Psionics - Good, Bad and Ugly

[Weaver95]

I read the brief on why T20 took the stance they did on psionics, but it still strikes me as being kind of...primitive. I've always thought that the way psionics was handled in Traveller was sort of shabby. Kinda like a bolt on to the core rules, it just didn't seem like it was a part of the 'real' game.

Currently, I've encouraged my players to avoid psionics since it really wouldn't fit for the campaign idea i'm developing so it's not been a big issue (they're currently planning on how to steal TL14 Battle dress and don't care about PSI abilites anyway) but I want to portray the psionic abilites of the Zhodani as truly impressive and alien.

So, I think I'll use the psionic book from TSR and see if that works.

My question tho is has anyone else used other versions or approaches to psionics in Traveller than the 'core' rules? If so, how did it work out?

 

[tjoneslo]

In the early days of Space Gamer (say 1980), there were some extensions/changes to the Traveller psionics rules which worked much better, and I've been using them. I've sort of adapted them for T20, but not completed the process.

This weekend a friend lent me his copy of the Farscape D20 rule book. While the rest of the D20 rules are uninspired, the Powers section would make an excellent addition/substitution for the T20 Psionics rules. And Farscape even as the two character classes to go along with it.

It's also a matter of how much power you think the Psionics ought to weild to make a fun game. As a long time player I liked the low powered psionics. But others feel they are too weak to be worth the effort, either in game terms or game time required to deal with them.

 

[Weaver95]

Good point about what I'm aiming for with psionics in my campaign...

Ok - what I want to do is make it clear that the psionics used by the Zhodani are not only alien/freaky/weird, but centuries more advanced in technique than anything seen by the Imperium. I mean c'mon - the Zhodani have been at the mind game thing for thier entire development as a space faring society and they're limited to just a few powers that any schlub in the Imperium can learn? I was thinking of using the stuff out of the d20 psionics book for the Zhodani (who'll be NPC's anyway) and letting any player characters use the psionics rules out of the T20 book. That should keep things where I want them.

Thoughts? comments? Let me have 'em.

 

[manley_t]

take a look at the 'psionic' rules in Call of Cthulu -- different, but still feat based.

I think adding psi to what is supposed to be hard sci-fi game really just turns it into space fantasy.

This in itself isn't bad -- I know I've run many a star-wars'ish game in traveller and have had much fun.

But, it depends on what your desire is. I see traveller as mroe a core set of rules to play any style sci-fi you want and not necessarily a specific campaign oriented game (though it can be).

the rules I use for psi? In the past I had my own house-rules (as CT psi sucked) -- haven't tried D20 so I'll see how it goes. I may end up just using my own house-rules yet again.....

 

[Weaver95]

Hmm..

The CoC stuff is more that a wee bit darker than I planned for my current Traveller game...but consider the idea stolen for a later campaign idea!

While some of the d20 stuff wouldn't work very well, alot of it might just give it the 'alien' feel I'm looking to add. Especially some of the psi prestige classes. A psionic assasin is something that would terrify Imperial officals, as would a psionic spy type character.

 

[Ran Malia]

I think that the level of psionic powers determines whether or not that become fantasy or not. Star Wars Psi abilities are definitely fantasy on the other hand Diana Troi and Spock definitely don't have a fantasy aspect to it.

Also, I think that care should be taken in determine the capabilities of Zhodani psionics. Evolutionary wise the Zhodani psionic capabilities are the same as the rest of Imperial humanati for the most part. The difference as far as capabilities go is that the Zhodani are more flexible. Accepting psionics and then working to develop it and understand it gives them significant flexibility, but negligble capability. Think about it every humanati has psionic capabilities. The capability may decrease with age, but everyone has it. The Zhodani have accepted it, made the sacrafice to practice it, and have adopted their culture to it. That is what makes them alien. I think that should drive your ideas on the Zhodani.

With that in mind the zhodani probably do have some prestige classes based on their psionics that the Imperium doesn't have. However, I would still try to stay in the Traveller mindset. IMHO I don't think that a zhodani psi-monk is very Traveller (by very Traveller I mean mainstream concept for the most part) however a Zhodani Thought Police prestige class (especially if the T20 guys determine to create a law enforcement class), or Zhodani Teleport Commandos are both excellent choice. I personally don't think that you need a prestige class for a psi spy. If T20 developes an intelligence class then any Zhodani that is psionic and is a spy automatically become a psi-spy. Just my thoughts

 

[themink]

Originally posted by Ran Malia:
I think that the level of psionic powers determines whether or not that become fantasy or not. Star Wars Psi abilities are definitely fantasy on the other hand Diana Troi and Spock definitely don't have a fantasy aspect to it.

All the examples your give are clearly fantasy - Star wars is just flashier about it.

Having said that, Grav plates are fantasy also.

I'd happy with a liberal splash of fantasy IMTU however I have downgraded Psi power quite a lot in the reliability department.

 

[manley_t]

I agree

Why not just include D&D spells and call them psionics?

One day you misjump and end up in a system full of spelljammers

I can already hear my players screams "NNNOOOOOO......."

<grin>

 

[manley_t]

My left brain just reminded my right brain of Babylon 5's Techno-Mages....

hmm.....add the techno-mage class to T20 (just a direct port over of the wizard) and there you have it -- magic in T20....

Does that mean you'll have to run your T20 game in the 3rd age of Man?

 

[Ran Malia]

Well actually, if it doesn't exist it is fantasy, so the whole game is fantasy. What makes it work for science fiction (soft and hard)are a couple of items. It is seen as scientifically possible and it is concieved of being part of the genre. Like you said, gravs are science fiction, but you don't see anyone arguing to put in magic carpets and flying reindeer. I think the same can be said of psionics. Psionics are not magic, so they don't have the capability to change anything, magic does by at least a general standard. And, at least to some it is theoretically possible to have such abilities. IMHO there is a huge difference and the level of it does make all the difference. Just my thoughts

 

[manley_t]

I understand your argument. You that these items (FTL drives, gravitics, psionics) aren't fully fantasy because they can be reasoned to exist and as such accepted by the consumers of science fiction.

But, that's rather specious reasoning (IMO) as at their core it's all magic; it just depends how you explain it. Hell, even electricity is magic, it's all in the understanding and explanation.

Now, take psionics for one. For all intensive purposes it is pure magic for there is as much hard scientific accpetance of the veracity of mental powers as there is the acceptance of the veracity of magical spells (which are cast by practitioners of Wicca).

Describing them as using the power of your mind to alter the world around you is no different than descriptions of magic I've read -- it's all in how you describe and accept it.

So, I argue that I can have a character that casts fireballs and levitate in the air becuase I can describe psionics capabilities to explain (in a fictional reality) how they work.

My point is not to say these should not be in the game -- but that there is reason why one should be allowed in and not the other, as long as the other is dressed appropriatly in it's science fiction clothing.

or so thunk me....

 

[themink]

For me:

Fiction - Things which didn't happen but might well have (ie a story about my 8th birthday party spent at the north pole is fiction)

Science Fiction - Things which might have happened but didn;t, which rely on technological change or are set in the future( so an alternate history, my birthday on the Moon, or one set in tomorrow are all SF)

Fantasy - Things which contradict the currently understood laws science by the relevant authority(So jump drives used to be fantasy but are now science fiction) {No, I don;t count practitioners of Wicca as authorities}

So Rail guns are Science Fiction however Grav plates are fantasy. Until someone either find a theoretical limit to Rail gun Technology (making them fantasy) or a decent explanation for gravity is identified (which co-incidentaly makes grav plates possible)

Psionics- TK break current laws of Science. TP and awareness don't. I think Teleportation (in the Psi sense) breaks it. (Even though we have currently demonstrated Teleportation in labs, it is a different sort of thing)

I like Psionics and often include them in my games.

%%%%%%%%%%%55

Aside - I use "Law of science" in the accepted sense of - "Rule of thumb that seems to match the universe fairly closely in most circumstances".

 

[MGibster]

Originally posted by Weaver95:

My question tho is has anyone else used other versions or approaches to psionics in Traveller than the 'core' rules? If so, how did it work out?

I kind of like the GURPS rules for psionics. If you place some limits you can have telepaths about as powerful as they were in Babylon 5.

Marc

 

[Weaver95]

I had forgotten all about the techno-magi from B5! They might be an interesting addition to the Traveller universe...i'd have to be careful tho. Wouldn't want them to come off cheesy.

 

[Falkayn]

Ken Hood's d20 Skills-n-Feats Psionics System is a very good generic psionic system.

It is customised for his own background, the Sleeping Imperium, but it would be easy to convert to any TU. I'm thinking of usin it myself, except it doesn't fit any of my current campaign plans (which center around Lords of Thunder/Gateway sector).

 

[Armmeggedon]

I'm using the psionics from Spycraft's "Archer Foundation" book, myself.

 

[Solo]

Originally posted by Falkayn:
Ken Hood's d20 Skills-n-Feats Psionics System

Unfortunately this link is dead.

-S.

 

[themink]

I've been thinking about whether I will be including Psi in my ATU and my current theory is:

"The Church of Lost souls" was origionally established as a charity to look after dependants of those lost in jump space (ie misjumpers). Given the highly superstitious nature of merchant crew in MTU, it became fashionable to donate just before a jump - it seemed to reduce the chances of a misjump.

The church also provides training and counciling for those who have problems controlling anger. They do good works amongst imperial prisioners and assist in dimplomatic liason.

Eldars in the church are renowned for their calm demenour and "kindness"

Players can be regular attenders of the church - it costs them a little money, gives them minor connections and a mild social code.

If they become serious about their attendance and do study towards innitiation, they also spend a feat. This gives them connections(The Church) and +2 on rolls to control temper/anger/mental influence.

Once they are initiated, they gradually becoome aware that the church is a front for imperial psionics - there is a moral code that you must keep (And telepaths make sure you keep it) - but you can get trained there as a psi.

Imperial nobles (baron and up) are aware of the link - eldars of the church have sworn allegiance to the emporer - some emporers have been telepathic and thus "believe" them.

The Psi repressions haven;t happened yet.

The occassional rogue psi errupts and then church jump on them when they are noticed.

the above is my current thoughts. I found Psi very powerful - so the extra feat before you can become psi seems reasonable.

I will also be making each "school" a feat to gain access - now I have to work out how I will do "psi strength". Current theory is that, once you have access to it, it is a cross class skill.

 

[Falkayn]

Originally posted by Solo:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Falkayn:
Ken Hood's d20 Skills-n-Feats Psionics System

Unfortunately this link is dead.

-S.
</font>[/QUOTE]Drat, so it is. I have the stuff downloaded and can forward it onto whoever wants it ... email me at angus_at_falkayn.com.

 

[DrSkull]

I love the whole Psionic Institute thing. As a result of that whole set-up, I've never had a PC in any of my campaigns who has had Psionics--and that's just the way I like it. But, I can throw evil mind-riping Zhodani scum at them now and again, and the occasional other psionic bad guy too. I guess I suffer from the Imperial prejudice against Psionics myself, the only good psi is a dead psi.