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What changes if ships have faster FTL?

So, I've got an upcoming game, and I plan on using the Traveller Imperium (and the Zhodani, and the Sword Worlds, and other such), but I want to give it more of a Guardians of the Galaxy feel. I'm using a non-Traveller ruleset (Wild Talents for what it's worth) because I want psionics and weird aliens and cybernetics or wacky sorts and all that.

In any case, one conceit I'm thinking on is to make ships faster, like, Star Trek (as imagined by Abrams) speed.

How does this change the Imperium? One of the main setting ideas is that the distance between the stars, plus the long travel times, means weeks before news and the like make it somewhere. Even with the J6 Jump Boat network, it take, what, 4 weeks to cross a subsector, never mind shunting a message from the Spinward Marches to the Core.

So, what would be different if that 4 weeks across the subsector took, say, 7 days? Spinward to Core in 2 months (maybe even 1 month)?
 
I remember from somewhere that the jump drive is actually pretty quick compared to warp drive...

j3...just under 10 ly in about 150 hours...give or take...

1 light year in 15 hours...about 8766 hours in a year...584.4 times C...more or less

I think warp drive is warp factor cubed, warp 3 is 3x3x3 times C

warp 8...mutter mutter mutter...is 8x8x8 for 512 times C [warp 9 should be 729 times C]

J3 is just a bit faster than warp 8 which the OS Enterprise had as its top end "The engines canna take much more o this capt!!!" speed.

My math is probably off by quite a bit...some of the elders here will peek in and correct me...but unless you use trans/hyper warp...jump drives are faster in the short haul settings.

If you drop in hop/skip leap/bound drives...warp drives are pretty much slow pokes.
 
I remember from somewhere that the jump drive is actually pretty quick compared to warp drive...

j3...just under 10 ly in about 150 hours...give or take...

1 light year in 15 hours...about 8766 hours in a year...584.4 times C...more or less

I think warp drive is warp factor cubed, warp 3 is 3x3x3 times C

warp 8...mutter mutter mutter...is 8x8x8 for 512 times C [warp 9 should be 729 times C]

J3 is just a bit faster than warp 8 which the OS Enterprise had as its top end "The engines canna take much more o this capt!!!" speed.

My math is probably off by quite a bit...some of the elders here will peek in and correct me...but unless you use trans/hyper warp...jump drives are faster in the short haul settings.

If you drop in hop/skip leap/bound drives...warp drives are pretty much slow pokes.

Eh? I didn't say anything about warp drive, I asked, what if Whatever Drive is faster than the current setting assumptions? Like, if it takes, at J6, 2 or 3 jumps to cross a subsector, that's 2-3 weeks of travel. These travel numbers are baked into Traveller. What if these travel times were shorter? Again, a week or so to cross a subsector? Instead of 2-3? What if the core were only 3-4 weeks away rather than months or half a year?
 
Part of Traveller is that communications delay for the rate of jump is integrated into the basic fabric of the game...

The local bosses have to either wait for several months to get a response to a problem or act on their own initiative...

This is why there is people...nobles/military officers/Travellers who will act rather than wait for orders.

If you could get faster travel to the sector capitols...or Capitol...you would get rulers micromanaging every decision...corporate/banking agents operating like the robber barons of the past...criminals who are caught in weeks if not days...

You would not have Traveller.

By the way...faster ships..."star trek (as imagined by abrams) speeds" to many on these boards pretty much means warp drive...at least to me.
 
If you could get faster travel to the sector capitols...or Capitol...you would get rulers micromanaging every decision...corporate/banking agents operating like the robber barons of the past...criminals who are caught in weeks if not days...
You could speed up travel quite a bit without ruining that aspect, though. Make it possible to get from the edge to the center of the Imperium in three months instead of a couple of years, and at a cost that was a little less extortionate. (Note that I'm talking about ordinary travel (J3) when I say a couple of years). Historically empires had to rely on governors and viceroys when their border provinces were three month's communication time from the capital. And I, for onbe, would like to be able to get my adventuring party from the Marches to Terra and back in a year or so.

This would require some changes to ship design, of course.


Hans
 
Other variables include cost in resources and the amount of time the state spent at lower speeds.

The Imperium looks the way it does partially because most of the previous 11,000 years of space travel was carried out at J1 or J2, when you had to visit every system just to keep moving. Outside of the military, the vast majority of the Imperium still doesn't exceed J2 because the various costs associated with going faster are still too high for commercial viability.

Bounce forward a few centuries, when Hop is starting to appear, and you get a rapid and relatively cheap transit mode operating in a setting that still mostly operates in a much slower mode. For a time, you get to "cheat" on the setting with a much faster drive. Once Hop takes hold, however, the existing setting will start to spread out, concentrating increasingly on systems that are actually worth visiting and/or settling instead of feeling obliged to call the first rock without a mailbox your new home. Over time, the setting starts to look a bit like Star Wars, in which we rarely see anything other than worlds with shirtsleeve environments. The dross in between is just not worth the attention until population pressures and extreme terraforming combine to force the society to *make* new shirtsleeve worlds, and with Hop or even Skip available by then, why even stop expanding?
 
The Imperium looks the way it does partially because most of the previous 11,000 years of space travel was carried out at J1 or J2, when you had to visit every system just to keep moving. Outside of the military, the vast majority of the Imperium still doesn't exceed J2 because the various costs associated with going faster are still too high for commercial viability.
The per parsec cost of J3 travel is roughly the same as that of J2 or very slightly more (depending on the ship design system you use). The difference is so slight that you can assume that it depends on the astrography. For long distance transportation J3 has the advantage of 50% greater speed for little of no extra cost. For passenger transportation J4 is viable (about 25% more expensive than two J2s).


Hans
 
Beware. Any change in speed will affect strategic considerations. Attackers can summon forces from deeper in their own realms, can dive deeper on the attack, the Imperium can deliver reinforcements to the front faster from further to the rear. Quadruple the speed, and the Zhodani can draw forces from their entire empire in the time it once took to draw forces from the two neighboring sectors. Reinforcements from most of the Imperium can reach the Marches in the time it once took for reinforcements to arrive from Corridor - and the larger Zhodani fleets could be most of the way through Deneb by then.

It makes a substantial change in how the various wars would progress: vastly larger fleets are assembled, the front stabilizes much farther to the rear before Imperial forces can counter. I suspect the Imperials would have to maintain a lot more forces forward and would have to adopt a much more aggressive posture against continuing threats like the Zho.
 
Beware. Any change in speed will affect strategic considerations. Attackers can summon forces from deeper in their own realms, can dive deeper on the attack, the Imperium can deliver reinforcements to the front faster from further to the rear. Quadruple the speed, and the Zhodani can draw forces from their entire empire in the time it once took to draw forces from the two neighboring sectors. Reinforcements from most of the Imperium can reach the Marches in the time it once took for reinforcements to arrive from Corridor - and the larger Zhodani fleets could be most of the way through Deneb by then.

It makes a substantial change in how the various wars would progress: vastly larger fleets are assembled, the front stabilizes much farther to the rear before Imperial forces can counter. I suspect the Imperials would have to maintain a lot more forces forward and would have to adopt a much more aggressive posture against continuing threats like the Zho.

This is what I was wondering. That doesn't hurt my feelings at all that it would change warfare and the like. That's what I want. I love a lot of what Traveller has, but always wanted it a bit faster. What you hypothesize makes it more like Honor Harrington, which isn't a bad thing in my book.
 
So, what would be different if that 4 weeks across the subsector took, say, 7 days? Spinward to Core in 2 months (maybe even 1 month)?

Short version: the whole setting.

Long version:

Communications: its efect is quite straightforward, its consequences long ranging. As selunatic said, they can be sumarized in loss of autonomy by periferic command posts (both naval, corporate, political, whatever they are).

Trade: as your information about the target planet conditions are more updated, speculation is safer.

Strategical: IMHO huge advantage to the defender

Beware. Any change in speed will affect strategic considerations. Attackers can summon forces from deeper in their own realms, can dive deeper on the attack, the Imperium can deliver reinforcements to the front faster from further to the rear. Quadruple the speed, and the Zhodani can draw forces from their entire empire in the time it once took to draw forces from the two neighboring sectors. Reinforcements from most of the Imperium can reach the Marches in the time it once took for reinforcements to arrive from Corridor - and the larger Zhodani fleets could be most of the way through Deneb by then.

It makes a substantial change in how the various wars would progress: vastly larger fleets are assembled, the front stabilizes much farther to the rear before Imperial forces can counter. I suspect the Imperials would have to maintain a lot more forces forward and would have to adopt a much more aggressive posture against continuing threats like the Zho.

I disagree in this analysis. While it's true that both sides can summon forces from deeper their territories, once you enter into enemy space, things are quite slowed for you, while not for your enemy (who is moving forces through firendly space).

If you are on attack, you'll have to ressort to frontier refuelling after one or two jumps (after you emptied your posible drop tanks or tankers).

Ressorting to frontier refuelling would take (let's say) about 40-50 hours (8 hours imbound to GG, some time conducting deep GG scanning to avoid hidden SDB give you a nasty surprise, about 24 hours refuelling in shifts to keep HG, and 8 hours outbound to jump vector). See that this slows your speed to about 1/3 (if jump takes 24 hours) or 1/2 (if jump takes 48 hours), while with standard Traveller (jump takes 7 days) losing 2 days out of 7 only represents a slowing by about 30-35%. And if your fleet is based on Tender/Raider combo, probably delay will be even greater, as the Tenders (being mostly dispersed/irregualar structures for subcraft deploying pourposes) are unsteamlined and depend on subcrafts (raiders included) for refuelling (hey, they have one disadvantage at least).

In the meanwhile, the defender, having been reading their reinforcement preplaned paths to refuel the fleet (warned by the same courriers that have to reach the depots and reserve fleets), will refuel their transiting foreces quite quicker.

And any longer delay for the attacker (minor damages having to be repaired, planets to be taken, etc...) will make you meet stronger defenses ahead as you advance (and any combat with them will produce more such delays).

So, I agree with Carlo that Reinforcements from most of the Imperium can reach the Marches in the time it once took for reinforcements to arrive from Corridor, but I disagree about the Zhodani being half way to Deneb by then, as they would have been slowed by frontier refuelling and combats. See that if they bog down just 2 months in their main trust due to the need to take a planet (remember it took 8 months to take Earth), in this time Imperial Reinforcements would have reached the Marches in masse.

So, my conclusiones just opposite to Carlo's: I suspect that Imperial can keep lighter forces in forward deployement, just enough to warn and produce minor delays to the Zhodani, and keep most their forces in deep reserve, where surprise attacks cannot be done, relying in reinforcements' speed to turn the tables.
 
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So, I've got an upcoming game, and I plan on using the Traveller Imperium (and the Zhodani, and the Sword Worlds, and other such), but I want to give it more of a Guardians of the Galaxy feel. I'm using a non-Traveller ruleset (Wild Talents for what it's worth) because I want psionics and weird aliens and cybernetics or wacky sorts and all that.

In any case, one conceit I'm thinking on is to make ships faster, like, Star Trek (as imagined by Abrams) speed.

Not to take you away from your planned ruleset, but T5 is probably a lot more straightforward that the One Dice system, plus it give you what you're after to build aliens, cybernetics, psionics and all that.

Travel has been well covered by the others. Were you going to use already designed Traveller vessels? If you did that you could use their pre-existing ratings and just make them more capable. Eg, all J-numbers jump Jx3 parsecs, or 1 x jump's worth of fuel covers a month in J-space with vessels moving at the Jn parsecs per day, or whatever speed you prefer to use.
 
Short version: the whole setting.

Long version:

Communications: its efect is quite straightforward, its consequences long ranging. As selunatic said, they can be sumarized in loss of autonomy by periferic command posts (both naval, corporate, political, whatever they are).

Trade: as your information about the target planet conditions are more updated, speculation is safer.

Strategical: IMHO huge advantage to the defender



I disagree in this analysis. While it's true that both sides can summon forces from deeper their territories, once you enter into enemy space, things are quite slowed for you, while not for your enemy (who is moving forces through firendly space).

If you are on attack, you'll have to ressort to frontier refuelling after one or two jumps (after you emptied your posible drop tanks or tankers).

Ressorting to frontier refuelling would take (let's say) about 40-50 hours (8 hours imbound to GG, some time conducting deep GG scanning to avoid hidden SDB give you a nasty surprise, about 24 hours refuelling in shifts to keep HG, and 8 hours outbound to jump vector). See that this slows your speed to about 1/3 (if jump takes 24 hours) or 1/2 (if jump takes 48 hours), while with standard Traveller (jump takes 7 days) losing 2 days out of 7 only represents a slowing by about 30-35%. And if your fleet is based on Tender/Raider combo, probably delay will be even greater, as the Tenders (being mostly dispersed/irregualar structures for subcraft deploying pourposes) are unsteamlined and depend on subcragts (raiders included) for refuelling (hey, they have one disadvantage at least).

In the meanwhile, the defender, having been reading their reinforcement preplaned paths to refuel the fleet (warned by the same courriers that have to reach the depots and reserve fleets), will refuel their transiting foreces quite quicker.

And any longer delay for the attacker (minor damages having to be repaired, planets to be taken, etc...) will make you meet stronger defenses ahead as you advance (and any combat with them will produce more such delays).

So, I agree with Carlo that Reinforcements from most of the Imperium can reach the Marches in the time it once took for reinforcements to arrive from Corridor, but I disagree about the Zhodani being half way to Deneb by then, as they would have been slowed by frontier refuelling and combats. See that if they bog down just 2 months in their main trust due to the need to take a planet (remember it took 8 months to take Earth), in this time Imperial Reinforcements would have reached the Marches in masse.

So, my conclusiones just opposite to Carlo's: I suspect that Imperial can keep lighter forces in forward deployement, just enough to warn and produce minor delays to the Zhodani, and keep most their forces in deep reserve, where surprise attacks cannot be done, relying in reinforcements' speed to turn the tables.

You miss a key point. The Zho historically begin these wars, which means they choose when and with what resources. With the resources of 9 sectors available at the outset, they can overwhelm the Marches in short order. There are no minor delays when you are outnumbered nine to one at the outset: Jewell falls in the first week, Efate a week or two after that. With what were once their jump-4 units, they could leap from Cronor and be attacking Regina on the first week of war, or establish a forward base at Tremous Dex the first week and, refueling with tankers, be at Rhylanor the second week.

And don't forget that the Zho supply line has the same quadrupled range. They can leap from protected ports to supply forces over a 12-parsec range, which means they can operate from fewer and therefore better protected positions.

With this much force available to the Zho at the beginning, there is simply no stopping them from taking the Marches before news reaches Capital - and from being in Deneb before the Imperial forces arrive to start shoving them back - unless the Imperials drastically reinforce before the war ever starts, or unless the Impies respond the first time the Zho's try it by marshalling everything and crushing them to prevent future wars. The sole Imp advantage is, being a larger empire, they can marshal a much larger force to respond with - but that response is likely to occur in Deneb sector.

If you multiply speed by a factor of four, you multiply EVERYTHING by a factor of four, and in some cases four squared, because the Zho are drawing forces from a broader area to make a much more powerful initial thrust to quickly reach places that under the old model were considered rear areas. In essence, the entirety of the Marches is cast in the previous role of Jewell subsector as a forward combat front, while the previous role of Rhylanor as a rear base is taken on by bases in the trailing region of Deneb. It's like the difference between battling with Napoleonic infantry and battling with WW-II armor: they'll assemble more quickly, move faster and strike deeper than what you're accustomed to.
 
So, what would be different if that 4 weeks across the subsector took, say, 7 days? Spinward to Core in 2 months (maybe even 1 month)?

I can't remember where it says this, but there are supposed to be 36 levels of JumpSpace. Jump-36 (117.36 lightyears) would put a ship more than a sector/four subsectors away in a week.

That changes things dramatically.

About 5 or 6 weeks from Regina to Capital.

Your Dukes and Archdukes would have faster communication, but the Emperor is still not doing much direct ruling on the frontier at a month and a half out of touch. But the Emperor could tour His Imperium much easier.
 
I can't remember where it says this, but there are supposed to be 36 levels of JumpSpace.

It is (somewhat) implied in CT because there are at least this many levels due to mis-jumps having a maximum range of 36pc, but it is explicitly stated in DGP: Starship Operators Manual that there are 36 J-Space Levels.
 
So, what would be different if that 4 weeks across the subsector took, say, 7 days? Spinward to Core in 2 months (maybe even 1 month)?

I forgot to say another important change: microjumps would be more usual. If jump takes only 24 hours, then in system movement (that often takes quite more) will be better achieved with microjumps, as the cost of the JD and the 10% tonnage needed for fuel can be easily offset if the trip takes less time.

You miss a key point. The Zho historically begin these wars, which means they choose when and with what resources. With the resources of 9 sectors available at the outset, they can overwhelm the Marches in short order. There are no minor delays when you are outnumbered nine to one at the outset: Jewell falls in the first week, Efate a week or two after that. With what were once their jump-4 units, they could leap from Cronor and be attacking Regina on the first week of war, or establish a forward base at Tremous Dex the first week and, refueling with tankers, be at Rhylanor the second week.

And don't forget that the Zho supply line has the same quadrupled range. They can leap from protected ports to supply forces over a 12-parsec range, which means they can operate from fewer and therefore better protected positions.

I still fully disagree with your analysis. All those points are the same regardless the jump takes 24 hours or 168 hours. The Zhodani have been preparing for war from long before it began, and so forces are already marshaled from the whole consulate, and the relation of jumps needed for the Zhodani to advance and for the Imperials to ask for reinforcements and receive them is unchanged. What really changes is the percentage of time this represents, and the shorter time in jump, the most important this is:

For strategical pourposes, I'll divide the jumps into several categories, according the time needed between jumps (numbers are quite simplified):
  1. Non refuelling jump: the ship arrives at system and jumps again without refuelling. This would apply for the pony-express-like courriers (though in this case what jumps again is the information, not the ship proper), ships with enough fuel for 2 consecutive jumps and ships using drop tanks, saving integral fuel for the second jump. Let's say 2 hours between jumps (infromation transmiting, calculating vectors, conducting checks, etc).
  2. Planned refueling jump: the ship exits jumpspace and is met by refuelling ships, that refuel it so that it can jump again ASAP. This includes refuelling at bases that expect them or tanker support. Let's say 4 hours between jumps
    (docking refuelling ships, transfering fuel, etc)
  3. Unplanned refuelling jump: mostly are ships that arrive at a starport capable to refuel them but not expecting them, so needing to ready their ressources to do so (or sips docking at refuelling points in the highport). Let's say 12 hours between jumps (Reading refuelling ships, inbound/outbound trips, etc).
  4. Frontier refuelling: ships have no refuelling facilities usable, having to conduct frontier refuelling. As specified before, about 48 hours between jumps.

See that this difference among 2 hours or 48 has little importance if the jump takes 168 hours, as it represents at most just over 25% of time so lost, but when the jump takes only 24 hours, this means nearly contiuous jump or tripling the time needed.

Now let's see how does that affect the Zhodani invasión:

As the Imperials detect the Zhodani, courriers are sent to Core. Those ships, using class 1 jump above, manage to make about 6.5 jumps a week along preplanned routes. At each system they stop, news spread and the preplaned paths are reading so that the incoming reinforcements can use class 2 jumps in their way frontlines bound. Due to this preplanning and warning, reinforcements transiting to front lines can use class 2 jumps (perhaps an occasional class 3 due to unpredicted problems), achieving about 6 jumps per week. As they are moving through friendly space, they don't need to care about anything else than moving forward.

Meanwhile, the Zhodani make their initial jumps using drop tanks, so that they can use class 1 jumps in their first stop, and are supported by tankers so that they can do class 2 jump in their seccond. After that, with the tankers empty and in hostile territory, they will have to ressort to class 4 jump, stoping to just over 2 jumps per week, assuming they are just moving forward (something unlikely if any defenses have to be overcome).

As you can see, the speed raising does not affect everyone equally...

With this much force available to the Zho at the beginning, there is simply no stopping them from taking the Marches before news reaches Capital - and from being in Deneb before the Imperial forces arrive to start shoving them back - unless the Imperials drastically reinforce before the war ever starts, or unless the Impies respond the first time the Zho's try it by marshalling everything and crushing them to prevent future wars. The sole Imp advantage is, being a larger empire, they can marshal a much larger force to respond with - but that response is likely to occur in Deneb sector.

No need to stop them, just delaying them, and most of it is already done due to refuelling needs (as said above).

This aside, you assume Jewell and Efate fall in 2 weeks, This is quite unlikely unless they ressort to WMD, and no such attrocity is ever seen in Frontier Wars. Taking planets would be a major delay (AFAIK, no such quick taking of a high pop world has occured in the whole Traveller canon history, except the coup at Menorb explained in the 4518th history, but that was not invasion, but a coup), and just besieging the world while leaving the rest of the fleet advance will seriously weaken your advancing forces.

And it's likely that most attacked systems' SDBs, seeing the huge fleet attacking them, just disperse and hide instead of accepting battle (as the ones in Louzy did in FFW), forcing the Zhodany to either stop chasing them (long delay, more critical if jumps are just 24 hours than with 168 hour jumps), dividing their forces or put their supply lines in jeopardy.

If you multiply speed by a factor of four, you multiply EVERYTHING by a factor of four, and in some cases four squared, because the Zho are drawing forces from a broader area to make a much more powerful initial thrust to quickly reach places that under the old model were considered rear areas. In essence, the entirety of the Marches is cast in the previous role of Jewell subsector as a forward combat front, while the previous role of Rhylanor as a rear base is taken on by bases in the trailing region of Deneb.

No, you don't multiply everything by a factor of four (or seven), just the time in jumpspace, so the time in normal space takes more importance, and in the OP there's no hint that this is shortened too.

It's like the difference between battling with Napoleonic infantry and battling with WW-II armor: they'll assemble more quickly, move faster and strike deeper than what you're accustomed to.

Or more like infantry and battling with Twilight 2000 tanks. They assemble more quickly, move faster while their fuel lasts... and they stop for several days to brew more alcohol to refuel before another move, while enemy forces, with fuel depots ready on their way, are assembling ahead to stop you.
 
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...So, what would be different if that 4 weeks across the subsector took, say, 7 days? Spinward to Core in 2 months (maybe even 1 month)?

... What if these travel times were shorter? Again, a week or so to cross a subsector? Instead of 2-3? What if the core were only 3-4 weeks away rather than months or half a year?

I forgot to say another important change: microjumps would be more usual. If jump takes only 24 hours, ...

Okay, I see where we're disagreeing. I read his post and concluded that jump range was dramatically increased, while time in jump remained the same. You read his post and concluded that time in jump space was dramatically decreased, while jump range remained the same.

The two changes produce very different results. It's the difference between the Zho clearing 12 parsecs on one "tank of gas" and having to make four stops along the way to fuel up.

I guess the real question is which option is the OP intending. If the range increases, there are - as I described - some pretty dramatic impacts to naval strategy. Also some pretty dramatic commercial changes, since one "tank of gas" can take you pretty far.

However, if the time in jump space decreases, the changes are not nearly as far reaching: fleets are still faced with the same problems of fueling along the way that they had faced before. The Zho can still muster a significant - possibly crushing - starting advantage, but the need to stop for fuel and to secure their supply lines will significantly slow their advance, and the Imperial response will arrive sooner and eventually in greater strength. Word reaches Deneb in a couple of weeks, Corridor a couple of weeks after that, and two months after the Zho commence hostilities, their advances get checked and they start getting pushed back. They could still overwhelm Jewell and Efate in short order, given the increased numbers available to start the war with - recall that this would include transports, tankers and ground units, not just warships - and they can still cover a lot of ground in a couple of months given engagements every three or four days instead of every couple of weeks, but they'd have to make their plans with an eye toward an almost certain reverse a couple of months later somewhere in the Marches' trailing subsectors.

Of the two, I'd suggest he go with shortening time in jump space rather than increasing range. Less impact, though commercial changes would still be significant, as a ship can make many more trips in a year than it could have otherwise. It can make more money under the existing fee schedule, or charge much less and still make enough to profit.
 
Okay, I see where we're disagreeing. I read his post and concluded that jump range was dramatically increased, while time in jump remained the same. You read his post and concluded that time in jump space was dramatically decreased, while jump range remained the same.

I guess you're right, we read it diferently ;).
 
How does this change the Imperium? One of the main setting ideas is that the distance between the stars, plus the long travel times, means weeks before news and the like make it somewhere. Even with the J6 Jump Boat network, it take, what, 4 weeks to cross a subsector, never mind shunting a message from the Spinward Marches to the Core.
Crossing a subsector takes two jumps (of sufficient size). That's 14 days for the X-boats, 17 for passenger services.


Hans
 
Everyone, many, many thanks! Much interesting reading, and things for me to chew on. Lots of juicy implications here, and I like them all. Very, very nice.

As for what I'm intending - I don't know yet, really. Was hoping to see some variations (and I have) to help me decide. Thanks for that.
 
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