Danger Space

[hemulen]

Hi.

Reading the combat rules, the section on Danger Space seems a bit odd - basically the rules say to roll for a hit upon any target in the danger space area (which I'm assuming is the radius of the burst).

However, it doesn't say anything about what the 'to hit' roll should be. I don't like the idea of using the same roll as was used to land the shot on target, because the burst effect shouldn't be reliant upon factors like range, etc.

So, does anyone have any tweaks for this? You could just say that the initial roll to get on-target is all that's needed, and anyone in the danger space is automatically attacked, but I'm not sure if that is the actual intention or not.

My first thought is to make it something like a task:

For a target in Danger Space to be hit:

Routine, Off=?, Def=Dex, (confrontation)

I figure that the target gets a Dex mod to represent hitting the dirt etc. Not sure what/if the offensive mod/s should be, if any, given that the penetration drops off as the radius increases.

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Hi.

Reading the combat rules, the section on Danger Space seems a bit odd - basically the rules say to roll for a hit upon any target in the danger space area (which I'm assuming is the radius of the burst).

However, it doesn't say anything about what the 'to hit' roll should be. I don't like the idea of using the same roll as was used to land the shot on target, because the burst effect shouldn't be reliant upon factors like range, etc.

So, does anyone have any tweaks for this? You could just say that the initial roll to get on-target is all that's needed, and anyone in the danger space is automatically attacked, but I'm not sure if that is the actual intention or not.

My first thought is to make it something like a task:

For a target in Danger Space to be hit:

Routine, Off=?, Def=Dex, (confrontation)

I figure that the target gets a Dex mod to represent hitting the dirt etc. Not sure what/if the offensive mod/s should be, if any, given that the penetration drops off as the radius increases.

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Hi.

Reading the combat rules, the section on Danger Space seems a bit odd - basically the rules say to roll for a hit upon any target in the danger space area (which I'm assuming is the radius of the burst).

However, it doesn't say anything about what the 'to hit' roll should be. I don't like the idea of using the same roll as was used to land the shot on target, because the burst effect shouldn't be reliant upon factors like range, etc.

So, does anyone have any tweaks for this? You could just say that the initial roll to get on-target is all that's needed, and anyone in the danger space is automatically attacked, but I'm not sure if that is the actual intention or not.

My first thought is to make it something like a task:

For a target in Danger Space to be hit:

Routine, Off=?, Def=Dex, (confrontation)

I figure that the target gets a Dex mod to represent hitting the dirt etc. Not sure what/if the offensive mod/s should be, if any, given that the penetration drops off as the radius increases.

Mark

 

[Cymew]

Mark,

It's much easier than that. Read below the "Danger Space" paragraph at PM p.73 and you'll find "Group Hits" which is what happens in a danger space.

You roll to hit just like the main target, but the penetration drops by half for each square out. Usually that means not much happens more than one square out.

 

[Cymew]

Mark,

It's much easier than that. Read below the "Danger Space" paragraph at PM p.73 and you'll find "Group Hits" which is what happens in a danger space.

You roll to hit just like the main target, but the penetration drops by half for each square out. Usually that means not much happens more than one square out.

 

[Cymew]

Mark,

It's much easier than that. Read below the "Danger Space" paragraph at PM p.73 and you'll find "Group Hits" which is what happens in a danger space.

You roll to hit just like the main target, but the penetration drops by half for each square out. Usually that means not much happens more than one square out.

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
You roll to hit just like the main target

Sure, but the initial "to hit" is determined by range, firer skill etc, whereas the blast in the danger space radius is just that, a blast from the munitions, and i don't think it should be affected by range and other factors - it's purely determined by the exploding item.

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
You roll to hit just like the main target

Sure, but the initial "to hit" is determined by range, firer skill etc, whereas the blast in the danger space radius is just that, a blast from the munitions, and i don't think it should be affected by range and other factors - it's purely determined by the exploding item.

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
You roll to hit just like the main target

Sure, but the initial "to hit" is determined by range, firer skill etc, whereas the blast in the danger space radius is just that, a blast from the munitions, and i don't think it should be affected by range and other factors - it's purely determined by the exploding item.

Mark

 

[Cymew]

Sure, but it models fairly well the fact that if you aimed at that square instead, it would have been as likely to be hit (the same difficulty for range) and the likelyhood of getting hurt is a bit less (thus the lower pen).

Making another oportunity for referees to judge a difficulty seems to be to be against the spirit of the rules for no real gain in realism.

But, sure. You could always do another task for it but make sure it is a fairly low penentration. Maybe use the next higher difficulty as the main hit since it is an indirect hit, after all.

I really don't see the point of changing the rules as written, but I see where you're coming from.

 

[Cymew]

Sure, but it models fairly well the fact that if you aimed at that square instead, it would have been as likely to be hit (the same difficulty for range) and the likelyhood of getting hurt is a bit less (thus the lower pen).

Making another oportunity for referees to judge a difficulty seems to be to be against the spirit of the rules for no real gain in realism.

But, sure. You could always do another task for it but make sure it is a fairly low penentration. Maybe use the next higher difficulty as the main hit since it is an indirect hit, after all.

I really don't see the point of changing the rules as written, but I see where you're coming from.

 

[Cymew]

Sure, but it models fairly well the fact that if you aimed at that square instead, it would have been as likely to be hit (the same difficulty for range) and the likelyhood of getting hurt is a bit less (thus the lower pen).

Making another oportunity for referees to judge a difficulty seems to be to be against the spirit of the rules for no real gain in realism.

But, sure. You could always do another task for it but make sure it is a fairly low penentration. Maybe use the next higher difficulty as the main hit since it is an indirect hit, after all.

I really don't see the point of changing the rules as written, but I see where you're coming from.

 

[Cymew]

Hey, for maximum speed in resolution, while keeping the spirit of the rules, do an automatic hit but quarter the penetration!

 

[Cymew]

Hey, for maximum speed in resolution, while keeping the spirit of the rules, do an automatic hit but quarter the penetration!

 

[Cymew]

Hey, for maximum speed in resolution, while keeping the spirit of the rules, do an automatic hit but quarter the penetration!

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
Hey, for maximum speed in resolution, while keeping the spirit of the rules, do an automatic hit but quarter the penetration!

Hm, that's not a bad idea at all, I might try that and see how it works out.

Looking at the danger spaces/penetration values, some of them do look a bit weird e.g. Grenade Launcher RAM GL-11 HE Pen 36 Danger Space 30m.

It just seems odd that there is absolutely no point in specifying 30m danger space if the penetration is going to drop to zero in a few squares.

I have the feeling that some of the larger danger spaces (15m+) are actually for the 15m/square scale rather than the 1.5m. If so, then to be consistent across the 1.5 and 15m scales, a simple tweak would be to scale the damage in bands, e.g

HE Pen 36 Danger Space: 30

In 15m scale that would be target hit at Pen 36, 1 square away Pen = 18, 2 squares away Pen = 9.

In 1.5m scale, it would be target hit at Pen 36,
up to 10 (15m) squares away Pen = 18, up to 20 (30m) squares away Pen = 9. This seems much more consistent to me, else the area of effect changes if you move between 1.5 and 15m scale.

I assume that flechette rounds don't drop off in penetration over the danger space, else they would be completely useless!

I may play with this a bit more. Basically though, I just don't like the inconsistency of having a specified danger space that doesn't do anything, and also the change of effect moving from 1.5m to 15m scale...

cheers,

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
Hey, for maximum speed in resolution, while keeping the spirit of the rules, do an automatic hit but quarter the penetration!

Hm, that's not a bad idea at all, I might try that and see how it works out.

Looking at the danger spaces/penetration values, some of them do look a bit weird e.g. Grenade Launcher RAM GL-11 HE Pen 36 Danger Space 30m.

It just seems odd that there is absolutely no point in specifying 30m danger space if the penetration is going to drop to zero in a few squares.

I have the feeling that some of the larger danger spaces (15m+) are actually for the 15m/square scale rather than the 1.5m. If so, then to be consistent across the 1.5 and 15m scales, a simple tweak would be to scale the damage in bands, e.g

HE Pen 36 Danger Space: 30

In 15m scale that would be target hit at Pen 36, 1 square away Pen = 18, 2 squares away Pen = 9.

In 1.5m scale, it would be target hit at Pen 36,
up to 10 (15m) squares away Pen = 18, up to 20 (30m) squares away Pen = 9. This seems much more consistent to me, else the area of effect changes if you move between 1.5 and 15m scale.

I assume that flechette rounds don't drop off in penetration over the danger space, else they would be completely useless!

I may play with this a bit more. Basically though, I just don't like the inconsistency of having a specified danger space that doesn't do anything, and also the change of effect moving from 1.5m to 15m scale...

cheers,

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
Hey, for maximum speed in resolution, while keeping the spirit of the rules, do an automatic hit but quarter the penetration!

Hm, that's not a bad idea at all, I might try that and see how it works out.

Looking at the danger spaces/penetration values, some of them do look a bit weird e.g. Grenade Launcher RAM GL-11 HE Pen 36 Danger Space 30m.

It just seems odd that there is absolutely no point in specifying 30m danger space if the penetration is going to drop to zero in a few squares.

I have the feeling that some of the larger danger spaces (15m+) are actually for the 15m/square scale rather than the 1.5m. If so, then to be consistent across the 1.5 and 15m scales, a simple tweak would be to scale the damage in bands, e.g

HE Pen 36 Danger Space: 30

In 15m scale that would be target hit at Pen 36, 1 square away Pen = 18, 2 squares away Pen = 9.

In 1.5m scale, it would be target hit at Pen 36,
up to 10 (15m) squares away Pen = 18, up to 20 (30m) squares away Pen = 9. This seems much more consistent to me, else the area of effect changes if you move between 1.5 and 15m scale.

I assume that flechette rounds don't drop off in penetration over the danger space, else they would be completely useless!

I may play with this a bit more. Basically though, I just don't like the inconsistency of having a specified danger space that doesn't do anything, and also the change of effect moving from 1.5m to 15m scale...

cheers,

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
Making another oportunity for referees to judge a difficulty seems to be to be against the spirit of the rules for no real gain in realism.

Right, that's really why I was thinking of making it a flat defined task of Routine, Def=Dex etc. After all, according to the original rules you'd be rolling to see if they were hit anyway, using the original factors, all this is doing is substituting a different task for that.

cheers,

Mark

 

[hemulen]

Originally posted by Cymew:
Making another oportunity for referees to judge a difficulty seems to be to be against the spirit of the rules for no real gain in realism.

Right, that's really why I was thinking of making it a flat defined task of Routine, Def=Dex etc. After all, according to the original rules you'd be rolling to see if they were hit anyway, using the original factors, all this is doing is substituting a different task for that.

cheers,

Mark