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Traveller’s Upcoming 50th Anniversary Ask

S

Sci-Fi Neophyte

SOC-10
Greetings and salutations from across the pond,

This is as much an ask as it is a proposal.

With the 50th anniversary of Traveller quickly approaching, 2027, right?, and with Mongoose now owning the IP, will you be re-releasing Classic Traveller rulebooks from 1977 in print as the originally sized and formatted three little black books (or perhaps as a single volume, properly edited compilation)?

I can think of no better way to honor Traveller's half-century birthday than by paying homage to its origins, in whole or in part.

What say Mongoose, please?
 
One addendum to your request - no errata, no corrections, no rules from later editions
a reprint of 77 edition should be just that by all means include a proposed errata sheet in the box but the rulebooks should be exactly the same s the 77 edition.

Just think in 2031 we can then get a reprint for the 59 anniversary of the 81 revision... :)
 
Well, that asks a deeper question.

Was there errata for '77? Or was it all just "fixed" for '81? '81 is '77 with all errata included. I mean, e.g. the whole Jump Routes thing - it's gone. Is that errata?

Another example, to me HG '79 simply doesn't exist. It's just a bad, buggy, preview. All of the changes in HG80 are errata, or something. Errata is not really the right word. Adding drywall to an unfinished house is not errata. HG79 was a mistake, and should not have been published. It was unfinished. I do not consider HG'79 canon at all.

They pretty much gave away the entire B5 80 "for free" by publishing it in JTAS to fix that mistake. This was no newsletter with a list of typos.

But '77? /shrug, I dunno. So much of it survives, the tweaks are pretty minor for '81. Clarifications, and such. But we never heard from Jump Routes again.
 
whartung said:
Well, that asks a deeper question.

Was there errata for '77? Or was it all just "fixed" for '81? '81 is '77 with all errata included. I mean, e.g. the whole Jump Routes thing - it's gone. Is that errata?

Another example, to me HG '79 simply doesn't exist. It's just a bad, buggy, preview. All of the changes in HG80 are errata, or something. Errata is not really the right word. Adding drywall to an unfinished house is not errata. HG79 was a mistake, and should not have been published. It was unfinished. I do not consider HG'79 canon at all.

They pretty much gave away the entire B5 80 "for free" by publishing it in JTAS to fix that mistake. This was no newsletter with a list of typos.

But '77? /shrug, I dunno. So much of it survives, the tweaks are pretty minor for '81. Clarifications, and such. But we never heard from Jump Routes again.
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That is a thought-provoking question, whartung. What are errata (additions, clarifications, or just formal decisions) to begin with? What do you call concepts that are forever removed from any TTRPG, CT, or otherwise (bad or incomplete ideas, things that just don’t quite fit the direction you want to go now)? Is any TTRPG “perfected” with errata, or just changed or different? By publishers making certain formal choices and forever moving an RPG in one direction over another, is this always to be viewed as an improvement, as something superior to the former? Do RPG editions even matter?

I don’t know for sure, but I’m leaning more towards, “No, I don’t necessarily think so.” It seems we are forever chasing our vestigial tails…10+ versions of Traveller, 7+ versions of D&D, 7+ versions of CoC. Will we ever get it “right”?

As for this thread, much like WOTC did for their 50th, I think Mongoose re-releasing the core, original, 1977 version of Traveller would be a great nostalgia piece. Yes, there were some additions and removals from 1977 to 1981 LBBs. No, I don’t think they need to re-release every version of the game, especially not the 1981 version, as the Classic Traveller Facsimile Edition on DTRPG already does this inexpensively, in my opinion. However, bringing the original game that started it all back to print for their 50th anniversary would be special, and I think many would slap down some credits for it.
 
Sci-Fi Neophyte said:
That is a thought-provoking question, whartung. What are errata (additions, clarifications, or just formal decisions) to begin with? What do you call concepts that are forever removed from any TTRPG, CT, or otherwise (bad or incomplete ideas, things that just don’t quite fit the direction you want to go now)? Is any TTRPG “perfected” with errata, or just changed or different? By publishers making certain formal choices and forever moving an RPG in one direction over another, is this always to be viewed as an improvement, as something superior to the former? Do RPG editions even matter?

I don’t know for sure, but I’m leaning more towards, “No, I don’t necessarily think so.” It seems we are forever chasing our vestigial tails…10+ versions of Traveller, 7+ versions of D&D, 7+ versions of CoC. Will we ever get it “right”?

As for this thread, much like WOTC did for their 50th, I think Mongoose re-releasing the core, original, 1977 version of Traveller would be a great nostalgia piece. Yes, there were some additions and removals from 1977 to 1981 LBBs. No, I don’t think they need to re-release every version of the game, especially not the 1981 version, as the Classic Traveller Facsimile Edition on DTRPG already does this inexpensively, in my opinion. However, bringing the original game that started it all back to print for their 50th anniversary would be special, and I think many would slap down some credits for it.
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I would love it to incorporate all of the developed errata and printed A5 for my old eyes. Bonus points for a box, and for the manuscript to be drilled for six whole punch.
 
"Errata" is only what was publically communicated by the publisher, designer or IP holder as "Oops we effed up, here is the fix" or "We forgot to put this into the game because of space issues". Anything else IMO is an improvement, a rules expansion or an optional rule. Or a new edition. So....

In Pre-Internet days of CT '77 (unless you were somehow chatting on DARPANET, you naughty hacker) errata was communicated by:
  • An errata sheet in a 2nd/3rd/etc. printing of a product for hex/chit wargames so the publisher did not have to edit/revise the rulebook and other imprecise components and tossing out the offending components sitting in the publisher's storage area. If you were an early puchaser, you could mail Avalon Hill, SPI or whoever for that errata.
  • Errata correcting errors was put into first pages of an expansion rulebook followed by the new rules, like TaskForce games did with the bagged versions of StarFire or Star Fleet Battles and some other games or RPGs, like Hero Games did for Champions in Champions 2 and Champions 3 supplements.
  • The "house organ" points out errata in the letters to the editor page or in an actual Article, like original Dragon Magazine, JTAS, Adventurer's Club and Judge's Guild stuff. Or something similar in someone else's "house organ" because you dont publish you own..
I remember looking up Striker and HG Errata was published in JTAS but I don't CT anymore much. I have not read JTAS or Challenge in a while. So is there "Official Errata" for CT'77 anywhere? By these options "it makes sense", "it doesn't change anything" or "Marc told me at 'Origins '79" does not cut it. Also careful because errata published after 1980 might refer to CT'80 and @mike wightman at the very least wont like that. Hi Mike👋 !
 
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In the head canon that is my gnarled brain of versioning, CT'80 is a revised version of CT'77, with The Traveller Book (mostly) being a final iteration of the CT ruleset. @mike wightman will vehemently disagree, but such is life.
This is much the same way (to me) with AD&D 1e. Most prople treated Unearthed Arcana and the Survival Guides as optional rules. But in that case the text in those same books said time and again "These are official changes to the rules", so Paladins are subclasses of Cavaliers, Thief-Acrobats are a thing, as are Non-Weapon Proficiency slots and so on. Probably why I am oddly attracted to Hackmaster...
 
I will, since the revision was in 1981 :)

'81 was a revision, not just an errata update, they changed too much.

I like the '81 rules, but I wish some of the stuff they changed had not been, or at least been offered as options, and some of the changes were not thought through enough.
 
RossWinn said:
This isn’t about just having the rules. This is about history, nostalgia, and fan service. I can’t wait to pre-order the ⌧ing thing…
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If it's about those things, how can they be satisfied by anything less than actual original books? Or something that actually comes from MWM?

I might still have some of the old books in physical form. If I can find them, I'll sell them to you for $100,000 each. Deal? I'll even personally fly them to you (though if I have to get a passport, that might take a while). I might even be able to get Marc to breathe on it. I'll need the money in advance, though.

Teasing aside, I hope you get what you want, but I don't expect you will, and if you do, I don't think you'll get it for a good price. If you feel like throwing money away, well, I've given you a more mutually beneficial option I think you (and anyone else) should strongly consider.
 
TheDS said:
If it's about those things, how can they be satisfied by anything less than actual original books? Or something that actually comes from MWM?

I might still have some of the old books in physical form. If I can find them, I'll sell them to you for $100,000 each. Deal? I'll even personally fly them to you (though if I have to get a passport, that might take a while). I might even be able to get Marc to breathe on it. I'll need the money in advance, though.

Teasing aside, I hope you get what you want, but I don't expect you will, and if you do, I don't think you'll get it for a good price. If you feel like throwing money away, well, I've given you a more mutually beneficial option I think you (and anyone else) should strongly consider.
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I have 14 separate editions of Traveller, from Classic, to Action!System, to Mongoose 2e. I’m not gonna stop buying them anytime soon. At least not until I get to 18 which is by my account the number of different versions. The really hard one to find is GRiP Traveller. Anyway, you might be surprised. We shall see.
 
Isn't COTI hosted by QLI? If so, surely Aramis or MJD has a copy of GRiP Traveller for you, if you invoke them hard enough. It might even be non-digital!
 
mike wightman said:
What is this Action!System version of Traveller of which you speak?
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I wrote Action! with Mark Arsenault and Patrick Sweeney in 2001/2002 and about 4 years later someone posted an Action! System conversion. You can find it online in a few places. It’s not complete, but it is interesting.
 
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