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Traveller map just went down. (20 Jan 2013)

To follow up on that last bit, if you had a page like this:

Code: 
<!DOCTYPE html>
<form method="post" action="http://travellermap.com/api/poster">
<textarea name="data">
Hex  Name                 UWP       Remarks                     {Ix}   (Ex)    [Cx]   N     B Z PBG W  A  Stellar       
---- -------------------- --------- --------------------------- ------ ------- ------ ----- - - --- -- -- --------------
0101 Zeycude              C430698-9 De Na Ni Po                 { -1 } (C53-1) [6559] -     - - 613 8  Zh K9 V          
0102 Reno                 C4207B9-A De He Na Po Pi              { 1 }  (C6A+1) [886B] -     - - 603 12 Zh G8 V M1 V     
0103 Errere               B563664-B Ni Ri O:0304                { 2 }  (956+2) [4839] -     Z - 910 9  Zh M1 V M4 V     
...
</textarea></form>
<script>document.querySelector('form').submit()</script>

... then as soon as a browser loads that page it will reload with a rendering of that sector data.
 
inexorabletash said:
If you can host an arbitrary web page you can strip down post.htm so that your page is just a tiny wrapper around the SEC data.
Click to expand...

I can host any web page I want, but I don't understand the part "strip down post.htm" - could you explain what you mean there, please?


EDIT: Wow, that was fast! Thanks! :D
 
Doesn't seem to work for loading up more than one sector, is there a way to do that or will I need to just do one sector at a time and paste them together in GIMP?
 
If you're going to paste them together, just use the form and skip the HTML editing.

I wasn't sure if you wanted an easily updated site with links to sector images, or a way to generate them.
 
inexorabletash said:
To follow up on that last bit, if you had a page like this:

... then as soon as a browser loads that page it will reload with a rendering of that sector data.
Click to expand...

Yes, And Mediawiki (and by extension the Traveller Wiki) has an HTML sanitizer that lets through the formatting elements (span, div, table, sup, etc.) but not the ones that do interesting thing (like form and script) for probably really obvious reasons.
 
inexorabletash said:
If you're going to paste them together, just use the form and skip the HTML editing.

I wasn't sure if you wanted an easily updated site with links to sector images, or a way to generate them.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what I can do.

I would love to have Travellermap functionality for all of my backdated sector data (two sectors) and be able to zoom and pan and everything just like in Travellermap.

What I seem to be able to do is post one sector at a time, and get back a full sector map in poster format.

So if I want the players to be able to see placements across the sector border, then it seems to me I will need to paste the two sectors together, since otherwise they can't pan across the border to see what systems are near to what other systems across the sector border.

Am I missing something here? I would love to make it work better than that, but that seems to be the best I am able to do - and still much better than trying to make my own maps to look as good as the ones from your site.
 
inexorabletash said:
To follow up on that last bit, if you had a page like this:

Code: 
<!DOCTYPE html>
<form method="post" action="http://travellermap.com/api/poster">
<textarea name="data">
Hex  Name                 UWP       Remarks                     {Ix}   (Ex)    [Cx]   N     B Z PBG W  A  Stellar       
---- -------------------- --------- --------------------------- ------ ------- ------ ----- - - --- -- -- --------------
0101 Zeycude              C430698-9 De Na Ni Po                 { -1 } (C53-1) [6559] -     - - 613 8  Zh K9 V          
0102 Reno                 C4207B9-A De He Na Po Pi              { 1 }  (C6A+1) [886B] -     - - 603 12 Zh G8 V M1 V     
0103 Errere               B563664-B Ni Ri O:0304                { 2 }  (956+2) [4839] -     Z - 910 9  Zh M1 V M4 V     
...
</textarea></form>
<script>document.querySelector('form').submit()</script>

... then as soon as a browser loads that page it will reload with a rendering of that sector data.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the great example. That helps a lot. I'm toying with the idea of writing a T5 subsector builder app using Xojo and it was really easy to put together a simple test app with an HTMLViewer class that when you push a button it takes the string contents of a TextArea and loads that as a page. Really only 2 lines of code (although I did put in a few more lines to hide the HTMLViewer until the page finishes loading because there's a weird little table that appears for a split second before the image).

I also figured out from the API documentation that if I modify the URL in the example to:

"http://travellermap.com/api/poster?subsector=A"

then I get my nice subsector map. Cool.
 
SpaceBadger said:
I'm not sure what I can do.
Click to expand...

"It's just software - anything is possible." - seen on a bumper sticker.

SpaceBadger said:
What I seem to be able to do...
Click to expand...

Aye, there's the rub.

SpaceBadger said:
So if I want the players to be able to see placements across the sector border, then it seems to me I will need to paste the two sectors together, since otherwise they can't pan across the border to see what systems are near to what other systems across the sector border.
Click to expand...

Yes, that's a limitation of the site with user data. The site can render arbitrary chunks of space, but that doesn't work with user data. Only sector/subsector/jumpmaps can be rendered with user data. I don't have any better suggestions that don't involve me writing a bunch of new code, other than just sticking the images side by side and ignoring the gap.
 
agorski said:
there's a weird little table that appears for a split second before the image)
Click to expand...

That's actually the TEXTAREA element showing up. You could hide it by adding style="display: none" to the FORM element.

agorski said:
I also figured out from the API documentation that if I modify the URL in the example to:

"http://travellermap.com/api/poster?subsector=A"

then I get my nice subsector map. Cool.
Click to expand...

There's also an option that gives you subsector-style numbering (i.e. every subsector has hexes 0101 ... 0810 regardless of which subsector) if that floats your boat.
 
inexorabletash said:
That's actually the TEXTAREA element showing up. You could hide it by adding style="display: none" to the FORM element.
Click to expand...
Interesting. I don't think that one's in the API documentation.


inexorabletash said:
There's also an option that gives you subsector-style numbering (i.e. every subsector has hexes 0101 ... 0810 regardless of which subsector) if that floats your boat.
Click to expand...
Yes, I saw that one. If I stick with subsector A then the numbering systems are the same, but it might be good to be explicit about these things.

Thanks!
 
I've got the map working like the example you gave in Post #41 above.

Now I'm trying out adding some metadata, per instructions on your Post info page. I've got a simple Route displaying just fine, but I'd like to have the subsector names showing in the background, and I've added the subsector names in the same format that I see in your metadata example, but they aren't displaying on the map.

Here is the metadata portion of my htm page:

Code: 
<textarea name="metadata">
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<Sector Abbreviation="Reav" xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance">
<X>-2</X>
<Y>2</Y>
<Name>Riftrim Deep</Name>
<Name>Reaver's Deep</Name>
<Name>Reavers' Deep</Name>
<Name>Reavers Deep</Name>
<Name Lang="as">Aeitle Sakh</Name>
<Subsectors>
<Subsector Index="A">Farift</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="B">Riftdeep</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="C">Riftrim</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="D">Gulf</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="E">Hryaroaa</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="F">Scotian Deep</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="G">Caledon</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="H">Nightrim</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="I">Keiar</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="J">Ea</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="K">Drexilthar</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="L">Urlaqqash</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="M">Uhtaa</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="N">Eakoi</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="O">Drinsaar</Subsector>
<Subsector Index="P">Fahlnar</Subsector>
</Subsectors>
<Routes>
<Route Start="3125" End="3223" Allegiance="Na" Color="LightGreen" />
</Routes>
</Sector>
</textarea></form>
<script>document.querySelector('form').submit()</script>

Is there something else I need to put in the metadata, or some option I need to set, to get the subsector names shown in the background as you have them on Travellermap?

Thanks for all your help! :)


EDIT: Also have a little test Border working now, so it appears all I am lacking is the background subsector names.

EDIT 2: It appears that I need the "&options=887" to make the subsector names appear, but @#*% Internet Explorer nor Chrome will let me view it that way, blocking the page "for my own protection" to "prevent cross-site scripting". GRRR! :mad: :mad: :mad:

I made it all work through your Post page, but the bleeping browsers won't let me do it the way you suggested above.

At least I can get the maps I want now, just not as easily thanks to bleeping over-protective IE and Chrome.



*
 
Last edited:
Try &options - ampersands need encoding in attributes (and everywhere except script tags and a few other obscure places)

Not sure that's the problem, but we'll get it figured out.
 
SpaceBadger said:
EDIT 2: It appears that I need the "&options=887" to make the subsector names appear, but @#*% Internet Explorer nor Chrome will let me view it that way, blocking the page "for my own protection" to "prevent cross-site scripting". GRRR! :mad: :mad: :mad:

I made it all work through your Post page, but the bleeping browsers won't let me do it the way you suggested above.

At least I can get the maps I want now, just not as easily thanks to bleeping over-protective IE and Chrome.
Click to expand...

Change to Firefox.
 
This is working for me:

Code: 
<!DOCTYPE html>
<form method="post" action="http://travellermap.com/api/poster?options=887">
<textarea name="data">
...
</textarea>
<textarea name="metadata">
...
</textarea></form>
<script>document.querySelector('form').submit()</script>

In URLs from HTML forms, the ? separates the location from the "query", and & separates the different key/value pairs in the query.

As an aside, I slipped MSEC support in there if the XML is not to your taste. Not every MSEC feature is supported yet, though.
 
inexorabletash said:
This is working for me:

Code: 
<!DOCTYPE html>
<form method="post" action="http://travellermap.com/api/poster?options=887">
<textarea name="data">
...
</textarea>
<textarea name="metadata">
...
</textarea></form>
<script>document.querySelector('form').submit()</script>

In URLs from HTML forms, the ? separates the location from the "query", and & separates the different key/value pairs in the query.

As an aside, I slipped MSEC support in there if the XML is not to your taste. Not every MSEC feature is supported yet, though.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I will try that later - working right now on testing/fixing/confirming sector data and placing more routes in the metadata XML.


EDIT: Works like a charm! Nice borders, routes, subsector titles - very Ritzy! Thanks, inexorabletash! :)

EDIT 2: Oh, decision, decisions! I discovered that if I make scale=128 I get UWPs for each system - but then I don't get subsector titles! Now to decide which I will choose, UWPs or subsector titles... :cool:
 
Last edited:
If any of you want to see the first results of all this for my SBRD campaign, I made a Maps page in my blog. The maps would not look nearly as nice without the work of inexorabletash in making Travellermap available to all for posting custom map data. Thank you once again, inexorabletash! :)

Now, I could swear I've seen somewhere in the documentation at Travellermap a method for making trade maps, getting the trade codes for each system to show instead of UWPs at the 128 scale. Now I can't find it. Did I just imagine this, or am I simply looking in the wrong places?
 
SpaceBadger said:
Now, I could swear I've seen somewhere in the documentation at Travellermap a method for making trade maps, getting the trade codes for each system to show instead of UWPs at the 128 scale. Now I can't find it. Did I just imagine this, or am I simply looking in the wrong places?
Click to expand...

Imagined it, sorry. No intrinsic trade route support but obviously you can use a route for anything and with MSEC support I think there are tools to generate them?

As far as trade code display - what is shown at > 64 pixels/parsec is not a done deal but I haven't added anything beyond the UWP yet. Suggestions/mockups welcome!
 
Opinions wanted: Tagging content as Official / Unofficial

I'm starting to get a slow but steady stream of feedback in various forms that highlights an issue: TravellerMap.com is being treated as an authoritative site for the OTU, yet it presents a mix of official and unofficial data and doesn't clearly deliniate between the two.

When I started the site (2005) there had been a lull in Traveller. I believe Marc was just getting FFE together. There was no official data available in digital form. Online data sets blended data from CT/MT /TNE/T4 supplements, GEnie and other semi-official uploads, edits and additions by individuals and groups such as HIWG, and various large and small efforts to fill in the gaps, some intricately detailed and some large swaths of random die rolls. I completely admit that I went for "quantity" over "quality" since having a universe to zoom and pan around in was fun!

Now we have an official data set (the Traveller 5 Second Survey) and I'm honored to be able to host it on the site. It's blended rather seamlessly with unofficial data, and that leads to unfortunate confusion. Folks will ping Marc asking questions about sector data that's unvetted submissions of dubious ancestry.

IMHO, it's pretty high priority for the site to make some distinction here, but I'm not sure what approach to take. Here are some ideas:

  • Take advantage of the "credits" at the bottom, and highlight "official" data more clearly with an indicator/graphic of some sort.
  • Contrariwise, assume "official" is the default; highlight "unofficial" data
  • Both of the above - always clearly show the provenance of the current focus
  • Offer an option to filter unofficial data e.g. another checkbox on the side that would not even render unofficial sectors on the map.
  • As above but have the option enabled by default (i.e. make unofficial data "opt in")
  • Alter the rendering for "unofficial" regions - e.g. shaded background, dim everything slightly, etc.

These all have trade-offs between being too subtle or two imposing. I posit that as primarily an entertainment resource, most users enjoy seeing the "gaps" filled in, and it's only "serious researchers" who want to filter out anything unofficial. Of course, the credits and associated documents already highlight the sources of the data so I may be trying to optimize for a small set of users who are taking the site as authoritative but not actually reading the manual, which might be a waste of time.

On the other hand, I think it's a disservice to Marc and others if the hard work of the T5SS is lumped in with some randomly generated cruft I scraped off the web. On the third hand, many of the unofficial submissions have been labors of love and I'm just as honored to host them in all their unofficial glory, with both the authors and myself knowing full well they may get paved over at any point.

Relevant stats: not counting the Zho Core Route, there are 154 sectors with data, 30 of which have "official" data.

My gut reaction at this point is to do something quick and cutesy like have == AMBER ZONE: UNOFFICIAL DATA == appear in the credits area that links to an explanation of the site's combination of official + unofficial data. I don't know if that's too subtle or too obnoxious. I'm also working to get some more obvious "official" / "unofficial" tag into the data returned by various APIs.

I welcome any thoughts and ideas for how to address this issue.

(NOTE: I also posted this to http://travellermap.blogspot.com/2013/09/highlighting-official-vs-unofficial-data.html but this is the most active locus for discussion at the moment, so I figured I'd get plenty of feedback here.)
 
Last edited:
Firstly, thanks for all you that you do for the Traveller community.

I think the idea of putting a tag in the Credits is fine, and probably the easiest for you to implement.

The other ideas are also OK, but will cause you a ton of work and probably have unintended consequences. Please don't break the HTTP POST thing, I'm writing an app around that service right now. ;)
 
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