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Native Intelligent Life

Garnfellow

SOC-13
Peer of the Realm
Someone needs to explain this rule for me. If I read this correctly, any world with a Population 0 or 7+ and an Atmosphere of 2+ has native intelligent life.

I mean, straight up world generation is going to give you an atmo of 2+ something like 90% of the time, and a population of 0 or 7+ something like 31% of the time. So the odds of having NIL is approximately 28%.

Really? Or am I being really thick here?
 
Shouldn't something like that (frequency of native intelligent life) be configurable? To increase the versatility of the rules, I mean? So that in one universe it may be every other suitable world whereas in the OTU it averages one per three subsectors (~ 1 in every 100 systems).


Hans
 
I agree that qualifications are needed (is this for all time?) and a "dial it up/down" sentence.
 
Considering that in real life, we have yet to find ANY planet that has life on it, it seems that any percentage chosen for a game is acceptable. It's impossible to be realistic with a number that pure fiction.

We could always use Star Trek as a reference point. :) How many worlds did they visit that did NOT have native life? Maybe 10?
 
Considering that in real life, we have yet to find ANY planet that has life on it, it seems that any percentage chosen for a game is acceptable. It's impossible to be realistic with a number that pure fiction.

We could always use Star Trek as a reference point. :) How many worlds did they visit that did NOT have native life? Maybe 10?

And those were generally humans with funny ears/noses/eyebrows who spoke English.

Anyway, the issue is how to reconcile NIL with the OTU, and in a way that does not burden the referee. Don McKinney has made that last point crystal clear with Marc, and makes sure to refresh Marc's memory regularly, in a manner that does NOT distract Marc from working on errata (ah life is so complicated).

My preference is to divide NIL worlds into categories.

1-2. NIL extinct for 10^2D years - reroll if 11 or 12:). If recent OR technic enough there may be ruins or artifacts. Example: Chamax.

3-4. NIL appear to be developing and may be fully "sophont" in 10^1D years. Example?

5. The Tionale Effect - NIL are there, but may be unknown or forgotten, and do not contribute to interstellar culture or economy and are not technic. There is no reason to visit them. Maybe they eat strangers. Who knows. They clearly don't care, and neither does the subsector. Example: Tionale, Malea, and the Gogs of Mirayn. 567-908 was here until the players let the cat out of the bag, so to speak.

6. Sophonts are known and there is some external interest or abuse. Examples: Craw and 567-908. Or, they are part of local interstellar society. Example: Amindii.
 
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I just wanted to clarify for me.

I also looked, thought, looked more, thought more, head overheated, and decided you were rolling exponents. :p
 
The more I think about this, I am really not sure that the presence of intelligent life should be something dictated by a roll.
 
The more I think about this, I am really not sure that the presence of intelligent life should be something dictated by a roll.

Perhaps it should be "Native Life", as opposed to "Native Intelligent Life". Native life could be as simple as microbes or lichen-like life forms, or as complex as animals, w/o necessarily being intelligent.
 
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And I don't want the Spinward Marches to become the Star Wars cantina.

Apparently the stroke has turned me into an "old fart grognard". YMMV.
 
And I don't want the Spinward Marches to become the Star Wars cantina.

Apparently the stroke has turned me into an "old fart grognard". YMMV.

Nah, you been there for years, and we just never pointed it out...:smirk:

Native Life separate from NIL would be good. but goes beyond errata
 
And I don't want the Spinward Marches to become the Star Wars cantina..

Agreed. I think Intelligent life should be placed specifically and intentionally by the GM or the setting designers. It stands to reason that life can arise on a world without necessarily gaining sapience. And as someone else mentioned up-thread, even if intelligent life does arise in the history of a given world, given the billions-of-years lifespans of star systems, that life could have arisen and died out or moved on long ago, or may be yet to arise millions or billions of years in the future.


I think a "Native Life" indicator is far more useful that an "NIL" indicator.

Perhaps that can be something to run past Marc in your discussions, if he is open to consideration?
 
I think a "Native Life" indicator is far more useful that an "NIL" indicator.
I'm surprised to learn about the lack of distinction between 'native life' (which should be VERY common in a Traveller universe) and 'intelligent native life'. But doesn't that solve the problem? Surely if there's only one category, it must cover every possible form of native life and intelligent life is just a subset. Errata 'NIL' to 'NL' and everything fits!

(You may also want to add a paragraph or two discussing intelligent natives).

Also, I don't actually see the problem with rolling for intelligent natives1, as long as you allow for different target numbers according to the kind of setting the referee desires.
1 As long as you remember the alpha and omega of randome generation: Always vet the results and change the bits that don't make sense to you.


Hans
 
How's this for an errata proposal:

Page 412, Native Intelligent Life. Delete everything. Replace with this:

Any world with an Atmosphere of 2+ has the potential for supporting or having supported native intelligent life. In Charted Space, Native Intelligent Life has developed on roughly 1 in every 100 worlds, though in different regions this may occur much more or less frequently. The referee should assign the presence of native intelligent life directly or else determine randomly on 2D. A roll of 12 indicates native life; the referee should then roll a second 2D to determine if the life is intelligent:

Frequency of Native Intelligent LifeNIL Present
Common4+
Standard8+
Rare10+
If the world's Atmosphere is ABC, the life is Exotic. If the world's Pop is 0, the native intelligent life is now Extinct.
 
Native Life separate from NIL would be good. but goes beyond errata.

But it still can be posted on the errata thread as a suggestion. If people propose a few words be judiciously changed in the already existing text, then it has a chance of changing Marc's mind. For example, inserting the word "potential".

Or changing the probability, if that can be done in the existing table.
 
But it still can be posted on the errata thread as a suggestion. If people propose a few words be judiciously changed in the already existing text, then it has a chance of changing Marc's mind. For example, inserting the word "potential".

Or changing the probability, if that can be done in the existing table.

Posted in T5.09 Errata Discussion Thread.
 
Perhaps it should be "Native Life", as opposed to "Native Intelligent Life". Native life could be as simple as microbes or lichen-like life forms, or as complex as animals, w/o necessarily being intelligent.

This could be expanded out. First there's the chance of native life arising. Then there is how advanced is it ... are we talking animals, pre-sophonts, or actual sophonts?

If there are actual native sophonts, are they most of or only part of the UWP population digit? And if only a part of, how integrated are they? (Are they equal partners in the planetary society or restricted to low tech reservations? Are there racial and/or cultural tensions?)

Also, spacefaring are they? On Regina we have the Armindii. But apart from off-world operations by the Duke's Huscarles, do many of them travel? Would you expect to see any on, say, nearby Efate?

Not sure where I'm going with this. Just some random thoughts.
 
I don't think there is a single extreme environment on earth where life of some sort hasn't been discovered.

Then there is the fact that life originated on earth when the atmospheric and hydrographic conditions were very different - life has actually altered the earth's environment.

Organic compounds have been discovered in deep space and on comets.

And none of that takes into account life based on non-carbon chemistry...
 
And Traveller pretty much embodies the Golden Era SF where, if a world can have life, it will, with exceptions being uncommon.
 
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