Actual dTon of a Space Viking Nemesis?
- Thread starter Quint
- Start date
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
That's a big fuel bill.
Pretty big, but IIRC fuel wasn't an issue in that universe (Atomic power -- too cheap to meter, right?). Has to be pretty big though, as it was meant to be more than a match for entire planets of TL-6 or so.
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
I remember in Perry Rhodan, commentary was that the one mile dreadnought sphere was supposedly large enough to sardinize the population of Earth.
We tend to blame Star Wars for the "Big Ship Universe" of Book 5 and later, but it's worth remembering the sheer scale of 'big ships' in lots of early scifi...
D.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
I liked how EE Doc Smith escalated his ship sizes...
and in Lensmen they went from battleships to throwing anti-universe FTL planets through hyperspace at the bad guys...
and in Lensmen they went from battleships to throwing anti-universe FTL planets through hyperspace at the bad guys...
I blame it for a 'big ship' universe where fighters also exist and apparently work.
kilemall
SOC-14 5K
Depends on whether you make rules to make it so. In my CT/HG fighters can create EW screens, get suicidally close to fire energy weapons with greater effect, tie their fire control to ships they escort for higher computer fire for PD shots, or accelerate and lend their inertia to missile vee and thus do more damage/penetration.
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Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
You have to look at weapon system effects, and potential casualty estimates.
I'm working to establish the light bomber as the principle spacetime strike craft for the Confederation Navy.
I'm working to establish the light bomber as the principle spacetime strike craft for the Confederation Navy.
I was attempting a joke about Star Wars, and blaming it for 'fighters' in Traveller (their existence implies that they're supposed to be useful), not making commentary on whether the things do actually work in Traveller. Prior to Star Wars, space opera didn't go in for fighters in space much. After it they're all over the place, like fleas on a dog.
[And to finish ruining the joke by over-explaining]
Now, having 'fighters' (really 'space torpedo-bombers', but hey) and big capital ships can make sense if the setting is in a transition between one fleet type and the other - as happened in WWII (which is what settings with both are almost always copying). But that's not what most SF with both shows - like in Star Wars itself, where both co-exist at the very least from some years before Episode IV through to Episode IX, a good four decades.
If fighters can kill battleships, what the hell do you build the latter for? You have carriers (as small and cheap as is practical - which might be quite large), and various escorts (if the fighters aren't able to do that too), and assorted transports, logisitcs, etc., but not large warships that aren't fighter carriers.
If they can't, the fighters and their carriers are just meat for the battleships. Now, you might, in the latter case, have escort carriers and a few fighters if they're useful for picket duties (but you'd think a ship with a crew large enough for 24/7 watches would be better) or killing small ships, but they shouldn't be all over the sky.
In neither case does it seem likely that the godforsaken 'battlecarrier' popularised by Battlestar Galactica will make any sort of sense (the same goes for SW's star destroyer's habit of carrying significant numbers of fighters, though I can make a case for them in the imperial era). A carrier should avoid battle with large ships, and so should not waste mass and volume on heavy armour and heavy weapons. A battleship, being intended for that sort of fight, should not be carrying fighter hangers into close combat where they'll just get mangled (or have to be under massive armour, a huge mass penalty).
[And to finish ruining the joke by over-explaining]
Now, having 'fighters' (really 'space torpedo-bombers', but hey) and big capital ships can make sense if the setting is in a transition between one fleet type and the other - as happened in WWII (which is what settings with both are almost always copying). But that's not what most SF with both shows - like in Star Wars itself, where both co-exist at the very least from some years before Episode IV through to Episode IX, a good four decades.
If fighters can kill battleships, what the hell do you build the latter for? You have carriers (as small and cheap as is practical - which might be quite large), and various escorts (if the fighters aren't able to do that too), and assorted transports, logisitcs, etc., but not large warships that aren't fighter carriers.
If they can't, the fighters and their carriers are just meat for the battleships. Now, you might, in the latter case, have escort carriers and a few fighters if they're useful for picket duties (but you'd think a ship with a crew large enough for 24/7 watches would be better) or killing small ships, but they shouldn't be all over the sky.
In neither case does it seem likely that the godforsaken 'battlecarrier' popularised by Battlestar Galactica will make any sort of sense (the same goes for SW's star destroyer's habit of carrying significant numbers of fighters, though I can make a case for them in the imperial era). A carrier should avoid battle with large ships, and so should not waste mass and volume on heavy armour and heavy weapons. A battleship, being intended for that sort of fight, should not be carrying fighter hangers into close combat where they'll just get mangled (or have to be under massive armour, a huge mass penalty).
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
Rock, paper, scissors.
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
Take an acceleration factor/fifteen advanced torpedo.
Replace the warhead with depleted uranium.
Kamikaze that into a battleship.
Replace the warhead with depleted uranium.
Kamikaze that into a battleship.
Badenov
SOC-12
These hulls are constructed/armored to resist nuclear weapons, I am not convinced a KE weapon can hit it that hard.
kilemall
SOC-14 5K
I went through the CT missile supplement, derived the basic joules the kinetic impact the missile body does if it succeeds in actually hitting the target and compared it to the atomic rockets boom table.
Gets into battleship shell territory quickly. Given the average ACS that is plenty.
Extrapolation by the LBB5 black globe energy valuation yields the possibility of nuclear level damage by a kinetic hit.
