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Some basic skill questions

mxyzplk

SOC-2
Hey guys! Just got T20 and went through it, and while I was generating my first character I ran into a bunch of questions. I'm pretty d20-savvy, but some things were a bit unclear.

Trained skills. Do you have to spend a skill point to get these at Rank 0? Or do you only get them at Rank 0 through character-generation stuff (Homeworld bonuses etc), and if you buy them in play 1 skill point gets you a rank of 1?

Prior History and multiclassing. I start out a character as a Belter and after their first tour as a Belter they go to University, and get 3000 XP. Do you only have the option to go up in Belter level? Most other classes aren't available to multiclass into easily except Traveller, I guess, and it doesn't make a lot of sense to get Traveller levels in college.

The example character Kaane - either there's some rules I'm missing or it's riddled with errors. A human rogue with a 9 INT should start out with 16 skill points and then gain 3 per level. Best as I can tell Kaane starts with 14 and gains 4 at L2 and 6 at L3... I can't make him come out the way he's printed and the Errata claims that his weight's the only thing wrong.

Navigation vs. Astrogation - when do you use either? It doesn't help that the Navigation skill description mentions starships, but also mentions land and sea (but not air). Which do you use for aerial navigation? Local system navigation?

Just a couple initial issues...

Thanks,

Ernest
 
Lo mxyzplk (aka Ernest),

Welcome to the T20 and the Traveller Universe. I might be able to clear-up one item or at least part of the item:

Navigation & Astrogation:
Navigation is the basic skill which allows one to find the vessels location or chart a course on land/sea/underwater/air/space.

Astrogation is the advanced skill used primarily for getting a starship from star system to star system. Traveling from or to, in Traveller's case, the jump point Navigation comes into play.

A Navigator could probably plot a Jump course, but at a disadvantage if not using a computer.

Also, you might want to put this on the errata board to include air in the discription for Navigation.

Originally posted by mxyzplk:
Hey guys! Just got T20 and went through it, and while I was generating my first character I ran into a bunch of questions. I'm pretty d20-savvy, but some things were a bit unclear.

Trained skills. Do you have to spend a skill point to get these at Rank 0? Or do you only get them at Rank 0 through character-generation stuff (Homeworld bonuses etc), and if you buy them in play 1 skill point gets you a rank of 1?

Prior History and multiclassing. I start out a character as a Belter and after their first tour as a Belter they go to University, and get 3000 XP. Do you only have the option to go up in Belter level? Most other classes aren't available to multiclass into easily except Traveller, I guess, and it doesn't make a lot of sense to get Traveller levels in college.

The example character Kaane - either there's some rules I'm missing or it's riddled with errors. A human rogue with a 9 INT should start out with 16 skill points and then gain 3 per level. Best as I can tell Kaane starts with 14 and gains 4 at L2 and 6 at L3... I can't make him come out the way he's printed and the Errata claims that his weight's the only thing wrong.

Navigation vs. Astrogation - when do you use either? It doesn't help that the Navigation skill description mentions starships, but also mentions land and sea (but not air). Which do you use for aerial navigation? Local system navigation?

Just a couple initial issues...

Thanks,

Ernest
 
Originally posted by mxyzplk:
Hey guys! Just got T20 and went through it, and while I was generating my first character I ran into a bunch of questions. I'm pretty d20-savvy, but some things were a bit unclear.

Trained skills. Do you have to spend a skill point to get these at Rank 0? Or do you only get them at Rank 0 through character-generation stuff (Homeworld bonuses etc), and if you buy them in play 1 skill point gets you a rank of 1?

Prior History and multiclassing. I start out a character as a Belter and after their first tour as a Belter they go to University, and get 3000 XP. Do you only have the option to go up in Belter level? Most other classes aren't available to multiclass into easily except Traveller, I guess, and it doesn't make a lot of sense to get Traveller levels in college.

The example character Kaane - either there's some rules I'm missing or it's riddled with errors. A human rogue with a 9 INT should start out with 16 skill points and then gain 3 per level. Best as I can tell Kaane starts with 14 and gains 4 at L2 and 6 at L3... I can't make him come out the way he's printed and the Errata claims that his weight's the only thing wrong.

Navigation vs. Astrogation - when do you use either? It doesn't help that the Navigation skill description mentions starships, but also mentions land and sea (but not air). Which do you use for aerial navigation? Local system navigation?

Just a couple initial issues...

Thanks,

Ernest
Hello
I try one at a time.
Trained skills can only be used after you have bought the first point apart from that they are the same as normal skills, Home world skills (0 points) can be used like untrained skills but only with the stat bonus until you bye points.

Same problem most people have pryor history isnt class relaited its skill relaited, If after five terms of pryor history you are seventh level you can spend those seven levels how you like though if you had pryor history in Belter,Marine and Scouts then you should probably have at least one level in each of them.
You could have been a doctor in the Marines so you could spend exsperience on Proffesional but you would still have had to do basic training so one level in Marine. So on the example above one level in Marine,Belter and scouts leaving four levels for anything else you fancy you just have to have a story of why you did it (ie 1 level in army during the uni time you joind the campus militia) Basicaly any class you like within reason.

I Didnt get Kanne either.

Navigation involves large dirt ball your standing on.
Astrogation involves dogging the same dirt balls.
Navigation = Planetary navigation.
Astrogation = going to and coming from planets (space navigation).
In atmosphere i would use Navigation out of atmosphere Astrogation.
Yes i use Navigation to land and take of from a planet whilst in atmosphere but Astrogation after leaving atmosphere (asteroids = astrogation, airless planets = navigation.
Hope this helps, sorry about the long windedness of it but i explane poorly,spellings bad and what punctuation.
BYE.
 
Hi,

MJD has answered in other posts/threads that you can pretty much spend XPs earned from University on any class you want, except Barbarian, AFAICR.

Obviously, you need to come up with a believable story for how they are being spent.

So for instance, Academic and Professional are self-explanatory. Traveller? You could have been studying (xeno-)anthropology, archaeology, etc. Rogue - hmm - maybe you skipped a lot of lectures :p

The 'service' classes, either you went to OTC, or received a leave of absence to go to college...

Hope this helps,

Anton
 
Originally posted by mxyzplk:
The example character Kaane - either there's some rules I'm missing or it's riddled with errors. A human rogue with a 9 INT should start out with 16 skill points and then gain 3 per level. Best as I can tell Kaane starts with 14 and gains 4 at L2 and 6 at L3... I can't make him come out the way he's printed and the Errata claims that his weight's the only thing wrong.

Thanks,

Ernest
Well, I wrote Kaane for the playtest, he is my character. The example is hindered by the D20 licence requirement of not being able to explain how to apply experince points. Here's the complete version:

Name: Kaane Haamasir

Abilities:
Str: 16, Dex: 11, Con: 14, Int: 9, Wis: 8, Cha: 16, Edu: 14, Soc:10

An energetic young man, not bright enough to keep from getting into problems, but charming enough to be able to talk his way out.

Race: Mixed Human. Gives +4 skill points at first level, and one extra feat.

Homeworld. Rolls a 6 on the World technology table, meaning Very High Technology homeworld. Rolls a 10 on the world trade classification giving a "Va Na" or Non-Agricultural Vacuum world. These worlds are usually mining and manufacturing centers run by a large interstellar corporation.

Kaane can add T/Computer to his class skill list, and selects T/Mechanical and T/Communications from the Non-Agricultural list and Astrogation from the Vacuum world list. These skills become class skill regardless of which class Kaane selects.

Kaane gets the following feats: Vehicle/Grav, Vacc Suit and selects Low Gravity Adaptation from the world list.

Kaane does not want to live the life of a corporate drone, and selects the Rogue Class. For this selection Kaane acquires the following feats: Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Weapon Proficiency (Swordsman), Weapon Proficiency (Marksman). Kaane select Fence Stolen Goods as his first level Bonus feat and Fast Talk as his race bonus feat.

At first level, Kaane gets 12 skill points and spends them on: Intimidate-3, T/Computer-3, Astrogation-2, Driving(Vehicle/Grav)-2, Bribery-1, Innuendo-1. As a first level Human, Kaane gets an additional 4 skill points and spends them on Driving(Vehicle) to raise it to rank 3, Bribery (to rank 3) and T/Communication-1. Staminia is rolled as 8, Kaane has stamina 10 and lifeblood 14.

As a rogue, Kaane does not have the opportunity to go to University, so he sets off to make his fortune in the stars, and enrolls in the Rogue Prior History career.

For Term 1, Kaane rolls a 6 for duty assignment and does some info gathering for the group he has hooked up with. He rolls an 9 for survival, making it through the term without problems, and a 11 for the XP bonus, gaining an additional xp bonus. Kaane gets 5,000 xp, 4,000 xp for survival and 1,000 xp for the bonus.

At the end of Term 1, Kaane has 5,000 xp and is now 3rd level.

A second level rogue gains the feat Connections(underworld). Kaane get 4 skill points (4 from the rogue class minus 1 for his lack of intelligence, +1 from the human race). Kaane spends them on Intimidate (to Rank 4), Driving (to rank 4), and Appraise-2. Stamina roll is a 5, Kaane has 17 stamina.

Kaane as a third level rogue gets 4 skill points and spends them on Intimate (to rank 5), Bribery (to Rank 4), and Gather Information-2. At 3rd level, he also gains an addition bonus feat and selects Alertness. Stamina roll is a 4, Kaane has 23 staminia.

For Term 2, Kaane rolls a 12 to re-enlist (the gang like him), and a 15 for Duty assignment and does some acquisition. He rolls a 20 for survival breezing through, and a 12 for the XP bonus. Kaane gets 6,000 xp, 4000 xp for survival and 2,000 xp bonus.

Kaane now has 11,000 xp and is 5th level.

As a fourth level rogue, Kaane gets 4 skill points and spends them on Intimitdate (to rank 6), Gather Information (to rank 3), Appraise (to rank 4). Kaane also get an ability increase and increases his Strength to 17. Stamina roll is a 6, Kaane has 31 Stamina.

As a fifth level rogue, Kaane gets 4 skill points and spend them on Driving(Grav/Vehicle) (to rank 4) and Bribery (to rank 4). Kaane also gets the Feat Improved Search. Stamina roll is a 4, Kaane now has a 37 stamina.

For Term 3, Kaane rolls a 4 to re-enlist (the boss questions his loyalty but lets him stay). He rolls a 12 for duty assignment and helps the gang smuggling the stolen goods to another world. He rolls a 7 for survival, getting himself injured when the deal goes bad, and rolls a 17 for XP bonus showing he learned a great deal from this experience. Kaane gets 7,000 xp, 4,000 xp for survival, 1,000 xp for being wounded, and 2,000 xp bonus.

Kaane now has 18,000 xp and is 6th level.

As a sixth level rogue, Kaane get 4 skill points and spends them on Intimidate (to rank 7), Bribery (to rank 5), and Gather Information (to rank 4). Stamina roll is a 6, Kaane has 45 stamina.

Kaane decides to get out while the getting is good before the boss decides to rub him out. Kaane has three terms and gets to roll three times on the benefits table. Kaane selects one roll on the material benefits table getting a 5 (High passage, probably left over from the smuggling caper) and two rolls on the cash table (a 2 and a 5) for a total of Cr60,000, plus the Rogue initial cash leaves him with Cr62,500.

Kaane Kaane Haamasir as a 6th level Rogue, is 30 years old. Height: 195 cm, Weight: 94 kg
Abilities:
Str: 17, Dex: 11, Con: 14, Int: 9, Wis: 8, Cha: 16, Edu: 14, Soc:10
Skills:
Intimidate-7, Bribery-5, Appraise-4, Gather Information-4, Driving(Vehicle/Grav)-4, T/Computer-3, Astrogation-2, Innuendo-1, T/Communication-1
Feats:
Vehicle/Grav, Vacc Suit, Low Gravity Adaptation, Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Weapon Proficiency (Swordsman), Weapon Proficiency (Marksman), Fence Stolen Goods, Fast Talk, Connections(underworld), Improved Search, Alertness
Stamina: 45, Lifeblood 14
Speed: 9 meters
BAB: +4
 
Thanks for responding - specific issues below.

Well, I wrote Kaane for the playtest, he is my character.

As a rogue, Kaane does not have the opportunity to go to University, so he sets off to make his fortune in the stars, and enrolls in the Rogue Prior History career.
I assume this is poetic license? I don't see anywhere that a Rogue *can't* go to University, right?

At the end of Term 1, Kaane has 5,000 xp and is now 3rd level.

A second level rogue gains the feat Connections(underworld). Kaane get 4 skill points (4 from the rogue class minus 1 for his lack of intelligence, +1 from the human race). Kaane spends them on Intimidate (to Rank 4), Driving (to rank 4), and Appraise-2. Stamina roll is a 5, Kaane has 17 stamina.
I see one error here - his BAB is listed as +0 at L2 in the book, while it should be +1, right?

Kaane as a third level rogue gets 4 skill points and spends them on Intimate (to rank 5), Bribery (to Rank 4), and Gather Information-2. At 3rd level, he also gains an addition bonus feat and selects Alertness. Stamina roll is a 4, Kaane has 23 staminia.
As best as I can tell here's where the skill error lies. At third level he gets 4 SPs, but takes Intimidate from rank 4 to 5, Bribery from rank 1 to 4, and Gather Information from rank 0 to 2. That's 6 points. I assume what you did was mistakenly insert your +2 GI bonus from Connections/Underworld here (though why it didn't get inserted at L2 I'm not sure).

If you agree, I'll submit these to the Errata board...

Thanks,
Ernest
 
Originally posted by tjoneslo:

At first level, Kaane gets 12 skill points and spends them on: Intimidate-3, T/Computer-3, Astrogation-2, Driving(Vehicle/Grav)-2, Bribery-1, Innuendo-1. As a first level Human, Kaane gets an additional 4 skill points and spends them on Driving(Vehicle) to raise it to rank 3, Bribery (to rank 3) and T/Communication-1. Staminia is rolled as 8, Kaane has stamina 10 and lifeblood 14.
[/QB]
Oh, and another problem - his listed Bribery at level 1 in the book is rank 1, not rank 3. I guess that's the missing 2 points you get back at L3.

Should probably read like this:
L1 (16 sp)
T/Mechanical-0, Intimidate-3, Bribery-3, Driving (Vessel/Grav)-3, T/Computer-3, Astrogation-2, Innuendo-1, T/Communication-1

L2 (+4 sp)
T/Mechanical-0, Intimidate-4, Bribery-3, Driving (Vessel/Grav)-4, T/Computer-3, Astrogation-2, Innuendo-1, T/Communication-1, Appraise-2

L3 (+4 sp)
T/Mechanical-0, Intimidate-5, Bribery-4, Driving (Vessel/Grav)-4, T/Computer-3, Astrogation-2, Innuendo-1, T/Communication-1, Appraise-2, Gather Information-2

Ernest
 
Originally posted by mxyzplk:
Thanks for responding - specific issues below.

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />As a rogue, Kaane does not have the opportunity to go to University, so he sets off to make his fortune in the stars, and enrolls in the Rogue Prior History career.
I assume this is poetic license? I don't see anywhere that a Rogue *can't* go to University, right?
</font>[/QUOTE]Yes and no. At the time I wrote this, the draft rules said a Rogue couldn't go to University. It was later changed.
If you agree, I'll submit these to the Errata board...

Thanks,
Ernest
Please do.
 
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