Ship Internal Systems

[Nightshade]

What could be more interesting than a basic diagram of ship internal systems and what their interdependences are? How many times has the plot of a SciFI movie or TV show been resting on fixing one thing or another? Power couplers are awfully necessary in star trek for instance.

There are systems such as computer, environmental, avionics, and engines that I can think of. Has anyone made a simple diagram of how some of these systems interact? I think such, though not indispensable, would be enjoyable to add color. Here are some points I have noted:

Power plant - most ships systems are dependent on the power plant for operation. This in not a ship system with any backup except possibly ship's batteries. No manual override here.

Environmental - breaks down to 3 subsystems: gravitics, heating/cooling, atmospheric distribution. Gravitics along with heating/cooling are power plant dependent with atmospheric distribution being mostly so. I can see a series of manual valves being in place to change gas distribution throughout the ship.

Ship's Computer - necessary for avionics and what else? I can see almost all other systems on board a ship having simplified computer or control terminals.

Engines - dependent on power plant and controlled by ship's computer.

Landing gear - dependent on what?

I can see manual alternatives to landing gear extension, and opening hatches.

Ships would have lots of breakers to prevent overloads and system burnouts.

Any other ideas or has someone done something like this before?

 

[Andrew Boulton]

SOM has this for all the major systems.

 

[Commander Drax]

Yep DGP, done great work for MegaTraveller on this very subject, get the Starship's Operators Manual and enjoy

 

[Nightshade]

Very cool. Well can someone tell me if this book is included in the MegaTraveller CDROM sold by FFE? Trying to figure out what is on each CD is difficult or maybe I just can't navigate Marc's site very well.

OK, nvm, I can see that it does not according to the traveller.wikia.com

 

[far-trader]

As you found out SOM is not on the CR-ROM and is not likely to ever see the light of day in a reprint form for reasons others may feel like dredging up, but I don't

Sadly the only way you might see it is if you get lucky on eBay and have a lot of money. But...

...that wouldn't stop someone from creating a new book along the same lines, perhaps through OGL once Mongoose gets RTT going. Or maybe through QLI before their license ends.

 

[Spinward Scout]

You might be able to pick one up at a gaming convention.

 

[coliver988]

I found this link, which appears to try & do some of the SOM stuff:

http://members.cox.net/magash/STM/Intro.htm

 

[flykiller]

...that wouldn't stop someone from creating a new book along the same lines ....

yep, can always do something similar ourselves.

'fact, we could have a contest here on coti - who can come up with the best internal ship operation description. engineering, flight ops, computer & comms, internal security, life support, etc. winner lets mongoose publish it.

 

[Gadrin]

internal security

Ideas from Adv 7: Broadsword

The ship's anti-hijack program will prove of some help, but is not totally foolproof. The
program works by monitoring the location of all large living things aboard ship (by
means of infrared sensors to pick up slight rises in temperature, ultrasonic motion-
detectors, and sensors in the deck plates of certain vital areas which detect the weight
of a body) and sounding an alarm if certain parameters are met (if, for example, a body
suddenly appears in the drive room). The referee must determine the effectiveness of
this program in detecting the commandos, and any delays which may occur in sounding
the alarm. If, for example, the commandos jump into the computer room, and disable
the computer immediately, the alarm will probably not sound.


Obviously these might not be the same on a civilian vessel but they're good none-the-less.

 

[Icosahedron]

I've not read SOM, but it occurred to me that LBB5 allows the 'Jump Capacitors' to act as an alternative source of power - perhaps filling the role of ships batteries.

 

[flykiller]

I've not read SOM, but it occurred to me that LBB5 allows the 'Jump Capacitors' to act as an alternative source of power - perhaps filling the role of ships batteries.

yep, been discussed, leads to all sorts of consequences. for example, power up the jump capacitors before a battle, and you have instant jump available instead of having to go through the power-up sequence during battle. or you can use the jump capacitors to power energy-consuming weapons during the first few rounds of battle without needing to provide power plant capacity or fuel tankage to operate them.

lots of fun stuff.

 

[fredofmars]

I've not read SOM, but it occurred to me that LBB5 allows the 'Jump Capacitors' to act as an alternative source of power - perhaps filling the role of ships batteries.

This is definately one of the heretical ideas out there. Some people have designed interesting ships using this idea though.

 

[flykiller]

This is definately one of the heretical ideas out there.

nothing heretical about it. follows book 5 rules exactly - jump capacitors may be charged up, and their stored energy (no time limit specified) used to power ship systems other than jump. 'tsall there in the jump and black globe sections.

 

[Gadrin]

From High Guard p37

The capacitors contained in the ship's jump drive may be used to store this
energy; additional capacitors may also be purchased. The jump drive capacitors
mass .5% of the ship's mass, per jump number; for example, a drive capable of
jump3 will include capacitors equal to 1.5% of the ship's mass. Additional capacitors
may be purchased at MCr4.0 per ton. One ton of capacitors (in a jump
drive or not) will hold 36 EPs.

 

[robject]

My preference is the tankless starship, which runs entirely on capacitors, and charges same through skimming fuel, burning it while you skim, and storing the energy.

 

[Gadrin]

I had thought only the Black Globe (or White Globe) generators were efficient enough to do that -- channel energy to the capacitors -- or otherwise the TU would be at that point.

I'm sure some transfer of energy exists, but not nearly as efficient as Ancient Technology. But that's all I got from the search on capacitors. It almost mentions "Black Globe" on every instance.

 

[Drakon]

Environmental - breaks down to 3 subsystems: gravitics, heating/cooling, atmospheric distribution. Gravitics along with heating/cooling are power plant dependent with atmospheric distribution being mostly so. I can see a series of manual valves being in place to change gas distribution throughout the ship.

You also need 1) water purification, and 2) waste disposal. The liquid and solid components of life support. Atmo is mostly electrical, as you can use scrubbers and burners on the air present in the ship to clean it up. (Scrubbers remove CO2, burners will burn any hydrogen, hydrocarbons and CO in the air and turn it into water and CO2. The CO2 is then removed by the scrubbers and pumped overboard, or some further processing to remove the C and keep just the O2.)

Ship's Computer - necessary for avionics and what else? I can see almost all other systems on board a ship having simplified computer or control terminals.

Flight Control. You need the various manuvering thrusters controllable to be able to land. And one of your thruster packs may fail and need to be isolated.

Landing gear - dependent on what?

Electrical power to hydraulic pumps. Or electrical motors. If you use Hydraulics, you can use that as a reserve energy system to some small extent.

 

[Gadrin]

burners will burn any hydrogen, hydrocarbons and CO in the air and turn it into water and CO2. The CO2 is then removed by the scrubbers and pumped overboard, or some further processing to remove the C and keep just the O2.

what sort of quantities for water and O2 ?

 

[far-trader]

This Jump Capacitors as Power Plant comes up now and again. While it's an interesting idea it has problems.

Personally I've always disallowed it except as used in High Guard in the intent (at least how I see it) that was meant, a very dangerous and temporary storage system.

The relevant (and overlooked) bit to me is this:

Jumping: A ship... must expend energy points equal to two turns output from a power plant whose number is equal to the jump being attempted (EP required =0.01MJn). If it can do this in two turns, it jumps at the end of two turns. If it can do this in one turn or less, it jumps at the end of one turn (in the pursuit step).

Clear enough right. But note the next line:

A ship which cannot summon the required energy in two turns may not jump at all.

That's pretty telling in the context of jump capacitor charge duration if you ask me. Else wise a ship could trickle charge the capacitors over many turns, or days, or weeks, or...

...but NO, the rule clearly says if you don't have the jump charged in JUST TWO TURNS you can't jump. Period.

What happens after two turns is up to you. Me, knowing the way capacitors are and the fact that these are very very very high density energy capacitors, prone to exploding and destroying the entire ship if overcharged (1) I rule that if you don't drain them after two turns they may explode. Bye-bye ship.

If you want to be kind you can say that they just drain off harmlessly (but into what is my question then), BUT drain off they will and must. No saving the energy stored for more than two turns. That is plain. Can't be any plainer imo.

So no jump capacitor powered ships in the OTU (2) the way I see it. And you'll note there is not one published canon design that uses such a scheme. At least none that I recall, not even the broken ones (unless maybe jump torpedoes do but I don't recall that piece of broken canon).

(1) Per the rules. And in RealLife Capacitors are very hard to know when you've reached full charge. The general method of determining the capacitance of one is to test a whole batch to failure (i.e. overcharged and destroyed, usually with a bang) then use the range to rate the rest for a maximum with a safety margin. So imtu when shunting energy into capacitors there is some room above the rated 36 EP per ton, but you have no way of knowing just how far you can push it until you push it too far and then you're dead. So don't overload them

Of course not all RealLife capacitors lose charge when sitting, in fact most don't. Just another difference between capacitors and jump drive capacitors. Even calling them capacitors is probably a misnomer.

(2) Nor in MTU, but YTU can do whatever you want of course. Just be ready to change every thing because it will mean a whole new shipbuilding strategy. I doubt any of the traditional canon designs will survive with this new technology. And it'll go far beyond ships. Vehicles, weapons, just about everything. I don't know about you, but that's too much like work for me

 

[flykiller]

A ship which cannot summon the required energy in two turns may not jump at all.

That's pretty telling in the context of jump capacitor charge duration if you ask me.

it would be, 'cept the black globe descriptions make it clear that the energy stored in the jump capacitors accumulates without discharge until used in powering ship systems. as for the two turns max requirement for jump, that might be just a jump thing.

Just be ready to change every thing because it will mean a whole new shipbuilding strategy.

true, but what can you do? one gets a similar effect from implementing battery rules. in another example, since it's clear that power distribution may be altered throughout the ship, the "weapons bearing" rule may be applied to powering weapons as well as to their bearing. etc. lots of holes in the rules. think of it as excellence in engineering.

I doubt any of the traditional canon designs will survive with this new technology.

most of them are broken as is anyway.