-0 Ba 003 -- K2 V
Another rimward nearby class IV site: [+15% port, + 20% pop, + 30% TL, +10% Navy base, + 10% GG's present]= +85% chance. IMTU, yes.
------------------------------------------------
Uriel0805 B7C0743-B S De 314 Im
X7C0000-0 Ba 014 -- M1 V K7 D
A class III site in rimward AO: [+15% port, +15% pop, +10% TL, +05% Scout Base, +10% GG's present]
= +55% chance. IMTU, yes--all LS parts went straight to Baldur.

 

[Liam Devlin]

PART III [continued]
McKenzie Subsector B/ Alpha Crucis [CT]/Alpha Leonis [TNE]:

Mostly BTG, LTD.s domain, based out of Luhtahla/Lucifer.

Endyf0903 B7A7986-E Hi Fl 603 Im
X7A7000-0 Ba 003 -- K2 V M2 V
A nearby Class V site in rimward AO: [+15% port, +25% pop, +25% TL, +10% GG's present] = +75% chance of being refounded as work colony. IMTU, yes.
------------------------------------------------
Ychanon1002 B1009BA-F Hi In Va Na 310 Im X100000-0 Ba 010 -- M1 V M2 V
The second close Class V site to Lucifer: [+15% port, +25% pop, + 30% TL, -10% no GG's]= +60% chance of refounding as work colony. IMTU, yes.
------------------------------------------------
Patrent1101 B8A0ABB-F A Hi De 311 Im
X8A0000-0 Ba 011 -- M1 V M9 V
Lucifer's ace in the hole. A Class VI site: [+15% port, +30% pop, +30% TL, +15% two bases, +10% GG's present]= 100% chance of refounding a work colony. IMTU..Of course it was!
-------------------------------------------------
Winona1104 B9A75AC-C Ni 124 Im
X9A7000-0 Ba 024 -- M3 V
AN example of a class I site in rimward AO: [+15% port, +05% pop, + 15% TL, +10% GG's present]= +45% chance of founding as work colony. IMTU no, as 3 class V and 1 Class VI site were easier to reach. The spacecraft building facility was salvaged in several trips, no permanent colony established.
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Fairday1303 E100A98-E Hi In Va Na 823 Im
X100000-0 Ba 023 -- G3 V
The third class V site close to Lucifer: [+0 port, +25% pop, +25% TL, +10% GG's present] = +60% chance f work colony founded. IMTU, yes.
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Grady1406 A000566-F Ni As 300 Im
X000000-0 Ba As 000 -- K4 V
A slightly better class I example than Winona: [+20% port, +05% pop, +30% TL, -10% no GG's] = +45% chance. IMTU, No. But the starshipyard and spacecraft building facilities were removed in several trips and sold to Aurora and Trybec.
-------------------------------------------------
Ruskin1505 C200768-A Va Na 200 Im
X200000-0 Ba 000 -- K2 V A1 D
AN example of a class III site: [+10% port, +15% pop, +05% TL, -10% No GG's present] = +20% of being made a work colony. IMTU No. Several trips made, goods sold to Oriflamme & Xezor.
-------------------------------------------------

Port Royal1506 A210545-F N Ni 303 Im
X210000-0 Ba 003 -- G3 V M7 V
A good example of a class I site: [+20% port, +05% pop, +30% TL, +10% Navy Base, +10% GG present]= +75% work colony founded. IMTU, yes.
-------------------------------------------------
Eby1602 E11069B-A Ni Na 512 Im
X110000-0 Ba 012 -- K3 V K4 V
An example of a class II site: [+0 port, +10% pop, +05% TL, +10% GG's present] = +25% chance. IMTU, No.

NOTE: Salvage in the RC had been underway from 1192-1202, usually with the canary and Lightningbolt methods of clearing Virus from infected machinery. With the advent of the AVV weapon SNAKE in spring of 1202, and commercial use later that year, Suicide strains left on boneyard worlds died in the billions, and recovery of these worlds leaped forward...IMTU.

 

[Badbru]

Ahhhgh Liam

I must buy a printer!!

I just set up a thread down on TNE board which more or less asks the question for these very answers. well... kind of.

Anyway, I really like all this stuff and will be pouring over this thread for ideas.

Thanks mate!

 

[Liam Devlin]

WEl Badbru..I had to use these processes to "explain" to certain smart players how the auction-economy worked. THEY took it one step beyond...and sold salvage rights to places they scooped. Kinda helped my campaign along..
The PoT book showed how the RC had "reclaimed several "dead worlds"..but looking at these as poor sisters in law to say economic giants like Oriflamme or Aubaine..I saw them as a poor excuse for volunteerism colonies.
Whereas ALL those worlds listed above offfered YEARS of salvage opportunities to rebuild the RC from...if they weren't overrun by Solee..or Virus...
Glad to be of service!