Traveller Version Comparison

[Foen]

Not sure which forum should house this thread, as there didn't seem to be an 'any other discussions about Traveller' forum.

I am a long-time fan of Traveller, but only ever played Classic Traveller (back in the early 1980s), so missed out on the subsequent versions. With T5 in the pipeline, is there a high level overview of the way the game mechanics differ from one flavour of traveller to another? As I see it, there are (at least):

• Classic Traveller
• MegaTraveller
• Traveller: The New Era
• T4
• Mongoose Traveller
• T5

I'm less interested in the differences in the setting/universe, and more keen to understand how the game mechanics vary. I have omitted the GURPS and T20 versions, as I guess the game mechanics for those are tied into GURPS and d20 respectively.

Cheers

Foen

 

[mbrinkhues]

MegaTraveller:

• Advances the CT setting timewise by 11-26 years (1116-1130 timeframe)
• In 1116 the Emperor and his heir are killed by an Archduke citing the "right of assasination"
• Multiple peretenders to the throne (Including one that claims to be Strephon) come up
• The 3I frachtures into civil war with the major factions being
  • Archduke Dulionr, Strephons assasin. Fled the capital after the shots
  • Prince Lucan, a distant relative of Strephon. Was in capital. Not certified due to the circumstances around the death of his older brother Prince Varian
  • Duchess Margaret, another distant relative of Strephon (IIIRC daughter of the grand-uncle)
  • Archduke Brzk of Antares
  • The Real Strephon out of Gushemege
• The 3I fractures even more when
  • The Solomanie declare war and start retaking worlds. It does not help than Lucan recalls border fleets to fight Dulinor
  • The Vilanie Empire rises again
  • Corridor is overrun by Vagr raiders forcing Archduke Norris to declare Independence as the Regency
• After initial clashed all combatants are either out of the race (Strephon, Norris) or so exhausted that they can't support "full sized" fleet actions. Around 1122/23 the war turns "black" with burned ground retreats and spoiling raids intenden on destruction and pillaging
• By 1125/25 the situation has "stabilised". All factions have retreated into their "saves", zones that are resembling a well-defended/patrolled version of the 3I and measure at best a sector or two. Those are surrounded by a thin layer of semi-controlled and patrolled worlds that act as a tripwire. Maybe another half-sector in depth. Everything else is "Wilds", a no mans land zone where individual worlds and coalations struggle for survival. This is detailed in the "Hard Times" supplement

Game-mechanic wise MT is a refined and bug-fixed version of CT with relatively minor changes in Chargen. The Universal Task Profile has become standard, character generation integrates the stuff from the add-on books (Scouts etc). Ship construction/vehicle construction is an integrated system with some major changes from CT/HighGuard. Good level of detailing breaking up things like "Bridge" and giving power/fuel consumption to subsystems. It's a bit tricky to get the CT ships done until you learn/know the design tricks but even after some 20 years the system is still solid.

If one wants to play in the MT background it's

• Play the running up to 1116, maybe have the characters try to stop Dulinor. This will be a wide ranging "intrigue" campaign with the players being nobles and/or spys most likely. If they suceed the timeline of GT will become the "real" one
• Play in the "Hard Times" with civilisation slowly collapsing and a new Dark Night looming. This is a "small ship" universe with the big boys long gone and players can make a big difference

 

[mbrinkhues]

Traveller - The New Era

• Based upon the events in MegaTraveller, advances the timeline to 1200
• In 1130 Dulinor makes a final attempt at the Throne. It fails but during fleet actions a superweapon (Called Virus) is released. Since the weapon lacks certain safeties it attacks everyone by infecting computerised equipment and using it in a suicidal way
• Remote parts of the 3I are somewhat less effected due to early warning and some defence methods. Namely the Domain of Deneb, now the "Imperial Regency" survives mostly intact at TL14-16
• The 3I and it's surrounding nations (Aslan, Solomanie, Vagr, KKree, even the Hiver to some degree) basically collapse with Starflight lost for most worlds
• Some pockets of worlds survive due to luck and/or preventive measures and around 1190 slowly begin to expand back into space
• One among those is the Dawn League, later renamed the Reformation Coalation(RC). This is the initial setting for TNE. The DL/RC has help from the Hivers (The race that has weathered Virus "the best" but even they got hurt)
• After an initial failure using somewhat peaceful means the RC uses a more aggressive way of expansion earning them the name "Space Vikings" (Ironically it is fitting since Vikings where trading with everyone - either they sold goods or they sold the other guy depending on the size of the other guys axe )
• The RC is shown as "basically good but with grey spots". It contacts allies (Convenant of Sufren), neutrals (Free Traders) and enemies (Guild, Empire of Solee) and starts to integrate worls both peacefully, through conquest and through liberation (Promise)
• Later in the timeline (As shown in the 1248 books) there is a lot of war but that's not the scope of the GDW version any more.
• An "alternate campaign" based on the Regency/Spinward Marches and it's expansion back into space exist but the GDW material never was completet so you need 1248 to play that

The system is Twilight:2000 V2.2 (D20 based percentile system), the GDW "House" system. The way the system works you can convert characters from MT to the system, there is even a chart for it in the rules. The Chargen is the Twilight "Roll stats, then use careers of your choice" system. IMHO the best CharGen system that GDW ever published and one of the better systems overall. It has some "random" elements (Rolling attributes) but gives the player control in attributes (I.e by specifying a minimum sum of attrib values/allowing to "take 36") and carreers/skills (No random roll for careers or skills but a random roll for "special duties" (Extra skills), promotion and type of contact (foreign/local)

The construction system is a MAYOR departure from the other Traveller-Systems. Even GT is closer to the others than this. Fire/Fusion/Steel is a complet "stand alone" construction set for everything (including cyberware) but it is based more on "reality" than other Travellers. The main thrust engine suddenly needs fuel, lasers and missiles are huge and costly (No tripple lasers, no 50kg space-space missiles) and so on. None of the older ships works 1:1


The TNE background can be played as:

• The RC campaign with the chars either working for the RC or as freelancers. This is a mix between espionage, scouting/recon, diplomatic and heavy assault.
• A Free Trader campaign. This is "Space Gypsies" similar to some novels from C. J. Cherryh

 

[mbrinkhues]

GT

• Assumes an alternate universe where the assasination and civil war does not happen
• Assumes a very "white hat" / "serving nobility" empire setting
• Basically the CT/MgT timeline advanced to 1125

This is the version with the most differences in CharGen and Game system. Even the TL scale is different with Imperial Maximum at GTL 12 (equaling TTL15) due to the underlying system. Still the system is interesting for it's vast, well presented and available background material. Books recommended are

• FarTrader for a deep view into merchant life and economics as well as some nice ships. The trading system feels like "Imperial Economics:101" written by a Bwap but it's the most detailed treatment ever. And even if you skip most it still gives a lot of ideas for trader scenarios
• Starports give an extremly detailed look at Imperial Starports, Customs etc. Depending on your view of the Traveller universe some facts will make you scream (Unbribable port officiers) but generally a good book
• Humanity details many of the true Traveller aliens - the various cultures/minor races of Humanity. From the Genoee "space dwarfs" to the Answerin "Traveller Saurons upon Haven" and then some. No more need for playing a Furry - use a human
• Nobility details the scum of the Empire<<<The dedicated and hard working nobility and the ways they spend the little free time they have.

If you are heavy into "Character gaming" and "More talk than action" GT might be THE system for you due to the extremly flexible Character generation. And the ship construction system allows for real! Space Yachts with all the bells (pool) and whistles (bar)


T20

Again a game system that has little to do with the others. A nice adaption of DnD3.x to a modern system and one that feels a bit more Traveller than GT. The ship/vehicle construction produces results similar to CT/High Guard.

The most interesting piece here is the background material

• Game is set during the Solomanie Rim War, around a century before CT
• Location is the Domain of Gateway, a region that makes the Spinward Marches look well developed and settled.
• The region used is a mix between Imperial territory, client states, independent states and individual planets
• The Empire isn't all that strong here at the best of times. And currently ships get wisked away to the Solomanie front by the squadron
• The Sollies send raiders up to an elder cruiser in size to stop that, support systems and make troubles
• Some of local powers are strong enough to get away with a lot

The Background is useabel with all variants of Traveller and IMHO a nice change from "chasing Grandfather in the Spinward Marches" (Okay, EVERYTHING is)

 

[Foen]

Wow! Really helpful, thanks!

 

[Vargas]

My 0.02 worth . . .

MegaTraveller was indeed a clean up and consolidation of Classic Traveller and for the most part it got it right. However, I think the vehicle/ship design system was overly fiddly. In my personal experience trying to get two people to get the same results when designing the same ship never worked. I simply substituted CT's ships for the ones in MT in my games.

TNE was a radical departure that never felt like Traveller to me. I personally consider Fire, Fusion and Steel to be an abomination and I was an advocate of reaction based M-Drive. YMWV.

I never bothered with T4 or T20. I have some of the GT books and while they appear well done, I don't do GURPS so can't give a realistic assessment.

At this point I've decided to stick with Classic Traveller because I like it, have all of it and don't choose to invest in yet another version.

 

[mbrinkhues]

MgT

The four systems discussed previously are welded to the Traveller background (3I and all) at various places within the established official timeline and didn't try to be something else. This is not the case with Mongosse "Traveller".

Mongosse primarily tries to develop/sell a universal game engine under the Traveller brand and considers the 3I "one in many" background. I admit not to care for the approach but YMMV. What you get systems wise is a mix between MegaTraveller and Classic Traveller:

• A 2D6 Task profile that is universally used and very close to the MT system
• A CharGen that's similar to the MT "advanced" chargen but lacking the (little) user influence MT had (Brownie points). It adds "lifepath" events to flesh out the character(1)
• An "alternate" point-buy system exists but lacks "lifepath" integration and some other elements of the random roll primary system
• Unlike TNE where "one book had all" the MgT system spreads careers through the sourcebooks. It's playabel with the core book that offers decend choice and the add-on careers don't suffer "power creep" but you still need to buy the supplements to play a certain class
• Same for construction systems. Unlike MT where you got the complete system of TNE where you had it all in the FFS-Supplement constructions are spread among base book (Small ships but not subcraft), High Guard (Larger ships, subcraft) and the Vehicle books (Vehicles other that ships). Compared to the MT and TNE systems the construction rules lack detail and are closer to the "lump component" system of CT. So once more you get "bridge" instead of a break up into "Workstation, Displays, Computers...". And the system lacks any way to track power consumption (It has none) as found in most Traveller variants
• Combat is closer to MT that to CT. It is weighted towards characters so a character with a rifle has a chance to take out a light tank. It's also a bit less lethal than CT/MT combat, more like TNE where PC could survive first hit
• Equipment lists are a mixed bag. Some are downright bad (Merc with it's lack of size/weight, unrealistic weapon ranges etc) and some are extremly good (Central Supply, fixing all problems from Merc)
• The Art and presentation is a mixed bag. I like the clean and "technical" presentation (It's a hard SciFi game after all) but dislike the way most of the new versions of the ships look. And the ships art is often to undefined/blurred for me. Again YMMV

Aside from the purely technical aspects above there is the big mine field of colliding views. MgT has a quite different idea what "Traveller" is (A brand name) and this results in many of the books being rather "generic". For a referee that sees Traveller as "the Universe" that means going through quite a few books and rating things in i.e equipment lists as "Availabel", "Scientists Wet Dream" and "Not in my universe"

I won't comment much on the "Universe" specific books since I don't own them (nor plan to use them). MgT sadly wasted time/effort on another version of the Spinward Marches. While a good book (From my 14 days Amazon preview: The Best(2)) using MJD's creative potential to detail a new region (Say Antares/Julian) would have been more useful



(1) Some lifepath charts are a bit too "deadly/damaging" on the character. I.e. "Scouts" has been critizised for that

(2) The book was then "recycled" into a beautiful 1:35 scale Tamiya "Challenger I" thanks to Amazons "Try before Buy" program. Done in BAOR colors and with an Eduard set it's a beauty

 

[atpollard]

Since you are familiar with Classic Traveller, the MegaTraveller game mechanics appear to be Classic Traveller rewritten using the CT Striker rules as a starting point.

Mongoose Traveller uses fairly similar game mechanics to Classic Traveller and MegaTraveller (the setting has some different assumptions) but you can see for yourself by downloading the Traveller SRD (for free) from the Mongoose website and reading the core rules for yourself.

D20 has a free D20-light download that will give you a feel for those rules (which are based on the D20 OGL as you suggested).

 

[spinwardpirate]

GT

• Assumes an alternate universe where the assasination and civil war does not happen
• Assumes a very "white hat" / "serving nobility" empire setting
• Basically the CT/MgT timeline advanced to 1125

That's a nice summation of GURPS 3rd Edition Traveller. I think it is worth mentioning that GURPS 4e Traveller is set during the Interstellar Wars era. For those who may be interested, there is a free pdf set of GURPS Lite rules available here.

 

[mbrinkhues]

Interstellar Wars (ISW)

Forgot that one. Never played it but I do own the rules book (That's all in print, some JTAS etc. stuff exists)

• Set at the very start of the Traveller Timeline
• Information cover the complete Interstellar Wars period from first contact between Terrans and Vilanie to the last days of the Vilanie Empire but not past that
• Uses 4th edition GURPS (Can't compare to the 3rd edition in GT, don't own/use/plan on 4th)
• Ship construction is different to GT and the tables don't cover all that's covered in GT since the ISW timeline tops out at TTL13/GTL10-11
• Designated playing time is during a period of peace between IIRC the fifth and sixed war but material and ideas exist for other times in the war.

The setting is huge covering 200 years and reaching from "Terra the minor world" to "Terra the Mighty". One can play anything from "SG-1 with a Starship" to "Diplomatic Service". Add in the developing rift between Earth and it's colonies and even more possibilities open up

 

[PathfinderAP]

What no T4 coverage mbrinkhues?

Good job so far though,

 

[mbrinkhues]

I only comment/critique stuff I have read or at least given a serious browsing (Say an hour cross-reading it in the FLGS). Never done that with T4 (Never actually SEEN T4, only a few adventures) so can't say much about it.

 

[E.D.Quibell]

D20 has a free D20-light download that will give you a feel for those rules (which are based on the D20 OGL as you suggested).

Is there? Would you be so kind as to post a link please?

Regards,

Ewan

 

[PathfinderAP]

I only comment/critique stuff I have read or at least given a serious browsing (Say an hour cross-reading it in the FLGS).

An hour?, don't they expect you to buy it before then?
I don't know many FLGS that would look kindly at that,

Anyways you are not missing much in T4
Characters looked alot like their CT counterparts in many ways (but with more, new skills) One of the main differences was the system,
a roll under Stat + Skill with x number of dice,
(even had use of a 1D3, :nonono

 

[Sir Brad]

MegaTravller took the "UTP" (Universal Task Profile) that was used in "Revised" (Classic) Travller and made it the Core Rule for the new edition, it updated Character Generation (some parts of the changes worked very well others not so) it also compiled all the Equipment from Classic in to one place.

 

[Foen]

Ooh! What's a Universal Task Profile? I don't remember it from my CT days (but then, it was over a quarter of a century ago...).

Foen

 

[mbrinkhues]

An hour?, don't they expect you to buy it before then?
I don't know many FLGS that would look kindly at that,

I was what the shop owners considered a good customer(1). It took me quite some while to decide but I rarely left the shop without stuff, I returned regularly and back then I ran the occasional demo game for them too. Add in that in two cases the shop owner and me played in the same group(s) and there's a bit leeway. And I didn't abuse it, taking good care of the book etc.

So I guess it's a combination of factors that allowed me to look through "not sure" supplements (or new system core books) in some detail.


(1) Shortly after I relocated due to job reasons one of the shops closed....

 

[PathfinderAP]

Yeah well I had a friend who worked in one of my FLGS (also shut down)
And while I did spend alot of time there I still wouldn't have read a single book for an hour, that would like treating the place as a public library,

I can tell within two minutes whether a book is worth picking up or not,
so I'm lucky,

Now if there was only a way to do that online.....Anima, lookin at yoooz

 

[aramis]

CT -

• Setting: 1100-1115
• CGen:
  Basic: 1 skill per term, 1 per promo, 1 for commission, 1 for 1st term. 2 per term for scouts.
  Advanced: 1 skill per year if skill roll made, up to 6 per year in schools.
• Skills: fairly broad except for weapons which are fairly narrow
• Tasks: no consistent system. Majority of skills resolved with 2d6 throws roll high
• Combat:
  • To Hit: 2d6+skill±1 from stat +Range Mod+Target Armor Mod for 8+
  • Movement: linear bands
  • Damage: on hit Direct to stats by weapon
• Ship Design:
  Bk2: Lettered drives, max size 5000Td, 2 axis: price, Tonnage
  Bk5: percentage drives, no max size but implied limit of 1000000Td, 3 axis: Price, Tonnage, Power
• Ship Combat:
  Bk2: minis/counters on table, newtonian movement, cumulative hits
  Bk5: abstract bands, critical based.
• Tech Levels: 1-15

MT -

• Setting: 1115-1135
• CGen:
  Basic: 1 skill per term, 1 per promo, 1 for commission, 1 for 1st term, 1 for special duty, 1 for making comm, promo, or spl duty by 4+. Scouts 2 per term, 1 for special duty, 1 for making spl duty by 4+.
  Advanced: 1 skill per year if skill roll made, up to 6 per year in schools.
• skills: Fairly broad, longer list than CT, more cascade skills
• Tasks: 2d6+A+B roll high vs TN+ by difficulty (3/7/11/15/19) and 3d6-A-B x increment for time; A and B can be Stat/5 or a skill level
• Combat:
  • To Hit: task based by range
  • Movement: square grid
  • Damage: amount skill made by and ratio of penetration to armor value modifies weapon Damage in DP; after combat DP resolved to dice damage to stats.
• Ship Design: 4 axis (Power, Mass, Volume, Price) derived from striker
• Ship Combat: square grid non-newtonian. Critical Hits. Revision of CT bk5 to use tasks.
• Tech Levels: 1-21

TNE -

• Setting: 1200-
• CGen:
  1-4 skills per term, +1 per promotion, +1 per commission, +1 per special duty
• skills: medium breadth, longer list than CT, more cascade skills (called clusters) and grouped skills (called cascades) where others in group are 1/2 best automatically.. skills linked to specific stats.
• Tasks: 1d20 roll low vs (Stat + Skill)x difficulty (1/4, 1/2, 1, 2, 4)
• Combat:
  • To Hit: task based by range
  • Movement: square grid
  • Damage: dice of weapon modified for penetration vs armor, applied to location hit points
• Ship Design: 5 axis (Power, Mass, Volume, Price, surface area) derived from MT; not in core rules
• Ship Combat: gridless newtonian. System Hits.
  Brilliant lances is alternate combat system; adds hex grid and details to core book combat.
• Tech Levels: 1-21

T4

• Setting: IY 0-60
• CGen:
  1 skills per year, +1 per promotion, +1 per commission, +1 per special duty; +1 skill per 2 years if service has no commission/promotion.
• skills: medium breadth, longer list than CT, more cascade skills (called clusters) and grouped skills (called cascades) where others in group are 1/2 best automatically.
• Tasks: (Difficuty)d6 roll low vs (Stat + Skill)
• Combat:
  • To Hit: task based by range
  • Movement: square grid
  • Damage: dice of weapon reduced for armor, applied to attributes
• Ship Design: 5 axis (Power, Mass, Volume, Price, surface area) derived from TNE; expanded version outside core book
• Ship Combat: gridless newtonian. System Hits.
• Tech Levels: 1-12 in core book; 1-21 in FF&S.

T5 -
same as t4 except for ships and TL's from what little I've seen

MGT

• Setting: 1100-1115
• CGen:
  1 skills per term, +1 per promotion, +0-2 per event
• skills: medium breadth, longer list than CT, more cascade skills and grouped skills where others in group are 1/2 best automatically.
• Tasks: 2d6+StatMod+skill+DifficultyMod vs 8+
• Combat:
  • To Hit: task based by range
  • Movement: square grid
  • Damage: dice of weapon, armor reduces roll total, applied to attributes
• Ship Design:
  Core Book: 2.5 axis (Price, Td; power is half-axis), lettered drives
  Bk 2 HG: 2.5 axis.
  Power note: no power points, but rating of plant limits weapons fit
• Ship Combat: gridless newtonian. System Hits.
• Tech Levels: 1-16 in core book

 

[aramis]

MegaTravller took the "UTP" (Universal Task Profile) that was used in "Revised" (Classic) Travller and made it the Core Rule for the new edition, it updated Character Generation (some parts of the changes worked very well others not so) it also compiled all the Equipment from Classic in to one place.

Ooh! What's a Universal Task Profile? I don't remember it from my CT days (but then, it was over a quarter of a century ago...).

Foen

The UTP does not appear in CT at all; it appears in DGP materials for CT.

Task Identity
Difficulty, Component A, Component B, Time Increment, flags
Notes
​

Difficulty (provides TN)

• Simple (3+)
• Routine (7+)
• Difficult (11+)
• Formidable (15+)
• Impossible (19+)

Component A or B are either:
• Stat name (providing a DM+ Stat/5 )
• skill name (providing a DM+ level, -4 if unskilled)
DM limit of sum(A+B) is +8; excess is lost.
Time increment is 1/10 the expected time to complete
Flags:

• Unskilled OK (DM-0 if unskilled)
• Safe (no fumbles)
• Hazardous (all fumbles roll an extra die on mishaps)
• absolute (time increment is time taken; no time roll)
• fateful (all failures fumbles, no retries)

Roll 2d6 +A+B for TN+ for success AND roll (3d6-A-B)xTimeIncrement for time.
If fail by more than 2, or roll natural 2 fumble for 2d mishap. If both, 3d mishap. If hazardous, roll an extra die.
3+ is superficial mishap
7+ is minor mishap
11+ is major mishap
15+ is destroyed mishap

It was used by DGP in their CT supplements, later in GDW's 2300 and MT.
2300 makes 1 change: 1d10 instead of 2d6 for success.