Military members & Traveller (& RPGs in general)

[R_Kane]

Perhaps it is just my experience from the perspective of a former
Active Duty US Air Force member (and current Air National Guard
member), but it sure seems like military and ex-miltary members make
up a large portion of gamers out there.

My only experience with Traveller so far has been on-line, and again
it seems like a lot of folks in the Traveller community are of/from
the military.

Has anyone else noticed this? What do you make of it? Is there
something that ties RPGs and military together?

 

[lesbates]

Originally posted by R_Kane:
Perhaps it is just my experience from the perspective of a former
Active Duty US Air Force member (and current Air National Guard
member), but it sure seems like military and ex-miltary members make
up a large portion of gamers out there.

My only experience with Traveller so far has been on-line, and again
it seems like a lot of folks in the Traveller community are of/from
the military.

Has anyone else noticed this? What do you make of it? Is there
something that ties RPGs and military together?

I was a gamer before joining the army. My involvment in Traveller and (gasp!) D&D definately stimulated my own private study of military and political history.

And my repeated readings of Heinlein's STARSHIP TROOPERS was a factor in my enlistment in the army.

 

[Ganidirsii O'Flynn]

Roger that!

I likewise was a gamer before I followed the flag, and it is something that I've noticed, too. You'll find an awful lot of us are or were players of "Twilight 2000" too...

But we did a thread on that....

Strangely enough, there are rather fewer of the other "high risk service occupations" represented in the gamer subculture. I'm thinking that cops, firepeople, and EMS folks get a larger daily of "truth being stranger than fiction" and don't really see the intrest in fights of imagination in their off time.

 

[RandyT0001]

My question is what percentage of the military gamers are officers and enlisted?

 

[R_Kane]

Originally posted by RandyT0001:
My question is what percentage of the military gamers are officers and enlisted?

Hmm...out of the 15 (give or take) people that I've gamed with that I know are/were military, only one was an officer. The rest, myself included are/were enlisted.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

Yeah, I've noticed the military connection, especially with American gamers (although, now I think about it, I know two from over here who are or were in the Army, and while I'm very definitely a civilian I did used to build tanks for a living).

Something else I noticed when I was at university* is that gamers are far more likely to be "scientists" than "artists". About 90% were doing a BSc, and of those most were doing Computers or Physics.


*And that's something else: we tend to be better educated than average.

 

[kaladorn]

Of the gamers I've played regularly with in the last 20 years....

Total Pool: About 20
Army or Army Reserves (or Naval equiv): 10
Officers vs. NCO: 3 vs. 7
Programmers/Computer Geeks: 11 or 12
Cops: 1
Patent Agents: 1
Actors: 5
Engineers: 4
Martial Artists: 6
Shooters: 5

But then, I've run into gaming groups that had no military people, no one was a shooter, and that had very little computer geek blood. They, I noted, tended more towards fantasy than sci fi, and more towards cinematic games than realistic ones, and more towards abstract games than ones with miniatures, wargaming extensions, etc.

 

[Spyder_GS]

Our group: 9
military/ex-military: 5
computer geeks: 7
student: 1
other: 1 (spouse)

The core gamers are all the ex-military. The rest are friends from work or family.

I think the military connection is there because where are you going to game? In the barracks. Everyone sees and some join.

All the ex-military guys in my group knew each other before getting out.

 

[The Oz]

It has been very location-dependent for me.

Before I joined the service (USN enlisted) my gaming group was all civilian, however two (besides myself) did later join the military.

In the service, of course, all my gamers were military, and there were a lot of them.

Once out of the service, none of my gamers have been active service, but one did join up after he finished college.

So it's been about a 50/50 split for me, but very dependent on where I was and who I hung out with at the time.

 

[RabidVargr]

Out of my original game group of 7, I'm the only one who went military. I'm currently enlisted, (Gettin up there in the pay scale too), I've gamed with 2 ossifers 'n 2 enlisted, and will be making the change myself to Officer in the next 1-3 years. (submitting my first package this fiscal year). The officers I've played with seemed to prefer war games (axis and allies/star fleet battles) and the enlisted seem to go for rpg's.

Dunno if that helps any, but....

RV

 

[Granpafishy]

Originally posted by RabidVargr:
will be making the change myself to Officer in the next 1-3 years. (submitting my first package this fiscal year
RV

You poor, poor man. You have my condolences

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by RabidVargr:
will be making the change myself to Officer in the next 1-3 years.

Friend of mine in the CF (Navy) made the transition from enlisted to ossifer. Beforehand, his ID card used to categorize him as a 'man' and he subsequently always joked that becoming an ossifer was losing his 'man'hood....

Good luck. I find some of the best officers are people who once had a clue (ie who did real work for a living and not... ah... you know the rest of that one).

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by RabidVargr:
will be making the change myself to Officer in the next 1-3 years.

Friend of mine in the CF (Navy) made the transition from enlisted to ossifer. Beforehand, his ID card used to categorize him as a 'man' and he subsequently always joked that becoming an ossifer was losing his 'man'hood....

Good luck. I find some of the best officers are people who once had a clue (ie who did real work for a living and not... ah... you know the rest of that one).

 

[Spinward Scout]

Of the original D&D group I gamed with, 4 of the 6 went Navy - all technical or nuclear except myself - who decided to be lazy and be an aviation paper pusher (tho they did try to get me to go Nuc because of my ASVAB scores). Of the other two, one ended up in jail, and the other got married and had two kids (she was my first crush - but I never did tell her). In my second group, I was the only one to go into the Military. In the Navy, I gamed with a group of 8 guys - the DM was a Senior Chief Petty Officer. After I mustered out, the only other ex-military gamers was one friend that just went in the Coast Guard and another friend who was in the Army (not sure of his MOS, tho) - and he's the wargamer/strategist of the group. Always plays Mercenary type of characters. WWII history buff. Which reminds me - I have to find the old TV show Combat! for him on satellite while I'm off work (might have failed my survival roll - I just went in for hernia surgery today). But I've never seen or heard of Officers playing RPGs. But hell, when you think about it, unless there's real action, all the Military is is one big LARP anyway. I also have some friends that were in the Persian Gulf War that game - tho I've never gamed with them. They play Warhammer - and I think both were Infantry in the PGW.

Later,

Scout

 

[Drakon]

Only speaking for myself, 5 and 1/2 years underwater

Formerly ET1 (NUC) SS USN

 

[PapaGolfWhiskey]

I -Think- based on my limited sample it may be a traveller thing rather than a gaming thing in general.

My military experience has always been.. peripheral. A youth in the Sea Cadets (like the boy scouts but funded by the Department of National Defence) a couple of years in a local Militia Regiment, and a mind easily distracted by Jack Higgen's early novels or one of those little Fawcett military history books.

Out of the gamers I've known personally in the last 20 or so years: I can think of two who had military experience of some sort:

1) A geology student (back when I was an engineering student) Who had made corporal in HIS army reserve Regiment.

2) And An Officer in my local unit. Who despite beeing quite the military history buff (to the point of making his masters thesis out of his role as regimental historian) , has no interest in any game other than D&D.


I'm a Nurse by profession. And I've never found any of my coworkers interested in Gaming as I define the term (RPGS and Strategy). I've always found it hard to get Traveller games going. In the past 3 years most of the games I've been involved in have been d20 (new Star Wars an D&D), BESM, or White Wolf.

Largely a university crowd. They include(d):
A dropout who is currently a shoe salesman. (one of the best Referees/Players I know. a Fun guy)
A Concurrent Ed student with a political science major (a good RPer and strategy gamer but untterly uninterested in military history or Miltech)
A History Masters student, who works in abestos abatement during the offseason and has a mind like a razor. Fascinated with military and geopolitics to the point of reading multiple local news sources from around the world to get the 'real news' The best Warhammer player I've ever faced accross a table and a proponent of RIFTS( WTH?) of all systems.

I'm finding it hard to find a pattern here.

Though I have noticed a heavy dose of Military personal, ex military personal and general war buffs among the posters here.

Maybe Traveller is a game that has strayed least from it's roots in strategy wargaming?

Maybe the richeness of it's back story appeals to historians (amatuer or not). maybe it's extensive rules on tech and commerce appeal to gearheads. I dono.

I Think an earlier poster had it right. It's where you personally have found your fellow gamers. If you're in the military you're going to be playing with other military types. It may also be WHO you're more confortable gaming with. If you're a stratgey and tactics type who plays characters very like himself, then the wannabe method actor who is always asking "what's my motivation here" may not stay long in your circle of gamers and memory.

Any how just my 1.2 cents US. (the Canuck dollar sitting at about 60-63% of that)

 

[vegascat]

The first group of gamers I was involved with were all university students. At least 15% ended pu in the military.
After 20 years of enlisted service, 98% of the players I have known have been military, dependents, or military employed. That is probably from being in the military and meeting gamers through military connections.

INvolvment in the SCA in Europe was somewhat different though. SCA membership in 1989 in Europe was about 150 military or dependent and 1 German. By 1991, the numbers had changed to about 400 military and 400 Continental Eurpoeans, plus well over 50 Swedes. After the drawdown, the military numbers had dropped to below 50. The officer to enlisted ran about 1% officer to 99% enlisted. It seems that the SCA was incompatable with Commissioned life.

I have known no officers who continued gaming past getting their silver bar (1st Lt). Again, it seems RPG gaming is incompatible with the expected commissioned life.

 

[Keklas Rekobah]

What I've noticed...

Enlisteds play more RPG's than Officers, who tend to gamble more often.
Military folks tend to play more science fiction RPG's, while civilians tend to play more fantasy RPG's.
Military folks tend towards strategic and tactical styles, while civilians tend toward "hack & sack" or "shoot & loot" gaming styles.

Finally, it seems to me that geeks and hackers will min/max their characters and "rule play" the game rather than role play.

 

[Ran Targas]

I, for one, am an ex-Naval officer and did most of my gaming with a mix of other junior officers and junior enlisted. Although our group tended to gain and lose players frequently, as tours ended and began, the overall ratio was 2 to 5, officers to enlisted.

Being forward deployed to the Far East presented problems with gaming materials BUT it did bring gamers from different genres together solely to conserve our resources. We made the conscious effort to keep atleast one fantasy and one sci-fi campaign going at all times.

 

[Ranger]

Well, my experiance is that there was a link between Traveller palyers and the military, but only as an after effect. Of my high school gaming group, only a couple of us had any real interest in the military. Most played D&D, but a few of us played Traveller as well. Almost all of the Traveller players ended up doing at least 1 term in the Army, but most went in for the college money.

Only two of us were really interested in the military, and both of us went into officer programs in college. A third guy went to West Point, but he enlisted, and then got recruted to apply after he was in service.

While I was in the Army I came across a few gamers, but most of the officers were into wargaming (either minies or board games). RPGing was mostly an enlisted thing.

I think one thing that Traveller taught my friends was that the military wasn't a lifetime endeavor as much as a stepping stone to something else. After having run through the CG system so many times, enlisting in the Army for real seemed like a reasonable means to an end.

From the other direction, Traveller does model the US military pretty directly (Marc Miller was an Army officer after all). It's not surprising that military people would feel at home in the Traveller universe.