What you THOUGHT you knew about CT???

[Supplement Four]

And the skill cap is only "a general rule of thumb" - read into that what you will

My take on it is this: There are some skills that you might add to the game that you wouldn't want to add to the Experience Limit.

For example, Pg. 39 of the Aslan alien book gives rules on learning new languages. Languages show up as a skill.

If a GM started keeping track of all the languages a PCs knows by making them each, individually, skills, as the rules suggest, then I could definitely see those skills not counting towards the character's Experience Limit.

By default, though, most skills do count towards it.



Also note that the Experience Limit is total skills or total skill levels, never counting Level-0 skills. So, a character with INT-7 EDU-6 and a total of 15 skills would have to drop two whole skills, regardless of level (not counting Level-0). Then, add up the remaining 13 skills and ensure the total of the levels don't exceed 13. If any of those are over Level-1, then they'll have to be reduced so that total skill levels do not exceen 13 either.

 

[far-trader]

Also note that the Experience Limit is total skills or total skill levels, never counting Level-0 skills...

Also note that is redundant

Total skill levels will equal total skills if all are level-1. If any skill levels are greater than level-1 you need only concern yourself with the skill level total as that will always be greater than the total skills. So really you only need to count skill levels and not worry about total skills.

 

[DaveChase]

Not Cannon but my take on skills for Traveller

Total different skills (that have a level greater than 0) can not be more than Int+Edu
Maximum Skill level for any one skill is equal to the lowest of two stats (either Int or Edu)
Next highest skill level is that minus 1
Next highest skill level is that minus 2
etc until the skills reach a level equal to 1/2 of the lowest stat

To use S4 example to continue my take

Int 7, Edu 6
Max number of known skills with a level of 1 or higher is 13
Highest skill level for one of those skills is 6
Another skill could be level 5
And one other skill could be level 4
and all the rest could be a max of level 3

If a character wishes to increase a skill higher than is allowed by the above then one of the higher skills must be decrease
This is a way of showing that when you specialize in one area you lose your edge in another.
This is a loss not a switch, you must show and Role Play the time to make such a change to your skills.

I know that this is not cannon. But it something that I allow for those characters that end up with lots of different skills during creation.

Dave Chase

 

[atpollard]

The only time that the 'Int+Edu Limit' was ever an issue with a character of mine happened when I WANTED to play a 70 year old 'Thief'. I actually found the number of skills of level 4+ (and its effect on rolls) was more of an issue.

Other than placing an ineffective limit on 'munchkin power-gamers' (the average is 14, which is already a LOT of skill levels in CT), it serves no significant purpose.
I mean at the end of the day, so what if the Marine with Int 5 and Edu 5 has 12 skill levels?

 

[Supplement Four]

The only time that the 'Int+Edu Limit' was ever an issue with a character of mine happened when I WANTED to play a 70 year old 'Thief'. I actually found the number of skills of level 4+ (and its effect on rolls) was more of an issue.

Other than placing an ineffective limit on 'munchkin power-gamers' (the average is 14, which is already a LOT of skill levels in CT), it serves no significant purpose.
I mean at the end of the day, so what if the Marine with Int 5 and Edu 5 has 12 skill levels?

I believe the game designers added this to the game for two reasons: First, the 2D6 system breaks with too many modifiers, so this is a limit they put in the game to help minimize breakable conditions.

Second, a player could get real lucky with Advanced Character Generation, so this rule helps keep Advanced chargen characters on par with Basic Chargen characters.

I mean, the INT 3/EDU 2 dude might as well not go through advanced chargen unless he's only going to do a term or two.

 

[DaveChase]

I believe the game designers added this to the game for two reasons: First, the 2D6 system breaks with too many modifiers, so this is a limit they put in the game to help minimize breakable conditions.

Second, a player could get real lucky with Advanced Character Generation, so this rule helps keep Advanced chargen characters on par with Basic Chargen characters.

I mean, the INT 3/EDU 2 dude might as well not go through advanced chargen unless he's only going to do a term or two.

And why not?
Could he get stat increases for benefits that might make a difference?
Could be then pick and choose what skills to keep?
And if the player really role played, this might be a more interesting character than most 'educated' ones.

Dave Chase

 

[atpollard]

I mean, the INT 3/EDU 2 dude might as well not go through advanced chargen unless he's only going to do a term or two.

To be blunt, if forced to play an INT 3/EDU 2 character by random rolls, I would probably attempt as many terms in the Advanced Chargen Scouts as the rules allowed with each survival roll another chance to play a real character.

 

[Jeffr0]

That's how I ended up with my 5 term Int 3/Edu 2 Scout....

 

[atpollard]

I believe the game designers added this to the game for two reasons: First, the 2D6 system breaks with too many modifiers, so this is a limit they put in the game to help minimize breakable conditions.

But does it really do this?

The average roll on 2D6 is 7 with nearly half of the rolls falling in the 6-8 range. So most characters should have a limit of 12 to 16 skill levels. It seems to me that the 2D6 curve will be broken by even 12 skill levels (or the guy will be skill-1 at nearly everything).

How many of the sample characters have 12 or more skill levels?
That's 6+ terms in LBB 2.

 

[aramis]

Actually, AT, it's 5+ terms, due to rank and service skills. Army wil get Rifle and SMG, marines Cutlass and Pistol, etc.

I don't feel the Int+Edu limit does what S4 claims it does. I find it does provide a useful model of failing skill with disuse... Especially since I've had characters with Skill 5+ under Bk 2 (Scout pilot 5 in 4 terms).

 

[Kaveman Koder]

That marines cutlas rules has bugged me, I know I've read it somewhere but now I can't find it. Could someone please give me the reference, thanks.

 

[aramis]

That marines cutlas rules has bugged me, I know I've read it somewhere but now I can't find it. Could someone please give me the reference, thanks.

Several different "Marine Cutlass Rules" come to mind.

Every Marine having Cutlass skill: TTB, p 25, top right, Rank and Service skills.

Marines having to take later blade combat receipts as cutlass: Megatraveller Player's Handbook

 

[far-trader]

Several different "Marine Cutlass Rules" come to mind.

Every Marine having Cutlass skill: TTB, p 25, top right, Rank and Service skills.

Also Book 1 of course (pg 15 Rank And Service Skills).

Marines having to take later blade combat receipts as cutlass: Megatraveller Player's Handbook

Unless they make a throw to break tradition iirc. May even apply to the first and all rolls of Blade Cbt for Marines a nagging memory is whispering.

And then there's Book 4 (pg 4 Skills) where Marines also* may roll to break tradition whenever they roll Blade Cbt or else take it as Cutlass.

* unless I've been mentally mapping and/or house ruling the Book 4 rule onto MT

 

[aramis]

My copy of Bk4 is buried...

 

[Rev Round]

Regarding skills and the concept of skills and the learning of skills in particular:

Training is different to education. However they are not mutually exclusive but there is a difference between cognitive and reflex. Example: Consciously thinking about jumping out of the way of an oncoming car might get you killed more easily than if your natural fright/flight reflex is free to respond.

Maybe some skills in game are less to do with education as such and more to do with training a reflex?

Another idea. Maybe all that heavy melee weapon training might not raise your weapon skill past the edu ceiling but would it not raise your endurance and strength?
And people who don't train with a melee weapon regularly might lose their edge!

 

[Gruffty]

Also Book 1 of course (pg 15 Rank And Service Skills).



Unless they make a throw to break tradition iirc. May even apply to the first and all rolls of Blade Cbt for Marines a nagging memory is whispering.

And then there's Book 4 (pg 4 Skills) where Marines also* may roll to break tradition whenever they roll Blade Cbt or else take it as Cutlass.

* unless I've been mentally mapping and/or house ruling the Book 4 rule onto MT

Dan: you're correct. The actual rule is: throw 9+ on 2D to avoid taking the skill as Cutlass, DM -1 for each previous term served in the Marines.