SUNDOG class : 100 ton Vehicular Scout

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

I don't know if anyone remembers a little Travelleresque computer game from about 20 years ago called SUNDOG. You play a guy who's late uncle left you a ship (The Sundog) and you now have to seek your fortune while trying to find out what happened to him. Anyway, I was thinking about it today and was remembering the ship was a novel approach so I present it here for your enjoyment. I don't have the full write-up for it yet, but it's coming...along with a few pics I've done

The Sundog class scout is similar to the standard Scout/Courier in range and performance, but what makes it unique is the vessel is a two part ship. Half of the ship is essentially a cradle containing the drives and powerplant, flight avionics, life support and fuel for the jump drive. Carried in the cradle is a special 50 ton tracked ATV which houses the crew quarters, bridge, cargo, hardpoint, and fuel reserves for the powerplant and maneuver drives. In space, both sections are mated by airlocks and the hull of the ATV contains the necessary jump field meshes. It is for all purposes a 100 ton starship. The turret on a standard ATV carries ship-classed weapons so even in space combat it's comperable to the Scout-courier.

Upon landing the center section uncouples from the streamlined drive cradle, and now performs as a fully functional ATV, albeit one much larger than the standard models.

ATVs are already pressurized for vaccuum and therefore able to go anywhere small craft can go so this design isn't so far-fetched. You could think of it as rather than an ATV spacecraft the center module is a 50 ton Cutter with treads

Regardless the 100 ton Sundog class is the scout's attempt to refute the statement 'You can't take it with you'.

Thoughts?

 

[Moxie]

Wow, that's a wonderful idea. I am just now getting back into the Traveller world, but I have never heard of anyone adapting that ship. I had Sundog for the old Apple ][ back in the day.

BTW, your age is showing.

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Hehe...cool

I'm thrilled someone knows what I'm talking about so I don't care if it let's people know I'm in my 30s

I still have my Apple IIc btw.....ok, it's in a drawer, but I still have it

 

[Father Fletch]

Love the Idea, and I would love to see someone do this! Really makes for a neat concept for adventuring groups. That would be one big-ass ATV BTW!

 

[far-trader]

Originally posted by N.I.C.E. Labs:
Hehe...cool

I'm thrilled someone knows what I'm talking about so I don't care if it let's people know I'm in my 30s

I still have my Apple IIc btw.....ok, it's in a drawer, but I still have it

Yeah I remember it too, it was a fun little game. I also thought about creating it for Traveller but one thing and another never got around to it. I wonder if I can still find the game. Pack-rat that I am it may be here, finding it though...

Hmm, unless I sold it with my IIc a couple years back.

I'll have to check. Or would you still have it and be able to post the general layout? BTW if you're still using a Mac you needn't dig out the IIc, there are emulators (of course you probably knew that).

 

[manley_t]

hmmm...

I seem to remember a winnebago and a crewman named Woof.....

"Your schwartz is bigger than mine"

 

[bozzutoman]

N.I.C.E. Labs:

Are you talking about this SUNDOG?

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Originally posted by bozzutoman:
N.I.C.E. Labs:

Are you talking about this SUNDOG?

I am stunned and amazed

That's it!

I may indeed have to grab a IIc emulator and mess with that again. As you can see from that site the configuration I'm talking about. Would be a very useful ship. I'll have a write up for it ready for posting in the coming days.

 

[Tanuki]

I have my doubts on this one. It sounds cool, but I think something this big is really impracticle as a tracked vehicle.

The largest armored vehicle ever attempted was the German Maus which comes out to about 8.5 dtons (see http://www.panzerworld.net/Maus.htm ). They had real problems with it and it was finally abandoned so that the resources could be used for more practical things.

Do any of you have any idea just how big 50 dtons is? I was working up real world vehicle sizes awhile back. I'll have to check my figures but I belive that a Kenworth tractor (the truck part of an 18-wheeler) would occupy a 4 dton box. Try to imagine a vehicle built out of 12 of those things strapped together. It would NOT be pretty.

Land leviathons may be cool fantasy but they don't work very well in the real world.

 

[themink]

Originally posted by Tanuki:
I have my doubts on this one. It sounds cool, but I think something this big is really impracticle as a tracked vehicle.

The largest armored vehicle ever attempted was the German Maus which comes out to about 8.5 dtons (see http://www.panzerworld.net/Maus.htm ). They had real problems with it and it was finally abandoned so that the resources could be used for more practical things.

Do any of you have any idea just how big 50 dtons is? I was working up real world vehicle sizes awhile back. I'll have to check my figures but I belive that a Kenworth tractor (the truck part of an 18-wheeler) would occupy a 4 dton box. Try to imagine a vehicle built out of 12 of those things strapped together. It would NOT be pretty.

Land leviathons may be cool fantasy but they don't work very well in the real world.

Remember the tracked vehicle that carries the shuttle arround on it's back - "one big mother"

There is a very cute articulated truck in the Northern territories australia (home of the big rigs) which tows 7 trailers. In fact there are a pair of them and they a 'kin Uge. I would put them at roughly 25dT. It has so many wheels on the tar that the ground pressure is pretty good and you can use it on sand fairly well.

If you slap a bit of grav support so the entire thing weighs a fraction of it's mass, then I don't see any serious engineering problems.

 

[far-trader]

Or how about this for a real world (and not the biggest by far) vehicle that fits pretty good for size and capacity.

Image courtesy of:

David Pearson Heavy Duty Truck Collection
You may download any image for personal or non-commercial use only.

Heck it even has about the right dimensions and layout. Just imagine the wheels are covered and the dump bed is replaced with the cargo hold(s).

 

[Tanuki]

Originally posted by far-trader:
Or how about this for a real world (and not the biggest by far) vehicle that fits pretty good for size and capacity.

http://www.hankstruckpictures.com/pix/trucks/dpearson/lehigh_coal_and_navigation_eucild.jpg

Heck it even has about the right dimensions and layout. Just imagine the wheels are covered and the dump bed is replaced with the cargo hold(s).

We have those out here in Utah (Kennecott copper mine). The bed will carry 9.45 dtons. Assuming that is not counting stuff piled up above the dump bucket, the entire vehicle is probably something on the order of 20 dtons and about half of that is power, suspension, and wheels (can anyone find actual dimensions for the thing?).

How much dtonnage is allocated for that stuff in the Sundog? I'll bet going to grav modules instead of tracks/wheels would be a LOT more efficient use of displacement.

 

[ArchTangent]

My grandfather used to be a mechanic at a coal mine where they used those things. He says they were nice to work on since you didn't have to take the wheels off to service the brakes.

Then there was they day that the boss parked his new pickup truck in a stupid place and somebody backed over it in one of those giant dumptrucks.

 

[manley_t]

Originally posted by Tanuki:

Originally posted by far-trader:
[qb]..... I'll bet going to grav modules instead of tracks/wheels would be a LOT more efficient use of displacement.

Grav power on 50dt would be pretty huge. Have you guys done a work-up yet? I was thinking about this the other day and just thought it impractical. It would be safer-easier to just have an ATV that is docked.

What about coupling the two parts together? On land all it would take would be a shifting and you'd be hard pressed to line everything up. If this were a lander and it docked in this fashion, at least in space it's easier to line up and lock.

.....just a thought

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Ok...well, first thing is this isn't the Real World so I think we can have some lattitue here. The basic ATV in the CT book 3 is 10 tons....this version is a special vehicle five times bigger, true but it's designed to be, and it's also built by Traveller standards...not ours. Remember the Maus wasn't an ATV...it was a tank. There's a big difference. After you get rid off the dozens of tons of armor what you have left over isn't much. Also if the Maus was anything like the tigers or other German super-heavy tanks they made them bigger and nastier, but still used the engines from their smaller tanks so they had problems. This ATV could take care of that problem. Since it's not just an ATV, but half a starship an option could have the Powerplant on the ATV portion. A starship grade powerplant driving those treads should have no problems at all.

There's precidence in Traveller for tracked vehicles easily that big. Besides the Megatraveller and higher vehicles put out by Digest and the like, one that comes to mind is the Amber zone "Loggerhead" If memory serves that was nearly 100 tons. I also chose tracked because it can go nearly everywhere (besides the fact that's what they used in the computer game ^_^). What about the places where the winds are too bad or there's magnetic or radiation interferance that keeps grav stuff from flying about or working at all? Of course there's nothing to say that it can't have Grav-assist on it...that's been used in CT as well.

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Originally posted by Big Tim:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Tanuki:

Originally posted by far-trader:
[qb]..... I'll bet going to grav modules instead of tracks/wheels would be a LOT more efficient use of displacement.

Grav power on 50dt would be pretty huge. Have you guys done a work-up yet? I was thinking about this the other day and just thought it impractical. It would be safer-easier to just have an ATV that is docked.

What about coupling the two parts together? On land all it would take would be a shifting and you'd be hard pressed to line everything up. If this were a lander and it docked in this fashion, at least in space it's easier to line up and lock.

.....just a thought</font>

Not so huge if you remember a cutter is 50 tons too. It does just fine. You could think of this as a tracked version of the cutter. As for coupling I was invisioning sighting lasers on the front and sides of the ATV. line up the two in front with the cradle recepticles then drive forward. When the one on the side lines up it automatically couples. The ATV could also have 'parking gravitics' to help it maneuver for the purposes of docking.

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Ok...I tend to do my work backwards in the way of designing things. I'm still working on getting the numbers right, but I've made pics of the craft. Whatcha think?

 

[Liam Devlin]

way cool NICE LABS! I can see the idea has merit! A streamlined Modular ship for Scouting. Demmed if I want to try the deck plans tho! I leave that to better than I!

"Suetki" as the Japanese say (cool/beautiful)!

 

[Tanuki]

Originally posted by Liam Devlin:
[QB"Suetki" as the Japanese say (cool/beautiful)![/QB]

Typo there, I think -- you mean "suteki" (pronounced s-teh-kee).

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Well, what ever the spelling and pronunciation, I sincerely appreciate the compliment

Most thanks!