Vargr Loyalty

[aramis]

I never said that Varr can't, nor don't, form large governances. But a vargr polity runs VERY differently.

It's not about who has the best ideas, but who is most confident that their idea will work.

Vargr are NOT terrifically loyal, per se. So long as they see you as a strong leader, they will follow you, even if you are a serious wanker tactically and strategically. They practice social and occasionally military promotion by deposing of their extant boss... and vargr promotions are based upon charisma elevations (AM Vargr, V&V), not compentencce nor timme in grade, etc.

Success breeds charisma, and charisma breeds competent followers, and competent followers breed success..

 

[aramis]

I never said that Varr can't, nor don't, form large governances. But a vargr polity runs VERY differently.

It's not about who has the best ideas, but who is most confident that their idea will work.

Vargr are NOT terrifically loyal, per se. So long as they see you as a strong leader, they will follow you, even if you are a serious wanker tactically and strategically. They practice social and occasionally military promotion by deposing of their extant boss... and vargr promotions are based upon charisma elevations (AM Vargr, V&V), not compentencce nor timme in grade, etc.

Success breeds charisma, and charisma breeds competent followers, and competent followers breed success..

 

[Lexx]

If a leader screws up badly or often enough, vargr will begin deserting him. The more charasmatic the leader, the more he gets away with but eventually all sensible vargs will desert a bad enough leader no matter how charasmatic he is.


Of course some will follow a charasmatic enough leader to hell, but humans can be like that to. Just look at germany in the 1940's for proof of that.

 

[Lexx]

If a leader screws up badly or often enough, vargr will begin deserting him. The more charasmatic the leader, the more he gets away with but eventually all sensible vargs will desert a bad enough leader no matter how charasmatic he is.


Of course some will follow a charasmatic enough leader to hell, but humans can be like that to. Just look at germany in the 1940's for proof of that.

 

[Keklas Rekobah]

It seems to me that members of Canis Sapiens might be easier to maintain as loyal retainers that those treacherous Homo Sapiens monkey-types.

How many wolves would knowingly offer poisoned food to a leader? How many wolf-pack leaders would knowingly send a rival on a suicide mission just to mate with the rival's wife?

[I know, it's the Fallacy of Equivocation.]

It seems to me that Vargr would not resort to secret treachery when a direct challenge would gain them the respect of the entire pack - if the challenger is victorious, of course.

 

[Keklas Rekobah]

It seems to me that members of Canis Sapiens might be easier to maintain as loyal retainers that those treacherous Homo Sapiens monkey-types.

How many wolves would knowingly offer poisoned food to a leader? How many wolf-pack leaders would knowingly send a rival on a suicide mission just to mate with the rival's wife?

[I know, it's the Fallacy of Equivocation.]

It seems to me that Vargr would not resort to secret treachery when a direct challenge would gain them the respect of the entire pack - if the challenger is victorious, of course.

 

[aramis]

Originally posted by Keklas Rekobah:
It seems to me that members of Canis Sapiens might be easier to maintain as loyal retainers that those treacherous Homo Sapiens monkey-types.

(snip)
It seems to me that Vargr would not resort to secret treachery when a direct challenge would gain them the respect of the eniter pack - if the challenger is victorious, of course.

Vargr, in the case of a challenge, will try to set it up quietly, then explosively, demostrably, and decisively execute it so as to raise their charisma.

Vargr are less likely to act independantly until unsupervised than humans, but more likely to disobey when unsupervised, as well..

 

[aramis]

Originally posted by Keklas Rekobah:
It seems to me that members of Canis Sapiens might be easier to maintain as loyal retainers that those treacherous Homo Sapiens monkey-types.

(snip)
It seems to me that Vargr would not resort to secret treachery when a direct challenge would gain them the respect of the eniter pack - if the challenger is victorious, of course.

Vargr, in the case of a challenge, will try to set it up quietly, then explosively, demostrably, and decisively execute it so as to raise their charisma.

Vargr are less likely to act independantly until unsupervised than humans, but more likely to disobey when unsupervised, as well..

 

[Lexx]

I wonder if anyone ever tired a 'charisma cologne' to simulate the pheremones of a great leader in order to sway vargr?

BTW, in gurps traveller, star mercs, it says vargr will follow a human if he's a great leader.

 

[Lexx]

I wonder if anyone ever tired a 'charisma cologne' to simulate the pheremones of a great leader in order to sway vargr?

BTW, in gurps traveller, star mercs, it says vargr will follow a human if he's a great leader.

 

[Glen Allen Mcinnes]

I foget where I orignaly read this but (and i paraphrase) "Varg will follow a leader that is abseant or has reasntly taken a charisma hit if they can see some beneifit (even if its just avoiding a but kicking in the near future)in the corse of action provided there is no clearly seperoior leader around to follow" so the key to runing a Varg orginasion is
1) have confdance
2) have good and stylish plans (style and subtance in equle measure)
3) succead (with style)

and on the topic of remote leaders there is Oekhsos the leader who is not even organic but a basic template for use on a "utuvogh" and has wide apeal and infulance although this comes from the rebellion source book (for MegaTraveller)if you read the whole faction profile (p.62-63) you can see how sublimnal cues like clour and sound harmonics can affect your preceved chrisma, so ineffect yes there is a "charisma cologne" of sorts and it even works for fake "people"

 

[Glen Allen Mcinnes]

I foget where I orignaly read this but (and i paraphrase) "Varg will follow a leader that is abseant or has reasntly taken a charisma hit if they can see some beneifit (even if its just avoiding a but kicking in the near future)in the corse of action provided there is no clearly seperoior leader around to follow" so the key to runing a Varg orginasion is
1) have confdance
2) have good and stylish plans (style and subtance in equle measure)
3) succead (with style)

and on the topic of remote leaders there is Oekhsos the leader who is not even organic but a basic template for use on a "utuvogh" and has wide apeal and infulance although this comes from the rebellion source book (for MegaTraveller)if you read the whole faction profile (p.62-63) you can see how sublimnal cues like clour and sound harmonics can affect your preceved chrisma, so ineffect yes there is a "charisma cologne" of sorts and it even works for fake "people"

 

[alanb]

Originally posted by 313:
I foget where I orignaly read this but (and i paraphrase) "Varg will follow a leader that is abseant or has reasntly taken a charisma hit if they can see some beneifit (even if its just avoiding a but kicking in the near future)in the corse of action provided there is no clearly seperoior leader around to follow"

In other words, Vargr are sentient creatures and will act according to their perceived best interests.

Of course, they may perceive their best interests differently from humans. They use their sense of smell more than humans do, for starters.

 

[alanb]

Originally posted by 313:
I foget where I orignaly read this but (and i paraphrase) "Varg will follow a leader that is abseant or has reasntly taken a charisma hit if they can see some beneifit (even if its just avoiding a but kicking in the near future)in the corse of action provided there is no clearly seperoior leader around to follow"

In other words, Vargr are sentient creatures and will act according to their perceived best interests.

Of course, they may perceive their best interests differently from humans. They use their sense of smell more than humans do, for starters.

 

[aramis]

Originally posted by Lexx:
I wonder if anyone ever tired a 'charisma cologne' to simulate the pheremones of a great leader in order to sway vargr?

BTW, in gurps traveller, star mercs, it says vargr will follow a human if he's a great leader.

In CT & MT traveller, Human Charisma is treated as (Soc/3)+ leadership or thereabouts, but can fluctuate bu experience with said human...

And humans generally need less, as we do produce pheremones, too... just we aren't as sensitive to them. (which is part of why your dog knows you had a bad or good day.... he can pick up the stress pheremones.)

 

[aramis]

Originally posted by Lexx:
I wonder if anyone ever tired a 'charisma cologne' to simulate the pheremones of a great leader in order to sway vargr?

BTW, in gurps traveller, star mercs, it says vargr will follow a human if he's a great leader.

In CT & MT traveller, Human Charisma is treated as (Soc/3)+ leadership or thereabouts, but can fluctuate bu experience with said human...

And humans generally need less, as we do produce pheremones, too... just we aren't as sensitive to them. (which is part of why your dog knows you had a bad or good day.... he can pick up the stress pheremones.)