The Crow Challenges You!

[far-trader]

Originally posted by Scarecrow:
Y'know it'd be interesting to see if you could fit 200 dTons worth of gear into a streamlined hull that was exactly 200 dTons displacement. I'm betting not. Again, it's not relevant to gameplay but pfffff.....

Hard to say. I managed it with a 300ton trader, I think

The hard stuff fits and I think I have the soft stuff (fuel, at 22%) about right filling in the streamlined angles.

I seem to recall my (slightly oversized comparing to yours) Beowulf fitting the hard stuff but estimating that the soft stuff (just fuel again, and only 11%) left a lot of "other" space in the streamlined curves. The more slush volume (my "soft" stuff, usually fuel, but also armor, and possibly inaccessible drives as in some of your designs) the easier. So military ships should be quite doable. Much of their volume is gonna be soft (lots of fuel and armor, and the potential of inaccessible drives).

I'm tempted to try to fit stuff into you correct volume hull

But I'm not free to commit to that at the moment. Maybe someone else will accept the challenge

 

[RandyT0001]

My flattened sphere streamlined Aba-adakkur class 1000 dton liner is (IIRC) within 1% of actually being 1000 dtons of volume. All of the ships that I create and draw decklans for are tight (within 1-2% of designed volume as opposed to the 'accepted standard' of 10-20%) designs. It's a big 'flying saucer' without 'flair' but then again I'm not well versed in creating 3D models of my ships using 3D software. I have Blender but haven't really tried to apply myself to creating 3D models much since it seems like it will take me a bit of time to learn to draw using it. For a decent 3D modeller and deckplan draftsman I don't think it really would be very hard to do given some effort and time into the project. For the more accomplished 3D modellers here on the boards (such as Andrew, Mickazoid, Crow, etc) it shouldn't be too difficult. The only problem might be the calculus needed to get the volumes of the various sub-parts right (wings, projections, etc).

 

[TheEngineer]

Hi !

I have to agree that especially when using complex shapes is was perhaps a bit difficult to work exact. Now unfortunatally even my 3D design software package is not able to calculate volumes of freeform objects. You perhaps would have to use something more professional to get this (AutoCad or CATIA).
Anyway, by using e.g. CC2 (it let you measure the area or freeform outlines) and a rough-design excel spreadsheet (providing volume safe pre-design) its not a big problem.

Regards,

TE

 

[Scarecrow]

Hey don't drag me into this! I was just thinking out loud.

Seriously though you will need something like MAX or Maya that'll calculate the volume of an abstract shape before you can even start really.

If anyone wants to give it a go though, I'd be happy to see the results

Crow

 

[GypsyComet]

Possible? Yes. Easy? Not usually. It gets harder if you actually take ergonomics into account. It gets even harder if you don't have control over the shape or coherence of less than about 85 to 90% of the components. Both of these factors are why the standard Yacht is such a stone cold one to make work: two large percentage subcraft (Ship's Boat and an ATV) that need to work together, AND the quarters of the ship need to not just work, but work luxuriously.

Pin down the assumptions of the challenge, provide a target design with volume list, and give a more specific definition for "streamlined", and see what comes of it. Just don't impose a deadline.

 

[TheEngineer]

Crow, You should know what happens upon thinking loud in this forum

As Gypsycomet said, what stats should we use ?

 

[far-trader]

Originally posted by Scarecrow:
Hey don't drag me into this! I was just thinking out loud.

Drag you?! You pushed me!

Just trying to spread the fun

 

[su_liam]

Originally posted by TheEngineer:
Hi !

I have to agree that especially when using complex shapes is was perhaps a bit difficult to work exact. Now unfortunatally even my 3D design software package is not able to calculate volumes of freeform objects. You perhaps would have to use something more professional to get this (AutoCad or CATIA).
Anyway, by using e.g. CC2 (it let you measure the area or freeform outlines) and a rough-design excel spreadsheet (providing volume safe pre-design) its not a big problem.

Regards,

TE

Wings 3D calculates volumes and surface areas. Its still not exact because Wings is based on polygon subdivision, but it should be close enough for gaming or safe pre-design.

 

[su_liam]

Well, I guess I need to officially apologise. It looks like I've killed another perfectly good thread. I'm an Albatross.

I'm so very sorry...

 

[far-trader]

Nonsense Alik, this thread had gone to sleep long before you tried to stir it again with a good link.

 

[Maladominus]

I created a 300-ton Kismet Class Armed Courier (of Solomani design). And using High Guard construction rules, I managed to create a more than adequate 'adventure class starship'. Without breaking any of the rules.

Adventure? Can you say JUMP 4? It allows the characters in my CT campaign to travel across subsectors fairly quickly.

8 staterooms. Who needs more than 8 staterooms? Does any traveller campaign contain more than 8 Player-Characters at any given game session?

3 triple-turrets (3 hardpoints total). It's decently armed for a small non-Navy starship. Plus it has a 20-ton launch in the underbelly. The illustration does make it look less than a 300-ton ship, however.

And I managed to squeeze in a small sick bay for the Medics (small 4-ton size).

Cargo capacity is the weak point. It has about ~24 tons of cargo hold space. See the front pincers section? They look like cargo hold areas, but it's really the section where fuel is stored. A Jump-4 starship requires a SHITLOAD of jump fuel in order to operae. My Players hate paying for the expense of refined fuel. heheheh.

Here is our campaign's CMV Rotten Luck. CMV in my campaign means 'Confederation Mercantile Vessel'. The players don't own the ship. They just work for a large science corporation that allows them to use it. I'll see if I can post the High Guard construction notes later.

Starship design copyright by me. The commissioned illustration done by Greg Bahlmann.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

Very nice!

 

[sgbrown]

Great drawing!

Question (not a nit just curious)- Other than looking cool is there a benefit to the split forward hull?

sgb

 

[Maladominus]

Originally posted by SGB - Steve B:
Great drawing!

Question (not a nit just curious)- Other than looking cool is there a benefit to the split forward hull?

sgb

Nope. No engineering advantages were ever intended for the "catamaran" type hull (at least not in space flight). And when I designed this ship, I was well aware that the structure is not exactly 'streamlined', even tho it looks that way. In fact, it is classified accurately as a "Closed Structure", according to High Guard. Which means that technically, the ship is only "partially streamlined".

The odd thing is, if I reverse the structure into a reverse-Y, it might actually qualify as a "Wedge" shaped hull, thus allowing to qualify for 100% streamlined.

The only logical reason I chose this particular unique hull shape is because: "It looked like a very Terran design, and therefore made sense as a starship common in Solomani Confederation space."

And now, another screenshot:

The deckplan of the Kismet Class' Lower Deck. I commissioned our own Ron Vutpakdi (a long time and talented contributor here at COTI) to create this ship's deckplans. I knew that Ron made deckplans par excellence when I first spotted his Traveller deckplans a couple years ago (some of his works were made for the Avenger products if I recall). In fact, HIS deckplans are like 300% way more professional than anything GDW has ever done. So I asked him to do the deckplans for the Kismet Class Armed Courier, since I intended to use this starship as the "adventuring starship" for my campaign for months (years) to come.

Ron did a great job! If you need to hire someone to do great-quality starship deckplans (he does the final output in hi-res PDF files!), I'd recommend him highly. Notice that he even included the Traveller starship "Symbol Guide".

 

[GypsyComet]

Originally posted by Maladominus:
In fact, HIS deckplans are like 300% way more professional than anything GDW has ever done.

Color does not equate to "professional". Often the opposite, in fact. That said, Ron's work *is* nice and professional looking.

GDW also went OUT of business about the same time the Web came INTO existence. They pre-dated casual use of color in RPG books (unless you were TSR), and did their layout and deckplan work in an age when AutoCAD was only for *expensive* projects like buildings and defense contracts.

Kids these days...