CT Only: Zhodani Proles

[McPerth]

All good points. But remember, there is a trace of elitism among the Zhodani Noble Class. At least in CT (IIRC), while a young Prole can be promoted to Intendant (or even ultimately to Noble if successful in the Games) for a high PSR, the child of a Noble, even if he/she has a low PSR, is still a Noble (i.e. they are not "demoted" to Prole because of lack of talent). So it is not quite as egalitarian/meritocratic as it might at first appear.

Zhodani inheritance rules are not (AFAIK) described in Traveller.

Do all noble's offspring be nobles? Who inherits the title? the firstborn? the one with highest PSI? other choice?

See that if all are nobles, with the new nobles at each Games, the noble part of the population will keep growing...

Do intendants' offspring inherit the intendant status?

Same comment here...

 

[whulorigan]

Zhodani inheritance rules are not (AFAIK) described in Traveller.

Do all noble's offspring be nobles? Who inherits the title? the firstborn? the one with highest PSI? other choice?

See that if all are nobles, with the new nobles at each Games, the noble part of the population will keep growing...

Do intendants' offspring inherit the intendant status?

Same comment here...

I am going form memory (I do not have a reference in front of me), but if I recall the answer to those questions were given somewhere specifically as yes (though perhaps not in CT materials - it might have been GT or MgT). Nobles (and Intendants) generally having few children for that reason, and also noting that the Noble population for that reason does slowly grow over time.

 

[Meteoric Assault]

I am going form memory (I do not have a reference in front of me), but if I recall the answer to those questions were given somewhere specifically as yes (though perhaps not in CT materials - it might have been GT or MgT). Nobles (and Intendants) generally having few children for that reason, and also noting that the Noble population for that reason does slowly grow over time.

Nobles procreate Nobles that was pretty much alluded to in Alien Modules and Contact. Intendants I really don't have a point of reference on .... I would guess that intendants would have the ability to have their children psionically trained, or is that a stretch to far?

 

[aramis]

Nobles procreate Nobles that was pretty much alluded to in Alien Modules and Contact. Intendants I really don't have a point of reference on .... I would guess that intendants would have the ability to have their children psionically trained, or is that a stretch to far?

Intendants' kids are intendants, and thus psionically trained.

CT AM 4 reads:

Intendants' ambition centers around elevation to the Noble
class, through participation in the Psionic Games (about one Intendant
in seven is elevated to the Nobility in this way), or as a reward for faithful service in later life (about two Intendants in seven are elevated at the end of their careers).​

There is a healthy implication here that nobles tend not to self-replace. So, maybe 1.6 children per noble couple?

 

[Meteoric Assault]

Intendants' kids are intendants, and thus psionically trained.

CT AM 4 reads:

Intendants' ambition centers around elevation to the Noble
class, through participation in the Psionic Games (about one Intendant
in seven is elevated to the Nobility in this way), or as a reward for faithful service in later life (about two Intendants in seven are elevated at the end of their careers).​

There is a healthy implication here that nobles tend not to self-replace. So, maybe 1.6 children per noble couple?

Aramis can you give a reference for the Intendants children being intendants? I am scanning AM:4 presently. Anyway Next week I am going to start a thread on intendants...

 

[aramis]

Aramis can you give a reference for the Intendants children being intendants? I am scanning AM:4 presently. Anyway Next week I am going to start a thread on intendants...

Simple: Initial character gen provides that Soc A is intendant, and is pre-testing. (Because testing is done, and raises soc to A, after initial gen.) It's possible for an intendant to have a Psi as low as 2.

Look at the process on p 26

 

[Meteoric Assault]

Simple: Initial character gen provides that Soc A is intendant, and is pre-testing. (Because testing is done, and raises soc to A, after initial gen.) It's possible for an intendant to have a Psi as low as 2.

Look at the process on p 26

I saw in AM:4 that it is pretty much as you said on p44.

 

[epicenter00]

I've noticed that people on the thread seem to assume the Zhodani are different and somehow inherently evil.

While they're vilified by the Imperium, I think it's more interesting to think of the the Zhodani as not evil but different. Very different. In fact, despite being humans, they're so different, they're probably the most alien of the races in Traveller, human or not. The society postulated in GDW's materials would have far-reaching implications that I don't think even GDW has handled well.

One of the question I've had for a while (but never had an opportunity to ask) - does any supplement ever give the demographics of the castes of the Zhodani? I'd prefer it to be "true" GDW material as opposed to DGP or SJG stuff - I understand that stuff is canon in varying amounts, but I consider GDW stuff to be the "most canon." (For instance, what if the population of the Zhodani was like 20% Noble, 50% Intendant, 30% Prole or something even more subversive like ... when we think of "noble" we think elite but what if 50% of Zhodani society are Nobles?)

The Zhodani should understand psionics far better than the Imperium does. We should assume they have far better methods of testing for psionic strength than the Imperium does; we might even go so far as to say that Zhodani chargen rules may not actually be accurate for how the Zhodani would really be like. It seems somehow unlikely to me that many Zhodani would be slipping through the cracks when it comes to psionic testing.

The power and rank that proles can achieve is probably directly in proportion to the percentage of the population that proles make up.

If "most" of the population of the Consulate are proles, then they probably rise quite high by their talents; there's simply insufficient psions to fill all the slots. In this case, I think a reasonable explanation is that the idea of Enlisted / NCO / Officer is probably a clumsy translation of Zhodani terms being forced to fit into Imperial rank structures, which in turn has fostered a completely wrong-headed idea of what the ranks actually do. Perhaps to the Zhodani the ranks are natural and would work quite differently - Proles might rise to positions we'd consider quite powerful: Admirals or Generals (or even CEOs of companies), though most would not (just like in our world). To the rank structure in the Imperial mind, these would still be "NCO" type ranks. In the Zhodani military, such proles might even give orders to nobles and intendant specialists on the battlefield ("we need to cause some havoc in the Imperial rear-lines, please take your squad of Consulate Guard and hit them where you think it'd do the most damage. Read my mind for my strategic assessment and good fortune."). The "officer" would actually simply be a fellow who visits the CEO periodically, perhaps once a day, once a week, or something and psychologically ensures the mental health and fitness of the prole for the job and otherwise doesn't interfere with the prole's job. It is like an NCO/Officer relationship in that even the lowest ranked 'commander' can remove the highest ranked prole from a job, but only within the confines of the commander's authority (eg; the prole isn't fit for the job anymore because he's cracking under the stress and needs to have time and attention of psionic surgeons to return him to mental health).

Though of course, even that assessment might be off - the officers of the Zhodani nobles and intendants might actually run everything. Men and women with strategic command skills would sit in the same commander's room, look at the situation reports, formulate ideas on how to proceed. The "general" would quickly read the minds of all of his/her prole "talents" and proceed from there.

Similarly, if the percentage of proles in the population is very small and the Intendants perhaps outnumber them, then proles have less and less power and perhaps fulfill roles of skilled artisans and IT professionals - the Zhodani are a technologically advanced people and seem to have much less of a stigma of using robots than the Imperium so proles are probably less likely grunt laborers and instead technicians repairing, programming, and directing gangs of robots who do the actual labor.

But woe be to the intendant who commits a crime. They are reeducated and sent to proles... I have a feeling they are more than likely executed.

This is a total denial of everything Zhodani culture is, though.

Criminals are not bad people in Zhodani society. They're people who are sick and they get cured. Just like nobody in your office lambasts you for having been the guy with the flu four years ago, after you're cured, nobody lambasts you for the crime you committed, either. The Taverchedl' ensures it. (though I guess they do practice execution for certain illnesses.)

And I'm pretty sure the Taverchedl' still watches over Intendants. Apparently their reach is limited among Nobles (something that doesn't make any sense and probably means the nobles are the most class of Zhodani society that needs to be looked at most closely).

 

[Meteoric Assault]

I've noticed that people on the thread seem to assume the Zhodani are different and somehow inherently evil.

While they're vilified by the Imperium, I think it's more interesting to think of the the Zhodani as not evil but different. Very different. In fact, despite being humans, they're so different, they're probably the most alien of the races in Traveller, human or not. The society postulated in GDW's materials would have far-reaching implications that I don't think even GDW has handled well.

One of the question I've had for a while (but never had an opportunity to ask) - does any supplement ever give the demographics of the castes of the Zhodani? I'd prefer it to be "true" GDW material as opposed to DGP or SJG stuff - I understand that stuff is canon in varying amounts, but I consider GDW stuff to be the "most canon." (For instance, what if the population of the Zhodani was like 20% Noble, 50% Intendant, 30% Prole or something even more subversive like ... when we think of "noble" we think elite but what if 50% of Zhodani society are Nobles?)

The Zhodani should understand psionics far better than the Imperium does. We should assume they have far better methods of testing for psionic strength than the Imperium does; we might even go so far as to say that Zhodani chargen rules may not actually be accurate for how the Zhodani would really be like. It seems somehow unlikely to me that many Zhodani would be slipping through the cracks when it comes to psionic testing.

The power and rank that proles can achieve is probably directly in proportion to the percentage of the population that proles make up.

If "most" of the population of the Consulate are proles, then they probably rise quite high by their talents; there's simply insufficient psions to fill all the slots. In this case, I think a reasonable explanation is that the idea of Enlisted / NCO / Officer is probably a clumsy translation of Zhodani terms being forced to fit into Imperial rank structures, which in turn has fostered a completely wrong-headed idea of what the ranks actually do. Perhaps to the Zhodani the ranks are natural and would work quite differently - Proles might rise to positions we'd consider quite powerful: Admirals or Generals (or even CEOs of companies), though most would not (just like in our world). To the rank structure in the Imperial mind, these would still be "NCO" type ranks. In the Zhodani military, such proles might even give orders to nobles and intendant specialists on the battlefield ("we need to cause some havoc in the Imperial rear-lines, please take your squad of Consulate Guard and hit them where you think it'd do the most damage. Read my mind for my strategic assessment and good fortune."). The "officer" would actually simply be a fellow who visits the CEO periodically, perhaps once a day, once a week, or something and psychologically ensures the mental health and fitness of the prole for the job and otherwise doesn't interfere with the prole's job. It is like an NCO/Officer relationship in that even the lowest ranked 'commander' can remove the highest ranked prole from a job, but only within the confines of the commander's authority (eg; the prole isn't fit for the job anymore because he's cracking under the stress and needs to have time and attention of psionic surgeons to return him to mental health).

Though of course, even that assessment might be off - the officers of the Zhodani nobles and intendants might actually run everything. Men and women with strategic command skills would sit in the same commander's room, look at the situation reports, formulate ideas on how to proceed. The "general" would quickly read the minds of all of his/her prole "talents" and proceed from there.

Similarly, if the percentage of proles in the population is very small and the Intendants perhaps outnumber them, then proles have less and less power and perhaps fulfill roles of skilled artisans and IT professionals - the Zhodani are a technologically advanced people and seem to have much less of a stigma of using robots than the Imperium so proles are probably less likely grunt laborers and instead technicians repairing, programming, and directing gangs of robots who do the actual labor.



This is a total denial of everything Zhodani culture is, though.

Criminals are not bad people in Zhodani society. They're people who are sick and they get cured. Just like nobody in your office lambasts you for having been the guy with the flu four years ago, after you're cured, nobody lambasts you for the crime you committed, either. The Taverchedl' ensures it. (though I guess they do practice execution for certain illnesses.)

And I'm pretty sure the Taverchedl' still watches over Intendants. Apparently their reach is limited among Nobles (something that doesn't make any sense and probably means the nobles are the most class of Zhodani society that needs to be looked at most closely).

AM:4 page:
Crimes by Nobles and lntendants are a special case, since they
must be judged by a Noble higher in rank than any of the accused.
Inadvertent crimes are handled with a warning or an admonition;
Nobles are believed under the law to be incapable of
incited crimes. Insane crimes reflect a breakdown in a Noble's
personality (commonly portrayed to the Proles as a result of
overwork and the demands of responsibility); minor violations
are let off with a warning, while major crimes call for reeducation.
For the good of all concerned, a convicted Noble is
usually transferred to another location or world rather than
returned to his or her original position after re-education. Intendants
are also re-educated, but usually lose their lntendant status
and are reduced to Social Standing 6 or less.

If I were and Intendant then I would be in reeducation camp for a long time If I was about to be stripped of my status. There is still a subjective element.

I am not saying the ZHo's are evil at all... I agree they are different. However I think the demographic slice would be something more along he lines of a ratio of 3:8: Unknown. My assumption is 10-15% nobles, 20-30% Intendant, rest proles.

 

[McPerth]

I've noticed that people on the thread seem to assume the Zhodani are different and somehow inherently evil.

While they're vilified by the Imperium, I think it's more interesting to think of the the Zhodani as not evil but different. Very different. In fact, despite being humans, they're so different, they're probably the most alien of the races in Traveller, human or not. The society postulated in GDW's materials would have far-reaching implications that I don't think even GDW has handled well.

I don't see them evil, but, as you say, their concept of good or evil is different to ours, as is their concept of freedom and happines and of right and wrong.

After all, they have achieved a more stable and happy society than most of our RW ones...

I see a nice example of it in the 3rd paragraph under Re-education in page 14 CT:AM, where it talks about how would a Tavrchedl' action be seen by them, in the example (quoting literally) the prole feels slightty better knowing that someone cares.

One of the question I've had for a while (but never had an opportunity to ask) - does any supplement ever give the demographics of the castes of the Zhodani? I'd prefer it to be "true" GDW material as opposed to DGP or SJG stuff - I understand that stuff is canon in varying amounts, but I consider GDW stuff to be the "most canon." (For instance, what if the population of the Zhodani was like 20% Noble, 50% Intendant, 30% Prole or something even more subversive like ... when we think of "noble" we think elite but what if 50% of Zhodani society are Nobles?)

AFAIK there are no such data published.

We can infere it from the possibilities in CharGen, but, once again, they can be biased (even if only by the gauss curve of the dice). In any case, as with many other issues in CharGen, my take is that if they are biased, it is to give more possibilities to be Noble/Intendant, as they are funnier to play.

The Zhodani should understand psionics far better than the Imperium does. We should assume they have far better methods of testing for psionic strength than the Imperium does; we might even go so far as to say that Zhodani chargen rules may not actually be accurate for how the Zhodani would really be like. It seems somehow unlikely to me that many Zhodani would be slipping through the cracks when it comes to psionic testing.

That's why I say primary education would be of uttermost importance to them, and so, likely to be taken charge by psions. It may even be quite a prestigious task for them (more so than in our own society).

If "most" of the population of the Consulate are proles, then they probably rise quite high by their talents; there's simply insufficient psions to fill all the slots. In this case, I think a reasonable explanation is that the idea of Enlisted / NCO / Officer is probably a clumsy translation of Zhodani terms being forced to fit into Imperial rank structures, which in turn has fostered a completely wrong-headed idea of what the ranks actually do. Perhaps to the Zhodani the ranks are natural and would work quite differently - Proles might rise to positions we'd consider quite powerful: Admirals or Generals (or even CEOs of companies), though most would not (just like in our world). To the rank structure in the Imperial mind, these would still be "NCO" type ranks. In the Zhodani military, such proles might even give orders to nobles and intendant specialists on the battlefield ("we need to cause some havoc in the Imperial rear-lines, please take your squad of Consulate Guard and hit them where you think it'd do the most damage. Read my mind for my strategic assessment and good fortune."). The "officer" would actually simply be a fellow who visits the CEO periodically, perhaps once a day, once a week, or something and psychologically ensures the mental health and fitness of the prole for the job and otherwise doesn't interfere with the prole's job. It is like an NCO/Officer relationship in that even the lowest ranked 'commander' can remove the highest ranked prole from a job, but only within the confines of the commander's authority (eg; the prole isn't fit for the job anymore because he's cracking under the stress and needs to have time and attention of psionic surgeons to return him to mental health).

Though of course, even that assessment might be off - the officers of the Zhodani nobles and intendants might actually run everything. Men and women with strategic command skills would sit in the same commander's room, look at the situation reports, formulate ideas on how to proceed. The "general" would quickly read the minds of all of his/her prole "talents" and proceed from there.

That's what I tried to explain in earlier posts (and I admited I was not sure I was able to explain well). I also believe proles can have even command over psions, if they are better in the job, and this may not be a stigma for the psions. Rank (or command position) may not have anything to do with caste, but with abiltiy.

This is a total denial of everything Zhodani culture is, though.

Criminals are not bad people in Zhodani society. They're people who are sick and they get cured. Just like nobody in your office lambasts you for having been the guy with the flu four years ago, after you're cured, nobody lambasts you for the crime you committed, either. The Taverchedl' ensures it. (though I guess they do practice execution for certain illnesses.)

Yes, criminals are seen as sick people to be cured, but those that can be cured must be taken off from the society for society's safety. I don't remember where did I read it (ITTR it was MT:RS), but I read that they don't believe in prisions as punishement, seeing it too cruel and useless. If someone is not curable, it better is eliminated from society (I guess they see it more as euthanasia than execution, as such an unhealable ill person must suffer a lot, in their view).

And I'm pretty sure the Taverchedl' still watches over Intendants. Apparently their reach is limited among Nobles (something that doesn't make any sense and probably means the nobles are the most class of Zhodani society that needs to be looked at most closely).

I'm sure nobles are also watched by the Tavrchedl', and probably there's a branch specially dedicated to them (think on it as an Internal Affairs division).

And then another question arises. Should an intendant be demoted (due to a serious enough crime), are his/her psionic powers supressed?

Otherwise, there will not only be some (while quite a few) proles with psi powers, but they will be all problematic ones (as they will be demoted intendants). The most logical outcome, IMHO, is what Meteoric Assault said:

I have a feeling they are more than likely executed.

 

[mike wightman]

I've pretty much seen the Zhodani as closer to being the good guys than the Imperium since their introduction.

 

[McPerth]

I guess the first book that comes to most people minds when reading the Zhodani is Orwell's 1884, from where some names seem to be taken (proles, Thought Pólice...)

But taking a closer look to it, I see (as already said recently in this same thread and elsewhere time ago) more like Asimov's Second Fundation (with their reliance on psicology and psionics¹ in their society) with some of Houxley's A Happy World (with thier idea of "as we cannot make a society that makes everyone happy, let's make everyone happy with the society we have and their roles on it": conditioning).

Note 1: While, IIRC, the world psionics does not even appear in Asimov's Fundation series, IMHO the actions of second fundation against the Mule (and Mule's own actions) can only be explained in Traveller terms as using psionic Empathy​

 

[aramis]

I am not saying the ZHo's are evil at all... I agree they are different. However I think the demographic slice would be something more along he lines of a ratio of 3:8: Unknown. My assumption is 10-15% nobles, 20-30% Intendant, rest proles.

Working to find X
Before the T4/T5 inheritance rules...
X is those who have neither Soc 10+ nor Psi 9+...
since 10+ is 6/36 and 9+ is 10/36

that's 30/36 * 26/36 or 780/1296 or 60.2% (roughly), so the 3:8:X is 11:x, and (x+11)*1296/780=1 so X≅27.6.

Giving, roughly 3:8:28

Note that Psionics isn't genetic, so we don't need to adjust for that.
Also, we can probably justify the round-up by noting that reeducation of an intendant results in being reduced to a prole.

(note: I prefer, myself, 3:8:66... which makes proles 3/4 of the total... but that's still a huge raft of nobles.)

 

[Meteoric Assault]

Working to find X
Before the T4/T5 inheritance rules...
X is those who have neither Soc 10+ nor Psi 9+...
since 10+ is 6/36 and 9+ is 10/36

that's 30/36 * 26/36 or 780/1296 or 60.2% (roughly), so the 3:8:X is 11:x, and (x+11)*1296/780=1 so X≅27.6.

Giving, roughly 3:8:28

Note that Psionics isn't genetic, so we don't need to adjust for that.
Also, we can probably justify the round-up by noting that reeducation of an intendant results in being reduced to a prole.

(note: I prefer, myself, 3:8:66... which makes proles 3/4 of the total... but that's still a huge raft of nobles.)

Math is not my strong suit.. I am social sciences person.... personally I appreciate you breaking it down for me.

 

[mike wightman]

The usual caveat applies - that the character generation tables do not represent the general population, rather they represent the likely pool for Travellers.

 

[whulorigan]

Note 1: While, IIRC, the world psionics does not even appear in Asimov's Fundation series, IMHO the actions of second fundation against the Mule (and Mule's own actions) can only be explained in Traveller terms as using psionic Empathy.

The Asimovian Term in the Foundation Universe for Psions is "Mentalics".

 

[aramis]

The usual caveat applies - that the character generation tables do not represent the general population, rather they represent the likely pool for Travellers.

Note that other statements in AM's 1-4 imploy the opposite.

 

[epicenter00]

I know my insistence on demographics is a bit boring, but I've always thought that the Zhodani have to have a relatively high number of people with psionics for their society to work in the way it is presented, though there's parts that are odd about it (like why do the Zhodani have police that are not Tavrchedl'?).

The Zhodani are presented as having a basic honesty as a quality that permeates their society - locks only exist as safety devices where it'd be hazardous if someone ignorant got access to it; they're not bulwarks against trespass. Zhodani proles in particular are noted as never lying. I can accept this - it makes the Zhodani pretty alien.

I have to wonder, though. The Tavrchedl' appear to be a career choice for the Zhodani - so the majority of Intendants and Nobles are not Taverchedl'. However, for Zhodani society to work the way it does, I'd think they'd need sufficient Tavrchedl' to eliminate such basic dishonesty.

If there's not enough Tavrchedl', then they really do become a kind of Orwellian Secret Police; I'd think that human nature being what it is, a significant percentage of the population will try and get away with things unless watched; Zhodani proles would lie, they would cheat. Unhappy people would go unnoticed. They would require non-psionic police if only to catch criminals and find and bring in the unhappy for the Tavrchedl' to deal wth. However, this is idea of "basic honesty" would have to be thrown out. The goal of proles would be to evade being caught. People with various unhappy mental illnesses would probably try and evade the Taverchedl'.

If you have sufficient Tavrchedl' on the other hand, I don't think you'd need normal police officers as we think of it. They might be more like Public Safety Officers - trained to do things like firefighting, paramedic duties, searching for missing hikers, giving directions to tourists on the streets, and similar jobs.

The question is which end does Zhodani society tend towards? I'd think it'd tend towards the second idea (if only to be different from the Imperium). But I'd think that'd require a fairly large number of Tavrchedl', which would mean that Intendants (at the very least) would have to be a larger percentage of the population unless a large percentage of Nobles and Intendants are Tavrchedl'.

For the good of all concerned, a convicted Noble is
usually transferred to another location or world rather than
returned to his or her original position after re-education. Intendants
are also re-educated, but usually lose their lntendant status
and are reduced to Social Standing 6 or less.

This is so utterly baffling to me.

It's one of those things I hope they change in T5.

If the Zhodani don't consider crimes as evil but simply as illness ... why is there a stigma attached to it? Why would the Noble be transferred? Who is going to look down on the noble? The noble had cancer ... they cured the cancer, the noble is back on the job now. The Intendant messed up but is now cured and is back on the job.

 

[Meteoric Assault]

I know my insistence on demographics is a bit boring, but I've always thought that the Zhodani have to have a relatively high number of people with psionics for their society to work in the way it is presented, though there's parts that are odd about it (like why do the Zhodani have police that are not Tavrchedl'?).

The Zhodani are presented as having a basic honesty as a quality that permeates their society - locks only exist as safety devices where it'd be hazardous if someone ignorant got access to it; they're not bulwarks against trespass. Zhodani proles in particular are noted as never lying. I can accept this - it makes the Zhodani pretty alien.

I have to wonder, though. The Tavrchedl' appear to be a career choice for the Zhodani - so the majority of Intendants and Nobles are not Taverchedl'. However, for Zhodani society to work the way it does, I'd think they'd need sufficient Tavrchedl' to eliminate such basic dishonesty.

If there's not enough Tavrchedl', then they really do become a kind of Orwellian Secret Police; I'd think that human nature being what it is, a significant percentage of the population will try and get away with things unless watched; Zhodani proles would lie, they would cheat. Unhappy people would go unnoticed. They would require non-psionic police if only to catch criminals and find and bring in the unhappy for the Tavrchedl' to deal wth. However, this is idea of "basic honesty" would have to be thrown out. The goal of proles would be to evade being caught. People with various unhappy mental illnesses would probably try and evade the Taverchedl'.

If you have sufficient Tavrchedl' on the other hand, I don't think you'd need normal police officers as we think of it. They might be more like Public Safety Officers - trained to do things like firefighting, paramedic duties, searching for missing hikers, giving directions to tourists on the streets, and similar jobs.

The question is which end does Zhodani society tend towards? I'd think it'd tend towards the second idea (if only to be different from the Imperium). But I'd think that'd require a fairly large number of Tavrchedl', which would mean that Intendants (at the very least) would have to be a larger percentage of the population unless a large percentage of Nobles and Intendants are Tavrchedl'.



This is so utterly baffling to me.

It's one of those things I hope they change in T5.

If the Zhodani don't consider crimes as evil but simply as illness ... why is there a stigma attached to it? Why would the Noble be transferred? Who is going to look down on the noble? The noble had cancer ... they cured the cancer, the noble is back on the job now. The Intendant messed up but is now cured and is back on the job.

I have a feeling and this could be an adventure hook " the demoted intendant who become a rebel leader...bucking the system... maybe he escaped from reeducation... or maybe its a scenario such as 'the prisioner"

 

[aramis]

If we assume a 3:8:28 ratio as implied by CGen...
The Tavrchedl' probably fall under Guards - per the Merc generation.
All intendants are officers

So... about 1/3 of the guards officers wind up receiving training, 1/6 of those are trained into the Tavrchedle

So... 1/18 of Guards go tavrchedle.
If we assume that the army gets a whopping 10% enlistment of the 18yo, and serves 3 terms... (12 years) of an average 77 year age... that's 12/770 in the guards officers, and then 1/18 of that, we get 12/13860 or 1/1155 - a bit low by US standards, but about the right number for a police agency...

Ah, but I forgot... nobles and intendants only comprise 11/39... so 11/45045... or 1/4095. About one quarter of the typical US Local Police rate. On par with some of the smaller european nations.