Flamethrowers
- Thread starter Golan2072
- Start date
One idea:
Use the weapon and range matrix characteristic of a shotgun including the group hits rule.
Holds fuel for 3 shots and cannot be refueled in combat.
Cannot be fired at long range. If used at short or close range, the firer is caught in his own shot and the weapon explodes. If the firer is hit by any weapon, roll 8+ for the flamethrower to explode. Explosions inflict full damage on the user and roll to hit all adjacent targets.
+5 against all but fully sealed armor types (vacc suit, CES, combat armor, battle dress).
Damage: 5 dice plus an additional die each round. Victims may attempt to extinguish the fire and avoid the continuing damage by rolling. Roll 8+.
(damage estimate is low for play balance)
All flammable material in the target area will burn and produce smoke. All but completely sealed vehicles will begin to burn and take damage as for characters.
Can only be used in thin, standard or dense atmospheres. Specific variants for other atmosphere types can be produced at triple(?) the base cost for both weapon and fuel.
I guess you could make one work in vaccuum or trace if you had both fuel and oxydizer, but you wouldn't get any secondary burn effects.
Weight: 30kg+
Cost suggestion: maybe a set of scuba gear plus a shotgun; 1000Cr?
Use the weapon and range matrix characteristic of a shotgun including the group hits rule.
Holds fuel for 3 shots and cannot be refueled in combat.
Cannot be fired at long range. If used at short or close range, the firer is caught in his own shot and the weapon explodes. If the firer is hit by any weapon, roll 8+ for the flamethrower to explode. Explosions inflict full damage on the user and roll to hit all adjacent targets.
+5 against all but fully sealed armor types (vacc suit, CES, combat armor, battle dress).
Damage: 5 dice plus an additional die each round. Victims may attempt to extinguish the fire and avoid the continuing damage by rolling. Roll 8+.
(damage estimate is low for play balance)
All flammable material in the target area will burn and produce smoke. All but completely sealed vehicles will begin to burn and take damage as for characters.
Can only be used in thin, standard or dense atmospheres. Specific variants for other atmosphere types can be produced at triple(?) the base cost for both weapon and fuel.
I guess you could make one work in vaccuum or trace if you had both fuel and oxydizer, but you wouldn't get any secondary burn effects.
Weight: 30kg+
Cost suggestion: maybe a set of scuba gear plus a shotgun; 1000Cr?
Andrew Boulton
The Adminator
Only one PC ever used one in my 23 years of gaming, and he only got off one shot before the Zho he was fighting hit his fuel tank. With a laser rifle. I didn't even bother rolling damage, I just handed him a blank character sheet...
Icky, nasty weapon and a bullet-magnet to boot.
The suggestion above is for the TL5-6 tank-type flamethrower. Modern ones use cartridges or rockets. You could probably get by using the stats for a RAM grenade and tacking on combustion effects.
And this link contains more about flamethrowers than I imagined possible. (Gotta love the internet)
Anybody bring the marshmallows?
The suggestion above is for the TL5-6 tank-type flamethrower. Modern ones use cartridges or rockets. You could probably get by using the stats for a RAM grenade and tacking on combustion effects.
And this link contains more about flamethrowers than I imagined possible. (Gotta love the internet)
Anybody bring the marshmallows?
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
IIRC there were rules for a hand flamer - similar to the Starship Troopers weapon (the book 
) - in an early issue of JTAS.
) - in an early issue of JTAS.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
I can't find them in TA1, but they are in the playtest files for the T20 Player's Book
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
I know there are "flamers" in SpaceMaster. I will see about posting the info for those on Monday....
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
Flamers from SpaceMaster Tech Book, 1st ed. (I will summarize, not totally reproduce - I wouldn't want to break any rules):
Flamers are basically flamethrowers, though they aren't (evidently) designed to give that nice satisfying long tongue of flame you see in WWII movies. According to the book, though, they do "tend to make a satisfying "Whoosh" sound when discharged." The fuel acts like napalm, sticking to the target until consumed. The "Fumble" rolls for these weapons are significantly higher than for slug-throwers, and higher than other energy weapons.
The weapons include:
Mini flamer - power supply strapped to forearm, can be fired from the wrist, 1 shot/rd, .2-.4kg, 100Elmonits
Flame pistol - 2 shots/rd (normal RoF for SpaceMaster), .4-1kg, 200Elmonits
Assault flamer (sounds like somebody that haunts boards like this, then rips a poster a new one with out ceasing) - less dmg than a rifle, 3-5kg, 400Elmonits
Flame rifle - rifle, 4-6kg, 650Elmonits
Heavy flamer - a support weapon, "superior burning effects", 5-7kg, 900Elmonits
10mm pistol (for comparison) - .5-.8kg, 80Elmonits
Range modifiers:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> PB Sh Med LR Ammo mods-PB Sh Med LR
Mini 1 2 2 5 +15 0 -30 -90
Pistol 2 5 5 15 +15 0 -30 -90
Assault 3 10 10 30 +15 0 -30 -90
Rifle 4 20 20 60 +15 0 -30 -90
Heavy 5 40 40 120 +15 0 -30 -90
Pistol 2 15 30 80 +15 0 -30 -90</pre>[/QUOTE]Damage is hard to convert, as SpaceMaster uses tables and Criticals. Let me give some idea, though:
Against an unarmored opponent, you will do almost double the damage (in points) as a Laser weapon, while it does the same as or slightly better than a Pistol (comparing to Mini). As far as criticals, Flame and 10mm pistols are about the same, while Lasers (all sizes) start out slightly ahead, and end up almost double by the time you reach the heavy stuff. The flame weapons, though, do an extra critical on the next turn (of reduced severity), so the damage is ultimately about the same as a comparable Laser weapon.
Against Full Armored Exoskeleton, the 10mm Pistol does diddly. You get a few lousy points of damage, and no crits. The Laser, likewise, won't even scorch the armor in it's smallest size; with the heavy stuff eventually doing the same damage as the pistol would on an unarmored person. The Mini-flamer will actually do a critical against the armored opponent, with a Heavy flamer doing the better damage than a 10mm vs the unarmored target.
(I can't remember if Full Armored Exoskeleton is equivalent to Combat Armor or BD...)
Flamers are basically flamethrowers, though they aren't (evidently) designed to give that nice satisfying long tongue of flame you see in WWII movies. According to the book, though, they do "tend to make a satisfying "Whoosh" sound when discharged." The fuel acts like napalm, sticking to the target until consumed. The "Fumble" rolls for these weapons are significantly higher than for slug-throwers, and higher than other energy weapons.
The weapons include:
Mini flamer - power supply strapped to forearm, can be fired from the wrist, 1 shot/rd, .2-.4kg, 100Elmonits
Flame pistol - 2 shots/rd (normal RoF for SpaceMaster), .4-1kg, 200Elmonits
Assault flamer (sounds like somebody that haunts boards like this, then rips a poster a new one with out ceasing) - less dmg than a rifle, 3-5kg, 400Elmonits
Flame rifle - rifle, 4-6kg, 650Elmonits
Heavy flamer - a support weapon, "superior burning effects", 5-7kg, 900Elmonits
10mm pistol (for comparison) - .5-.8kg, 80Elmonits
Range modifiers:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> PB Sh Med LR Ammo mods-PB Sh Med LR
Mini 1 2 2 5 +15 0 -30 -90
Pistol 2 5 5 15 +15 0 -30 -90
Assault 3 10 10 30 +15 0 -30 -90
Rifle 4 20 20 60 +15 0 -30 -90
Heavy 5 40 40 120 +15 0 -30 -90
Pistol 2 15 30 80 +15 0 -30 -90</pre>[/QUOTE]Damage is hard to convert, as SpaceMaster uses tables and Criticals. Let me give some idea, though:
Against an unarmored opponent, you will do almost double the damage (in points) as a Laser weapon, while it does the same as or slightly better than a Pistol (comparing to Mini). As far as criticals, Flame and 10mm pistols are about the same, while Lasers (all sizes) start out slightly ahead, and end up almost double by the time you reach the heavy stuff. The flame weapons, though, do an extra critical on the next turn (of reduced severity), so the damage is ultimately about the same as a comparable Laser weapon.
Against Full Armored Exoskeleton, the 10mm Pistol does diddly. You get a few lousy points of damage, and no crits. The Laser, likewise, won't even scorch the armor in it's smallest size; with the heavy stuff eventually doing the same damage as the pistol would on an unarmored person. The Mini-flamer will actually do a critical against the armored opponent, with a Heavy flamer doing the better damage than a 10mm vs the unarmored target.
(I can't remember if Full Armored Exoskeleton is equivalent to Combat Armor or BD...)
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
Here is my shot at translating the Flamers to CT:
Range Mods
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> Close Short Medium Long VLong
Mini Flamer +2 -1 no no no
Flamer Pistol +1 +2 -5 no no
Assault Flamer -3 +2 -4 no no
Flamer Rifle -4 +2 -3 no no
Heavy Flamer -4 +2 +0 -4 no</pre>[/QUOTE]Armor Mods
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> Nothing Jack Mesh Cloth Reflec Ablat CbtArmr
Mini Flamer +5 +1 +1 +1 +1 +0 -2
Flamer Pistol +5 +2 +2 +2 +2 +1 -1
Assault Flamer +6 +3 +3 +3 +3 +1 -1
Flamer Rifle +6 +3 +3 +3 +3 +1 -1
Heavy Flamer +7 +4 +4 +4 +4 +2 +0</pre>[/QUOTE]Damage
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> 1st round 2d round
Mini Flamer 1D 1D/2
Flamer Pistol 2D 1D
Assault Flamer 3D 1D+3
Flamer Rifle 3D+3 2D-1
Heavy Flamer 4D 2D</pre>[/QUOTE]Now, these don't use a large napalm tank to operate, so hits are somewhat less catastrophic. If, you want to simulate tanks, though....
Each tank can take a number of points damage as the damage dice it will inflict: Pistol will take 1 hit, Rifle will take 3 (drop the mod). When that damage is done, roll double the weapon's damage on the user for the first turn. Roll normal 1st round damage on the 2d round, followed by 2d rounds damage on the 3d round.
Feel free to add this to your weapons pantheon, folks!
Range Mods
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> Close Short Medium Long VLong
Mini Flamer +2 -1 no no no
Flamer Pistol +1 +2 -5 no no
Assault Flamer -3 +2 -4 no no
Flamer Rifle -4 +2 -3 no no
Heavy Flamer -4 +2 +0 -4 no</pre>[/QUOTE]Armor Mods
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> Nothing Jack Mesh Cloth Reflec Ablat CbtArmr
Mini Flamer +5 +1 +1 +1 +1 +0 -2
Flamer Pistol +5 +2 +2 +2 +2 +1 -1
Assault Flamer +6 +3 +3 +3 +3 +1 -1
Flamer Rifle +6 +3 +3 +3 +3 +1 -1
Heavy Flamer +7 +4 +4 +4 +4 +2 +0</pre>[/QUOTE]Damage
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> 1st round 2d round
Mini Flamer 1D 1D/2
Flamer Pistol 2D 1D
Assault Flamer 3D 1D+3
Flamer Rifle 3D+3 2D-1
Heavy Flamer 4D 2D</pre>[/QUOTE]Now, these don't use a large napalm tank to operate, so hits are somewhat less catastrophic. If, you want to simulate tanks, though....
Each tank can take a number of points damage as the damage dice it will inflict: Pistol will take 1 hit, Rifle will take 3 (drop the mod). When that damage is done, roll double the weapon's damage on the user for the first turn. Roll normal 1st round damage on the 2d round, followed by 2d rounds damage on the 3d round.
Feel free to add this to your weapons pantheon, folks!
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
Oh yeah, Piper, use the group hits rule, too. I will have to look at that.
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
Ya know, I didn't see that in the SpaceMaster stats. I think I was just tired - I will try to find that tonight.
And, I don't think SM used any kind of group hits rule for these. They seem to be shooting fairly small shots of chemicals, not streams of napalm. (Shooting streams of napalm from your wrist?
)
And, I don't think SM used any kind of group hits rule for these. They seem to be shooting fairly small shots of chemicals, not streams of napalm. (Shooting streams of napalm from your wrist?
)Flamer Rifle seems to fit my Aliens-inspired concept; Flamer Pistol seems like the one from the original Alien. And these DO shoot streams of flaming Napalm; just small ones. And hold only a little amount of ammo (in a dismountable fuel-tank "magazine").
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
The SpaceMaster energy weapons specifically state that you only run out of ammo when you roll a fumble while attacking. That's stupid
I would probably use ammo like this:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Mini 3 shots (V small power/chem cell)
Pistol 8 shots (magazine-size pwr/chem cell)
Assault 20 shots (extended mag-size pwr/chem cell)
Rifle 15 shots (same as Assault, more chem/shot)
Heavy 60 shots (pwr/chem tank on back)</pre>[/QUOTE]All the above (except Mini) do 2 shots per 6-sec round in SpaceMaster. Adjust as necessary for Traveller.
If you go with streams, I would reduce the ammo by half. I would require that the user make a To Hit roll each turn, but apply the 1st round damage continuously. I probably wouldn't allow follow-on rounds of damage, then.
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Mini 3 shots (V small power/chem cell)
Pistol 8 shots (magazine-size pwr/chem cell)
Assault 20 shots (extended mag-size pwr/chem cell)
Rifle 15 shots (same as Assault, more chem/shot)
Heavy 60 shots (pwr/chem tank on back)</pre>[/QUOTE]All the above (except Mini) do 2 shots per 6-sec round in SpaceMaster. Adjust as necessary for Traveller.
If you go with streams, I would reduce the ammo by half. I would require that the user make a To Hit roll each turn, but apply the 1st round damage continuously. I probably wouldn't allow follow-on rounds of damage, then.
How do you adjucate tank hits? I mean, CT has no location hits/called shorts (IIRC for the called shots), so how do you determine if a tank is hit? I think that for most light versions (everything other than a Heavy Flamer) it should rarely happen in usual combat (other than a refree call); if caught in the blast of a shotgun or an explosion, roll a certain "saving throw" to determine if it explodes.
About the Heavy Flamer, the tanks are a big target from behind; auto-fire should have a chance of detonating them, and it should be possible to aim (with a negative DM) at them.
About the Heavy Flamer, the tanks are a big target from behind; auto-fire should have a chance of detonating them, and it should be possible to aim (with a negative DM) at them.
RAH's flamers are short ranged energy weapons, called "heaters" or "burners" in other books. This was years before lasers were invented.
Treat as laser pistols, carbines, rifles, -1D for every range band beyond short, ignites anything flamable if it does enough damage.
Fuze, explosive primer 2-3 pt
Wood construction 6pt+
Treat as laser pistols, carbines, rifles, -1D for every range band beyond short, ignites anything flamable if it does enough damage.
Fuze, explosive primer 2-3 pt
Wood construction 6pt+
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
2-4601, You have better ideas on that than I do! Just remember to post your end results.
Good point, Bob. And, one not covered by SpaceMaster, either.
Good point, Bob. And, one not covered by SpaceMaster, either.
Andrew Boulton
The Adminator
From JTAS#3:
"The hand flamer is useful for 100 combat rounds, fed from a flame fuel tank on the suit's back. The hand flamer can be fired twice per combat round (it doesn't need much aiming), inflicting 4D
damage per hit. DM's against targets to hit:
Nothing- +7, Jack- +5, Mesh- +4, Cloth- +3, Reflec- +2, Ablat- +1, Battle- 0.
DM's for range:
Close- +4, Short- +2, Medium— +1, Long- No.
The flame fuel tank is an Achilles Heel: every time the suit sustains a gun hit, roll 11+ for the tank to explode, inflicting 6D hits on the wearer."
And after several days of googling I tracked down this pic of Sigourney Weaver testing the flamer from Alien...
"The hand flamer is useful for 100 combat rounds, fed from a flame fuel tank on the suit's back. The hand flamer can be fired twice per combat round (it doesn't need much aiming), inflicting 4D
damage per hit. DM's against targets to hit:
Nothing- +7, Jack- +5, Mesh- +4, Cloth- +3, Reflec- +2, Ablat- +1, Battle- 0.
DM's for range:
Close- +4, Short- +2, Medium— +1, Long- No.
The flame fuel tank is an Achilles Heel: every time the suit sustains a gun hit, roll 11+ for the tank to explode, inflicting 6D hits on the wearer."
And after several days of googling I tracked down this pic of Sigourney Weaver testing the flamer from Alien...
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