Diplomats and the Major Races

[Antares Administration]

Let's start off with a very basic question - What is an Imperial diplomatic office outside the Imperial space called? Embassy? Consulate? Legation? Something else?

What about the other major races?

I can see that the Hivers, as an example, might not have embassies and diplomats in the traditional sense, but rather representatives, perhaps, from the the applicable Topical Club.

Comments?

Paul Nemeth
AA

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by Antares Administration:
Let's start off with a very basic question - What is an Imperial diplomatic office outside the Imperial space called? Embassy? Consulate? Legation? Something else?

Consulate: The residence or official premises of a consul.

Consul: An official appointed by a government to reside in a foreign country and represent his or her government's commercial interests and assist its citizens there.

Embassy:
1. A building containing the offices of an ambassador and staff.
2. The position, function, or assignment of an ambassador.
3. A mission to a foreign government headed by an ambassador.
4. A staff of diplomatic representatives headed by an ambassador.

Ambassador:
1. A diplomatic official of the highest rank appointed and accredited as representative in residence by one government or sovereign to another, usually for a specific length of time.
2. A diplomatic official heading his or her country's permanent mission to certain international organizations, such as the United Nations.
3. An authorized messenger or representative.

I'm thinking the distinction here is Embassies are for places you have higher level gov't relations with and Consuls for those places you need a presence because you have some ex-pats or travellers there, but where you maintain few higher level governmental ties. So Client States would get Embassies. Independent States might well get Consuls, or Embassies, depending on the situation.

Legation:
1. A diplomatic mission in a foreign country ranking below an embassy.
2. The diplomatic minister and staff of such a mission.
3. The premises occupied by such a mission.

Legate:
\Leg"ate\ (l[e^]g"[asl]t), n. [OE. legat, L. legatus, fr. legare to send with a commission or charge, to depute, fr. lex, legis, law: cf. F. l['e]gat, It. legato. See Legal.] 1. An ambassador or envoy.

2. An ecclesiastic representing the pope and invested with the authority of the Holy See.

Note: Legates are of three kinds: ({a}) Legates a latere, now always cardinals. They are called ordinary or extraordinary legates, the former governing provinces, and the latter class being sent to foreign countries on extraordinary occasions. ({b}) Legati missi, who correspond to the ambassadors of temporal governments. ({c}) Legati nati, or legates by virtue of their office, as the archbishops of Salzburg and Prague.

3. (Rom. Hist.) (a) An official assistant given to a general or to the governor of a province. (b) Under the emperors, a governor sent to a province.

So, it seems to me the order of importance is:

Embassy
Legation
Consul

But I'm only sort of guessing as Legation and Consul both seem to be less than an Embassy, but perhaps they differ in character rather than rank.

(PS - source is dictionary.reference.com)

 

[jchurchill]

I''ll dredge up some foreign service training for you...

Ambassador and Embassy are the main representatives to a RECOGNIZED foreign state. Consuls and consulates are regional/local FS members who take orders and direction from the Embassy located in the foreign capital.

A legation is old school diplomacy where a country was not officially recognized or was deemed not important enough to have an Embassy. [E.G. the Legations at Peking[Beijing] in 1900 attacked by the Boxers. Not Embassies but legations]

The very lowest level -- honorary consul...a local expatriate who attemots to smooth over visitors getting into trouble.

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by secretagent:
I''ll dredge up some foreign service training for you...

Merci Buckets.

That makes sense.... Canada had an Embassy and Consuls in Dominican Republic... the Consuls are like satellite offices of the Embassies.

So, if I were 3I, I'd send an Embassy to the Darrians and the Zhodani and a Legation to the Solomani Confederation (as I don't really officially recognize it).

Good stuff

 

[Antares Administration]

Originally posted by kaladorn:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Antares Administration:
Let's start off with a very basic question - What is an Imperial diplomatic office outside the Imperial space called? Embassy? Consulate? Legation? Something else?

Consulate: The residence or official premises of a consul.
....

So, it seems to me the order of importance is:

Embassy
Legation
Consul

But I'm only sort of guessing as Legation and Consul both seem to be less than an Embassy, but perhaps they differ in character rather than rank.

(PS - source is dictionary.reference.com) </font>[/QUOTE]Thanks for all of the above reference material. (And from a local source, too!)

More specifically, I was wondering if there was any convention specific to Traveller, primarily for the 3rd Imperium, but also for the other states.

I can see that 3I and Sol Confed would follow 'Terran' tradition. What about the Zhodani?

As far as the other races go:

a. Hivers are very 'direct democracy' in their approach to government, even on an interstellar scale. The Topical Clubs have assumed the role of 'Office of Primary Interest', so it would make sense that a Topical Club specializing in Imperial policy would be the inter-societal point of contact between the 3I and Hiver polities.

b. Vargr suffer a similar complexity, but theirs is because of autonomous or semi-autonomous 'groups', not unlike an Afghan or Somali warlord. The appropriate Clan leader or an appointed lieutenant would be the 'emissary'.

c. Aslan government is described as the 'League of Nations' in Aliens module 1. The Iroquois Confederacy might be a better analogy. The heirarchy is family, pride, clan, tlaukhu in ascending order. However, the tlaukhu makes no law, it is merely a body for discussion and dispute resolution. AM 1 does mention that 'envoys' acting as agents of a clan or corporation watch out for the interests of the entity which they represent. Would it therefore be reasonable to assume that the tlaukhu of the Hierate might have an 'Envoy' to the Iridium Throne?

d. The K'kree are the other extreme. The 2000 Worlds has a very rigid heirarchical government, with all entities answering to the Steppelord of the 2000 Worlds. I would assume that as part of his government, the Steppelord of the 2000 Worlds would nominate members of his herd to act as ambassadors and envoys - they would be the most directly under his command.

Paul Nemeth
AA

 

[Antares Administration]

Here's the situation that drives my questions:

Starfall is an independant planet, with a population of about 800K, located about 20 parsecs rimward of the Imperial frontier in the Glimmerdrift Reaches. There is a small amount of trade with the 3I (+/- 3% of total planetary trade). Imperial, Solomani, and Hiver citizens live and work on Starfall (none in excessive numbers), as do Sydites, Vargr and Aslan (in numbers approx 100).

I'm the Director of Foreign Relations on the Executive Board of Starfall (i.e. the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Secretary of State, etc.). What representation from foreign interstellar powers do I have resident at Starfall Capital?

When I think of an "Imperial Embassy", it's to:

a. major interstellar powers with whom I have contact/relations (Zhodani, Aslan),

b. quasi-independant multi-system bodies within my own borders (Vegan Autonomy, Khuur League),

c. pocket empires in close proximity to the Imperium, or in strategic locations (Darrian Confederation, Glimmerdrift Trade Consortium).

Starfall is less than any of those.

I'm nowhere near the Zhodani or Aslan, so assume no formal representation at the planetary level from those powers.

The Imperium is about 3 months away by J-2, and there are Solomani sympathizers on Starfall. Does that rate an embassy or just a consulate? And would that be what they're called in the Imperial context? The Terran example would dictate that it's the function, not the size, that matters. So even if the office only has two staff, it would still be an Embassy. The representative of the Iridium Throne would still be 'The Ambassador'.

The Hivers have representation through the Landing City Topical Club and the Gau-Kee-Twi Topical Club on the closest Hiver client state in the Crucis Margin. There ought to be a "Manipulator" or two between them.

The Solomani would have no formal representation, as this single world is about 80 parsecs away from the closest Solomani border, i.e. about a year's travel at J-2. But you could probably expect a few agents of the Solomani government to be working there.

The Khuur have one concentration of a few hundred transient workers on the planet, so they maintain a "Cultural Office" on Starfall.

The local pocket empires would have embassies: GTC, Stoner, Farreach Margravate, and Federate Republic. They all trade extensively with Starfall, and their citizens travel back and forth extensively. The same would hold for other major independant planets in the region, like Cinxtha, Lunber, the worlds of the Starfall Cluster (the worlds within 4 parsecs) and others.

Does that make sense?

Paul Nemeth
AA

 

[kaladorn]

Give the Imperials a small embassy (ambassador, his secretary, some local security), the Solomani an honorary consul (an expat who has some gov't contacts at the nearest real embassy), and the Hivers I think you have about right.

 

[jchurchill]

The Imperium is about 3 months away by J-2, and there are Solomani sympathizers on Starfall. Does that rate an embassy or just a consulate?
==============================================
Sounds more like Legation status to me...not important enough for an embassy.

Also, under long accepted practice, one does not have a consulate unless there is an embassy in the country [or planet or star system or whatever you might have...]

 

[Anthony]

Originally posted by Antares Administration:
I'm the Director of Foreign Relations on the Executive Board of Starfall (i.e. the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Secretary of State, etc.). What representation from foreign interstellar powers do I have resident at Starfall Capital?

There are probably _no_ dedicated diplomats to be found, except possibly by your closest neighbors. Diplomatic contact is probably handled by merchants. If you want to talk to an Imperial diplomat, you probably go by ship to the nearest major world, where there is a consulate.

Frankly, 800,000 people are just not important enough to rate much attention, unless Starfall happens to be in a location that is militarily important.

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by secretagent:
Sounds more like Legation status to me...not important enough for an embassy. [/QB]

Though you said those were for governments you didn't officially recognize? As long as the government is legit, wouldn't you get an embassy, even if a small one?

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by Anthony:
Frankly, 800,000 people are just not important enough to rate much attention, unless Starfall happens to be in a location that is militarily important. [/QB]

Unless of course it is on a major trade route or Xboat route. Then you might be important merely as a transit hub.

 

[Anthony]

In practice, any location that's a trade hub is militarily important (and will probably have more than 800,000 people), but yes, the point is legit. As it's an extra-Imperial worldlet, it can't be an X-boat hub.

 

[jchurchill]

Though you said those were for governments you didn't officially recognize? As long as the government is legit, wouldn't you get an embassy, even if a small one?
===============================================

A fair question. Actually my response was semi-facetious. [quasi-facetious?]

But then what is a "legit" government? Is it legitimate in the eyes of the Imperium or whatever your major powers are? A number of small powers/minor powers in the Great Game [see generally Kim -- R. Kipling] might recognize the government as legitimate while the great powers may not.

If the recognizing power wants to put the lesser power in its place it might deem its representatives "a legation" rather than an embassy. [Compare our "Military Mission" to occupied Yugoslavia or the USSR during the 2nd World War]

Another way to view it is to think of the legation as the 19th century equiv. of the rank of commodore. Today a mostly disused ot honorary title -- except in my game/TU.

That really doesn't clear that up much does it...just gives you insight into the convoluted ways I rip off 19th century history to build my universe...

 

[Antares Administration]

Actually, it does strike very close to the way that I imagined it would happen. In spite of its position astride the J-2 routes through the Beta Quadrant of the Glimmerdrift, Starfall is not "significant" to the major powers, at least not "formally".

Informally, it's a little like Geneva or Vienna at the height of the Cold War, i.e. it's a place where quite a bit of informal contact takes place. The major powers all have a reason not to deal through the pocket empires, but a well-positioned independant world is just the thing!

Thanks,

Paul Nemeth
AA

 

[jchurchill]

Or Portugal/Spain in 2nd World War?

The gadgets change but basic human behaviour does not. We evolve very slowly, don't we?