Using flux as core mechanic.

[mike wightman]

Flux.

roll 2d6, subtract the second die from the first to give results in the range -5 to +5

positive flux - as above but take the lowest die from the highest die

negative flux - take the highest die from the lowest

I have thoughts on how to build an entire task resolution and combat system around this.

Basically your final flux value has to be at least equal to the target number, any points over the target number get you some sort of bonus or benefit.

Bonuses for characteristics, suitable equipment, skill level.

Hinderances based on wounds/fatigue, lack of suitable equipment.

For combat target numbers could be based on target size, range and movement.

if you have surprise you use positive flx, if you are surprised negative. Once surprise phase is over go to normal.

 

[robject]

Nice.

Page 233. <= And have you seen the buried, very-lite-mass-combat-system, "Behind The Scenes Damage" tables?

 

[daltoncalford]

I was thinking of flux as well as a possible replacement for the task system

A Roll = Attribute + Flux + Equipment Mods + Situational Mods + Activity Mods

If Roll <= Critical Failure number, then critical failure
If Roll < Target Number, then normal failure
If Roll = Target Difficulty, then minimum effect
If Roll > Target Difficulty, then regular effect
If Roll => Critical Success Number, then critical Success.

Difficulty Modifiers

[FONT="Courier New"]
Description             TN         CF#        CS#
Automatic                0          na           na
Easy                     3          na           
Average                  8
Difficult               13 
Formidable              18
Staggering              23
Hopeless                28
Impossible              33
Beyond Impossible       38 
[/FONT]

Activity Modifiers

Extremely Cautious +4
Cautious +2
Hasty -4
Double Hasty -8​

Situational Modifiers

Sensory Impairment (-1 to -20 depending upon situation/activity)
Distractions (-1 to -10 depending upon situation/activity)
Optimised Environment +5
Dangerous Environment -5
Non-Combat task performed during combat situation -10​

Equipment Modifiers

Required Equipment mod = - Equipment TL + PC TL + Equipment Ergonomics + Equipment Bonus

Unfamiliar Equipment = increase difficulty by one level
Alien Equipment = increase difficulty by one level
​

Skills decrease difficulty by one step per skill level

This is a 10 minute thought process that would need some balancing/rework but is a good start.

What we need is a thread for system mechanics variations - it may be the most active and biggest thread on the site.....

 

[mike wightman]

My thoughts were to stick to the range of -5 to +5 to determine outcome.

So for example if you want to hit something at range 2 you need a flux result of +2 or better.

If you want to hit a smaller than average target at range 2 you need a +3 or better.

 

[mike wightman]

The core of this system could be an outcome table such as this:
-5 bad stuff happens
-4 very poor outcome
-3 poor outcome
-2 must try harder
-1 negative indifference
0 indifference
+1 positive indifference
+2 not a bad effort
+3 good outcome
+4 very good outcome
+5 good stuff happens

The outcome titles need work

 

[Draconian]

Well, if you REALLY want to mess with perfection...


Flux rolls have the same probability profile as 2D, just translated down by 7 (1D-1D = 2D-7)

Classic Traveller 8+ corresponds to a Flux roll of 1+. Skill levels add +1 or +2 per level according to skill description. Modifiers make it go up or down.
In the Rule 68A where an easy skill application is 6+, average is still 8+ and hard is 10+ (A+), that corresponds to (-1)+, 1+ and 3+ rolls.

Mr. Obvious is being Obvious again...

But since 3D, 4D and 5D rolls are possible, bell curves result which can't be simulated by just Flux which is a blocky stairstep function. There is the thrill of getting rare rolls (and I brought up the fact that Spectacular Success/Failure/Interesting rolls will start to mount in probability BEYOND simple success or failure.)

 

[mike wightman]

Positive flux and negative flux change the likely outcome.

I'm tempted to go with negative flux for all adversarial tasks, especially normal combat.

Surprise may give you the benefit of positive flux for one turn only.

Normal flux for resolving non adversarial stuff.

Positive flux for when you already have an advantage.

As a complete aside I think Marc missed a trick with making flux 1d vs 1d, flux based on 2d vs 2d for a range of -10 to +10 is much more interesting from a statistical maths perspective

 

[whulorigan]

As a complete aside I think Marc missed a trick with making flux 1d vs 1d, flux based on 2d vs 2d for a range of -10 to +10 is much more interesting from a statistical maths perspective

I have actually already snagged that idea and generalized the terminology:

Standard Flux is : Roll FLUX (D6)
Your idea above would be Roll FLUX (2D6)

Could be used in other game-systems/dice combos as well:

Roll FLUX (D3): Range -2 to +2
Roll FLUX (D8): Range -7 to +7
Roll FLUX (D12): Range -11 to +11

etc.

 

[mike wightman]

How to use flux to resolve none - combat situations.

Difficulty could be the type of flux you apply.

Routine or everyday use of a skill - positive flux

A bit of a challenge (doing it fast, using improvised equipment) - normal flux

Difficult task - negative flux.

 

[whulorigan]

How to use flux to resolve none - combat situations.

Difficulty could be the type of flux you apply.

Routine or everyday use of a skill - positive flux

A bit of a challenge (doing it fast, using improvised equipment) - normal flux

Difficult task - negative flux.

What about a simple +/- 2 DM to the roll per difficulty level?

Or add/subtract an additional D3 per difficulty level (on a different-colored die)?

 

[mike wightman]

I want a reason to move from one flux type to another - that's the gimmick. There are only so many ways you can get random numbers from 2d6

 

[whulorigan]

I want a reason to move from one flux type to another - that's the gimmick. There are only so many ways you can get random numbers from 2d6

[FONT=arial,helvetica][FONT=arial,helvetica]Critical failure[/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=arial,helvetica] [TD]-5[/TD] [/FONT] [FONT=arial,helvetica]
[TR][FONT=arial,helvetica][TD]-3[/TD] [TD][FONT=arial,helvetica][FONT=arial,helvetica][FONT=arial,helvetica]Superior failure (Thorough Failure ?)[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/TD][/FONT][/TR] [/FONT][FONT=arial,helvetica]
[TR][FONT=arial,helvetica][TD]-1[/TD] [/FONT][TD]Basic failure[/TD][/TR] [/FONT][FONT=arial,helvetica]
[TR][TD]0[/TD] [TD]Marginal success/failure *[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]+1[/TD] [TD]Basic success[/TD][/TR]
[TR][FONT=arial,helvetica][TD]+3[/TD] [/FONT][TD]Superior success[/TD][/TR] [/FONT][FONT=arial,helvetica]
[TR][FONT=arial,helvetica][TD]+5[/TD] [TD]Critical success[/TD][/FONT][/TR] [/FONT]

[FONT=arial,helvetica]* (GM call - possibly elements of both success & failure)[/FONT]​

Formidable:	Bad Flux -2
Difficult:	Bad Flux
Average:	Normal FLUX
Routine:	Good Flux
Easy:	Good Flux +2

 

[aramis]

I want a reason to move from one flux type to another - that's the gimmick. There are only so many ways you can get random numbers from 2d6

I count the following:

• Sum or flux or Red-White
• Keep higher or Keep lower
• Higher-lower or Lower-higher

Note that the flux +5 to -5 is still sum for result profile, just it's shifted down 7 points ... it's exactly the same as 2d6-7. So is red-white (or any other fixed A-B)
Note that Keep lower is the same distribution as keep higher, but is mirrored. Same for higher-lower vs lower-higher.

The distributions as histograms:

sum	keep higher	keep lower	higher-lower	lower-higher
* ** *** **** ***** ****** ***** **** *** ** *	* *** ***** ******* ********* ***********	*********** ********* ******* ***** *** *	****** ********** ******** ****** **** **	** **** ****** ******** ********** ******

Anything else requires not reading the dice as standard d6 numbering. Including using them as d3's or dA's

 

[taustin]

With 2d6, there are 36 possibilities. Period. All else is interpretation, or illusion.

 

[aramis]

With 2d6, there are 36 possibilities. Period. All else is interpretation, or illusion.

Not exactly - there are 36 combinations, but the way those convert to results is neither interpretation nor illusion.

At least, for anyone who's ever paid attention in a decent statistics course.

 

[taustin]

Not exactly - there are 36 combinations, but the way those convert to results is neither interpretation nor illusion.

At least, for anyone who's ever paid attention in a decent statistics course.

Converting numbers to results is, in fact, the very definition of interpretation. The usual, most common interpretation is to add them together, giving a number between 2 and 12 inclusive. The flux roll is to subtract one from the other, giving a result between -5 and +5 inclusive. But whether a 1 and a 6 are 7, or -5, is how you interpret the roll. Whether a 1 and a 6 is the same as a 6 and a 1, or different, is a matter of how you interpret the roll.

There are exactly 36 possible results, no more, no less, each equally likely. Debating whether to interpret that as 2-12, or -5 to +5, or whatever, is interpretation. You can get exactly the same results by creating a table with all 36 possible combinations, with results columns of results. It makes no difference whatsoever to the odds. A 1 and a 6 will still come up 1/36th of the time, as will a 6 and a 1, and 2 and a 4.

This isn't statistics. This is probability. Of the most basic, fundamental kind. There's nothing to it other than simple arithmetic. To apply anything more complicated to it is illusion.