Best Mechanics + Favorite Setting

[Gallowglass]

Originally posted by T. Foster:
Allow me to inaugurate the new MT board by proclaiming (yet again) that MT is the best ruleset yet published for Traveller (or, rather, would be if not for the errata and confusing explanations -- aw heck, let's rephrase it -- MT has the best mechanical base of any version of Traveller published to date) and the Rebellion is my favorite OTU milieu setting. I play in the Imperial Core (Massilia) so I don't need to worry about the vargr and aslan incursions and therefore I don't!

Come on you MT and/or Rebellion lovers, show me I'm not the only one!

Part of me wants to agree whole heartedly, but then I remember all the grief I have had explaining interrupts and the damage mechanisms to players over the years, and the amount of head scratching that those design sequences caused...

The early part of the setting was a great step forward (as was the end in concept, my objection to Virus etc has always been the execution, not the concept) and I loved the basic framework of the rules: there were some additions over CT that were excellent. But I still find it looses out in my estimation becuase of the confusing explanations and excessive complexity of things like the combat system.

With a substantial edit to clarify the presentation and streamline the rules, and some judicious rewrites (personal combat, simplified design sequences to sit under the existing ones) it would be pretty much the perfect Traveller rules IMO and the early Rebellion, one of those vertiginous moments in history when suddenly anything is possible and everything is at stake, is pretty much a perfect backdrop for an SF game in the classic Traveller style.

Has there been any further rumuour of the possible re-issue of MT on CD? IIRC it did not look like a high priority for MWM/FFE but we live in hope...

Cheers,

Nick Middleton

 

[Merchant Reaper]

MT is my favorite as well. How the Rebellion started and ended never bothered me, after i rewrote them to my satisfaction. I also didn't mind doing everything in the Spinward Marches either. I have maps for a lot of sectors, but I wanted my campaigns away from the Core so no one would get the idea of becoming emperor themselves. Replacing ArchDuke Norris was OK, even though it never happened in my games.

The mechanics were/are like every other game system, it has strengths and weaknesses. I make do with it just fine. Besides, right now I am only running an MT game for my two oldest kids. As long as they keep having fun they don't care about the rules being "messed up". They have too many Zhodani problems in the Jewell Sector to worry about game mechanics.

 

[Merchant Reaper]

MT is my favorite as well. How the Rebellion started and ended never bothered me, after i rewrote them to my satisfaction. I also didn't mind doing everything in the Spinward Marches either. I have maps for a lot of sectors, but I wanted my campaigns away from the Core so no one would get the idea of becoming emperor themselves. Replacing ArchDuke Norris was OK, even though it never happened in my games.

The mechanics were/are like every other game system, it has strengths and weaknesses. I make do with it just fine. Besides, right now I am only running an MT game for my two oldest kids. As long as they keep having fun they don't care about the rules being "messed up". They have too many Zhodani problems in the Jewell Sector to worry about game mechanics.

 

[Merchant Reaper]

MT is my favorite as well. How the Rebellion started and ended never bothered me, after i rewrote them to my satisfaction. I also didn't mind doing everything in the Spinward Marches either. I have maps for a lot of sectors, but I wanted my campaigns away from the Core so no one would get the idea of becoming emperor themselves. Replacing ArchDuke Norris was OK, even though it never happened in my games.

The mechanics were/are like every other game system, it has strengths and weaknesses. I make do with it just fine. Besides, right now I am only running an MT game for my two oldest kids. As long as they keep having fun they don't care about the rules being "messed up". They have too many Zhodani problems in the Jewell Sector to worry about game mechanics.

 

[clementk]

Originally posted by Gallowglass:

Has there been any further rumuour of the possible re-issue of MT on CD? IIRC it did not look like a high priority for MWM/FFE but we live in hope...

As in PDF or similar format? Interesting but considering there's not been anything similar from FFE I'd think a paper reprint would appear first.

I would buy an errata corrected reprint of MT ala the recent TW2K reprint but it might be easier to release T5.

That being said the Imperial Encyclopedia and Rebellion Sourcebook from MT are two of the most used Traveller books in my collection, esp. the IE.

Casey

 

[clementk]

Originally posted by Gallowglass:

Has there been any further rumuour of the possible re-issue of MT on CD? IIRC it did not look like a high priority for MWM/FFE but we live in hope...

As in PDF or similar format? Interesting but considering there's not been anything similar from FFE I'd think a paper reprint would appear first.

I would buy an errata corrected reprint of MT ala the recent TW2K reprint but it might be easier to release T5.

That being said the Imperial Encyclopedia and Rebellion Sourcebook from MT are two of the most used Traveller books in my collection, esp. the IE.

Casey

 

[clementk]

Originally posted by Gallowglass:

Has there been any further rumuour of the possible re-issue of MT on CD? IIRC it did not look like a high priority for MWM/FFE but we live in hope...

As in PDF or similar format? Interesting but considering there's not been anything similar from FFE I'd think a paper reprint would appear first.

I would buy an errata corrected reprint of MT ala the recent TW2K reprint but it might be easier to release T5.

That being said the Imperial Encyclopedia and Rebellion Sourcebook from MT are two of the most used Traveller books in my collection, esp. the IE.

Casey

 

[T. Foster]

Here is the most recent info from Avery/MWM on a possible MT reprint CD. I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata).

Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much. He's been unenthusiastic about reprinting it, and even less enthusiastic (downright resistant, in fact) towards the possibility of using it (rather than T4) as a basis for T^5.

 

[T. Foster]

Here is the most recent info from Avery/MWM on a possible MT reprint CD. I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata).

Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much. He's been unenthusiastic about reprinting it, and even less enthusiastic (downright resistant, in fact) towards the possibility of using it (rather than T4) as a basis for T^5.

 

[T. Foster]

Here is the most recent info from Avery/MWM on a possible MT reprint CD. I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata).

Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much. He's been unenthusiastic about reprinting it, and even less enthusiastic (downright resistant, in fact) towards the possibility of using it (rather than T4) as a basis for T^5.

 

[Whipsnade]

"I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata)."


Sir,

What a shame. I switched over to MT's task system just as soon as I saw it. Whatever problems I may have with the MT *setting* and however much errata MT produced, it was still a nifty product.

"Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much."

That's a question I've never recieved a satisfactory (to me anyway) answer to; are MT, and it's heir TNE, loathed by Traveller's creator?

Look at the events since GDW closed up shop; all the new releases of Traveller; T4, GURPS, T20, every one of them vetted by MWM and every one of them studiously ignores the MT-TNE timeline! (yes, M:1248 will address the old seeting, but M:1248 will arrive more than a decade after the end of GDW and well after many other Traveller releases).

One of the greatest strengths of Our Olde Game, this vast sweeping timeline with it's continuing story, has been dropped. Every Traveller product published with MWM's blessing since GDW's demise either deals with Traveller's past or with an alternate history, NONE deal with the official timeline. Our game about the Far Future seems to be ignoring it's own future!

"He's been unenthusiastic about reprinting it, and even less enthusiastic (downright resistant, in fact) towards the possibility of using it (rather than T4) as a basis for T^5."

Good Sweet Strephon! I wouldn't use T4 for anything but lining the bottoms of birdcages!

Sure, MT had its problems, but T4 didn't? Comparing MT's ills to T4's ills is akin to comparing acne to the bubonic plague. Quite frankly T4 was an embarassment to the RPG hobby. An RPG released in the 70s, back when this hobby was new, may have gotten away with the incrediably awful production values, shamelessly shoddy work, and creakily ancient ideas that the T4 materials embodied, but that sort of thing didn't fly in the 90s and certainly won't fly in the 00s.

IMEHO, the only thing T4 can be used for is as an overall guideline for how NOT to make T5.


Sincerely,
Larsen

 

[Whipsnade]

"I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata)."


Sir,

What a shame. I switched over to MT's task system just as soon as I saw it. Whatever problems I may have with the MT *setting* and however much errata MT produced, it was still a nifty product.

"Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much."

That's a question I've never recieved a satisfactory (to me anyway) answer to; are MT, and it's heir TNE, loathed by Traveller's creator?

Look at the events since GDW closed up shop; all the new releases of Traveller; T4, GURPS, T20, every one of them vetted by MWM and every one of them studiously ignores the MT-TNE timeline! (yes, M:1248 will address the old seeting, but M:1248 will arrive more than a decade after the end of GDW and well after many other Traveller releases).

One of the greatest strengths of Our Olde Game, this vast sweeping timeline with it's continuing story, has been dropped. Every Traveller product published with MWM's blessing since GDW's demise either deals with Traveller's past or with an alternate history, NONE deal with the official timeline. Our game about the Far Future seems to be ignoring it's own future!

"He's been unenthusiastic about reprinting it, and even less enthusiastic (downright resistant, in fact) towards the possibility of using it (rather than T4) as a basis for T^5."

Good Sweet Strephon! I wouldn't use T4 for anything but lining the bottoms of birdcages!

Sure, MT had its problems, but T4 didn't? Comparing MT's ills to T4's ills is akin to comparing acne to the bubonic plague. Quite frankly T4 was an embarassment to the RPG hobby. An RPG released in the 70s, back when this hobby was new, may have gotten away with the incrediably awful production values, shamelessly shoddy work, and creakily ancient ideas that the T4 materials embodied, but that sort of thing didn't fly in the 90s and certainly won't fly in the 00s.

IMEHO, the only thing T4 can be used for is as an overall guideline for how NOT to make T5.


Sincerely,
Larsen

 

[Whipsnade]

"I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata)."


Sir,

What a shame. I switched over to MT's task system just as soon as I saw it. Whatever problems I may have with the MT *setting* and however much errata MT produced, it was still a nifty product.

"Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much."

That's a question I've never recieved a satisfactory (to me anyway) answer to; are MT, and it's heir TNE, loathed by Traveller's creator?

Look at the events since GDW closed up shop; all the new releases of Traveller; T4, GURPS, T20, every one of them vetted by MWM and every one of them studiously ignores the MT-TNE timeline! (yes, M:1248 will address the old seeting, but M:1248 will arrive more than a decade after the end of GDW and well after many other Traveller releases).

One of the greatest strengths of Our Olde Game, this vast sweeping timeline with it's continuing story, has been dropped. Every Traveller product published with MWM's blessing since GDW's demise either deals with Traveller's past or with an alternate history, NONE deal with the official timeline. Our game about the Far Future seems to be ignoring it's own future!

"He's been unenthusiastic about reprinting it, and even less enthusiastic (downright resistant, in fact) towards the possibility of using it (rather than T4) as a basis for T^5."

Good Sweet Strephon! I wouldn't use T4 for anything but lining the bottoms of birdcages!

Sure, MT had its problems, but T4 didn't? Comparing MT's ills to T4's ills is akin to comparing acne to the bubonic plague. Quite frankly T4 was an embarassment to the RPG hobby. An RPG released in the 70s, back when this hobby was new, may have gotten away with the incrediably awful production values, shamelessly shoddy work, and creakily ancient ideas that the T4 materials embodied, but that sort of thing didn't fly in the 90s and certainly won't fly in the 00s.

IMEHO, the only thing T4 can be used for is as an overall guideline for how NOT to make T5.


Sincerely,
Larsen

 

[clementk]

Originally posted by T. Foster:
Here is the most recent info from Avery/MWM on a possible MT reprint CD.

Ok. For that matter I would buy electronic versions of other Traveller products as well, esp. the core rules and any frequently referenced books. Not sure if any of this is doable anytime soon with the current reprints having top prioroty. Though I'd guess the process of making the reprints would need an electronic version at some point unless it's all done mechanically.

Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much.

Well I certainly did like the idea of Milieu Zero but I would buy a MT reprint and am looking forward to the new TNE book.

Offhand most of the TNE books seem to be easy enough to find still and had less errata then MT so I'm not too interested in a TNE reprint.

It's been a while since I examined T4's system and I'm looking over T5 but IIRC T4 had a wider range of chargen options than MT or CT in the core book, which I liked.

Casey

 

[clementk]

Originally posted by T. Foster:
Here is the most recent info from Avery/MWM on a possible MT reprint CD.

Ok. For that matter I would buy electronic versions of other Traveller products as well, esp. the core rules and any frequently referenced books. Not sure if any of this is doable anytime soon with the current reprints having top prioroty. Though I'd guess the process of making the reprints would need an electronic version at some point unless it's all done mechanically.

Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much.

Well I certainly did like the idea of Milieu Zero but I would buy a MT reprint and am looking forward to the new TNE book.

Offhand most of the TNE books seem to be easy enough to find still and had less errata then MT so I'm not too interested in a TNE reprint.

It's been a while since I examined T4's system and I'm looking over T5 but IIRC T4 had a wider range of chargen options than MT or CT in the core book, which I liked.

Casey

 

[clementk]

Originally posted by T. Foster:
Here is the most recent info from Avery/MWM on a possible MT reprint CD.

Ok. For that matter I would buy electronic versions of other Traveller products as well, esp. the core rules and any frequently referenced books. Not sure if any of this is doable anytime soon with the current reprints having top prioroty. Though I'd guess the process of making the reprints would need an electronic version at some point unless it's all done mechanically.

Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much.

Well I certainly did like the idea of Milieu Zero but I would buy a MT reprint and am looking forward to the new TNE book.

Offhand most of the TNE books seem to be easy enough to find still and had less errata then MT so I'm not too interested in a TNE reprint.

It's been a while since I examined T4's system and I'm looking over T5 but IIRC T4 had a wider range of chargen options than MT or CT in the core book, which I liked.

Casey

 

[William]

Originally posted by Larsen E. Whipsnade:
"I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata)."


Sir,

What a shame. I switched over to MT's task system just as soon as I saw it. Whatever problems I may have with the MT *setting* and however much errata MT produced, it was still a nifty product.

"Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much."

That's a question I've never recieved a satisfactory (to me anyway) answer to; are MT, and it's heir TNE, loathed by Traveller's creator?
(snip)

Sincerely,
Larsen

Larsen,

The problem is that, in a very real way, MT is not a GDW product. Remember that even the task system that those of us on this board so dearly love was created, instead, by DGP. Now the folks at DGP truely loved Traveller and had more than a few good ideas, however Marc and company (literally) were far more interested in their other projects (T2K, 2300, C&D, etc) to put more than cursory interest into MT. This lack of real editorial oversight (sorry, Mr. Fugate if you ever read this, you tried hard but still failed.) lead to all of the varied canonical and errata related ills of MT. These varied failures did wiegh heavily upon, at least, Mr. Miller and Mr. Wiseman from various comments I have heard from them both. These are all, however, pieced together like an old Soviet watcher scoping out the latest May Day parade photos to see who is standing next to Comrad Joe.

When GDW tried to reassert itself, the result was (and this is major IIUC territory) TNE. The rather vehement reaction in the fan base has, I fear, colored it in some ways. OTOH, it remains the "official" timeline and the GT timeline remains an "alternate".

In the end, MT is and I believe always will be, the red-headed bastard stepchild from Carolina of the game industry. Because of the "negative waves" once created, I will count myself lucky if the files I once got from the good general ever recieve official sanction again.

I hope this is of some help to understanding the mess that is MT.

William

 

[William]

Originally posted by Larsen E. Whipsnade:
"I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata)."


Sir,

What a shame. I switched over to MT's task system just as soon as I saw it. Whatever problems I may have with the MT *setting* and however much errata MT produced, it was still a nifty product.

"Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much."

That's a question I've never recieved a satisfactory (to me anyway) answer to; are MT, and it's heir TNE, loathed by Traveller's creator?
(snip)

Sincerely,
Larsen

Larsen,

The problem is that, in a very real way, MT is not a GDW product. Remember that even the task system that those of us on this board so dearly love was created, instead, by DGP. Now the folks at DGP truely loved Traveller and had more than a few good ideas, however Marc and company (literally) were far more interested in their other projects (T2K, 2300, C&D, etc) to put more than cursory interest into MT. This lack of real editorial oversight (sorry, Mr. Fugate if you ever read this, you tried hard but still failed.) lead to all of the varied canonical and errata related ills of MT. These varied failures did wiegh heavily upon, at least, Mr. Miller and Mr. Wiseman from various comments I have heard from them both. These are all, however, pieced together like an old Soviet watcher scoping out the latest May Day parade photos to see who is standing next to Comrad Joe.

When GDW tried to reassert itself, the result was (and this is major IIUC territory) TNE. The rather vehement reaction in the fan base has, I fear, colored it in some ways. OTOH, it remains the "official" timeline and the GT timeline remains an "alternate".

In the end, MT is and I believe always will be, the red-headed bastard stepchild from Carolina of the game industry. Because of the "negative waves" once created, I will count myself lucky if the files I once got from the good general ever recieve official sanction again.

I hope this is of some help to understanding the mess that is MT.

William

 

[William]

Originally posted by Larsen E. Whipsnade:
"I imagine he thinks there isn't enough demand to make a dead-tree reprint profitable (especially after the added expense of incorporating all the errata)."


Sir,

What a shame. I switched over to MT's task system just as soon as I saw it. Whatever problems I may have with the MT *setting* and however much errata MT produced, it was still a nifty product.

"Alas, Marc Miller just doesn't seem to like MT very much."

That's a question I've never recieved a satisfactory (to me anyway) answer to; are MT, and it's heir TNE, loathed by Traveller's creator?
(snip)

Sincerely,
Larsen

Larsen,

The problem is that, in a very real way, MT is not a GDW product. Remember that even the task system that those of us on this board so dearly love was created, instead, by DGP. Now the folks at DGP truely loved Traveller and had more than a few good ideas, however Marc and company (literally) were far more interested in their other projects (T2K, 2300, C&D, etc) to put more than cursory interest into MT. This lack of real editorial oversight (sorry, Mr. Fugate if you ever read this, you tried hard but still failed.) lead to all of the varied canonical and errata related ills of MT. These varied failures did wiegh heavily upon, at least, Mr. Miller and Mr. Wiseman from various comments I have heard from them both. These are all, however, pieced together like an old Soviet watcher scoping out the latest May Day parade photos to see who is standing next to Comrad Joe.

When GDW tried to reassert itself, the result was (and this is major IIUC territory) TNE. The rather vehement reaction in the fan base has, I fear, colored it in some ways. OTOH, it remains the "official" timeline and the GT timeline remains an "alternate".

In the end, MT is and I believe always will be, the red-headed bastard stepchild from Carolina of the game industry. Because of the "negative waves" once created, I will count myself lucky if the files I once got from the good general ever recieve official sanction again.

I hope this is of some help to understanding the mess that is MT.

William

 

[Sophiathegreen]

I think the idear of the rebellion was dumd in the first place. Let the GM run any rebellion it he or she want to. In the Classic Traveller we talk about this also you might want to look in there also. I didnot understand the Task Resoultion system they have in megra-traveller, than less accurate but simpler system might have being better.