TA #7/ T20 ship design questions

[Theophilus]

HI all.

I got TA #7 "Fighting Ships" on a lark, just the gearhead in me coming out. I realize that T20 uses a CT type system. But since I don't have the T20 rules, except the free T20 lite pdf, I have a couple of Questions.

The spinal mounts use a USP rating system, damage is fixed but the usp is used as a "modifier", Does a USP +20 equal a CT Factor K mount? +27 equal T,. [I'm trying to count on my fingers if the numbers don't match]

Secondly, concerning armour. Is the AR code the armor carried by a ship. The AHL had AR 5, CT AHL had armour 5. Atlantic AR 10, CT Atlantic Armour 10. Does that mean the Perisher has no armor and the Resolute Bastien has armour 12?

 

[mike wightman]

Hello there,

The spinal mounts use a USP rating system, damage is fixed but the usp is used as a "modifier", Does a USP +20 equal a CT Factor K mount? +27 equal T,. [I'm trying to count on my fingers if the numbers don't match]

Quite correct, there are no I or O factor spinal mounts, so you must have enough fingers

Secondly, concerning armour. Is the AR code the armor carried by a ship. The AHL had AR 5, CT AHL had armour 5. Atlantic AR 10, CT Atlantic Armour 10. Does that mean the Perisher has no armor and the Resolute Bastien has armour 12?

Yes, the AR is the armour carried and you're correct about all of them except for the Perisher. It has an AR of 1 in my copy.

Hope this helps.

 

[Theophilus]

Thank You,

I was trying to do a CT to TNE conversion. The rules in striker has an armor (ship) to Striker conversion.
Armor 15 is Striker 85, divided by toughness gives a little over 6 cm of armor , 6cm armor in tne is a ridiculously low amount. Others use a conversion on the CT percentage to a TNE percentage (of hull space), this gives a ridiculously large amount.

 

[Dom]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:

Yes, the AR is the armour carried and you're correct about all of them except for the Perisher. It has an AR of 1 in my copy.

Is it me, or is the Perisher scarily vulnerable to spinal PAs for a 'Fast Dreadnought'?

A single point of armour?! If I was the Solomani or the Zhodani and realised this I'd have a big smile! Admittedly, 400,00dT will take a while to die, but certainly under PP or HG this ship looks vulnerable...

 

[mike wightman]

I agree with you, Dom.
The Perisher wouldn't last long using HG PAWs (can't comment on PP-F because no one will sell me one yet ). Its huge size potects it from automatic criticals and the surface explosion critical hit, but the low AR still allows internal explosions with their critical hit potential (not to mention the dreaded fuel tanks shattered).
For my HG line of battle ship designs I start with an armour factor of 6 minimum to avoid the radiation crew-1 result as well.

 

[Dom]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
I agree with you, Dom.
The Perisher wouldn't last long using HG PAWs (can't comment on PP-F because no one will sell me one yet ).

In PP:F *any* spinal hit generates an automatic threshold check whether or not you roll over the end of a row. (Actually, with a PA, you need a spinal-E+ to get this on a ship armoured like the Perisher, mainly has PP links AR1-6 together). If you roll over the end of the row you get an automatic catastrophic damage check. Plus between 3d6 and 7d6 structure boxes getting crossed off!

The threshold checks are the killers, much like the HG criticals.

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
Its huge size potects it from automatic criticals and the surface explosion critical hit, but the low AR still allows internal explosions with their critical hit potential (not to mention the dreaded fuel tanks shattered).
For my HG line of battle ship designs I start with an armour factor of 6 minimum to avoid the radiation crew-1 result as well.

The biggest mistake you tend to see with HG is people thinking 'PAs are useless'. They're only useless if you don't design to protect against them... If you design for a pure meson environment a PA with cause you a lot of problems because armour (and size) are the only protection.

The huge size in PP terms means that your ship will loose systems but will be structurally intact. The Perisher would have 20+90+150 = 260 structure boxes (ie 65/65/65/65).

 

[Dom]

Originally posted by Theophilus:
TI was trying to do a CT to TNE conversion. The rules in striker has an armor (ship) to Striker conversion.
Armor 15 is Striker 85, divided by toughness gives a little over 6 cm of armor , 6cm armor in tne is a ridiculously low amount. Others use a conversion on the CT percentage to a TNE percentage (of hull space), this gives a ridiculously large amount.

FWIW there is a HG->T4 conversion on my own website that came from the TML. IIRC this should be compatible with TNE as the armour's petty much the same.

http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com/

 

[The Oz]

I can't imagine anyone designing a TRAVELLER warship that doesn't have protection against PAWs, since that same protection also defends against the lighter bay and turret weapons (meson bays excepted, of course).

IMTU, a "capital ship" is defined by the presence of a spinal mount and sufficient armor to prevent automatic criticals from the biggest spinal PAW the ship might have to face.

Escorts and missile ships (pretty much the same IMTU) are different, relying on the size modifer, Agility, and sheer numbers to withstand spinal PAWs (after all, one spinal mount can only kill one target per turn). But even there I put on as much armor as I can, to give protection to the crew against Radiation hits and to remove the chance of internal explosions from surface hits. As was said earlier, Armor-6 is enough for this.

At lower TLs designing ships like this is more difficult and more fun, of course.

 

[Theophilus]

Exactly,
My point is, The Perisher, with an armor of 1 can be swamped by fighters and system defense boats. And the Tianemen with AR-0 is even worse. When a fighter or small attack craft with a usp-3 weapon can get internal hits against a capital ship, there's a problem with the design.
With a cost of 244,593.8MCr I can buy 6683 Likuurka Bombers (AR 13), Or 2149 Grigot Strike fighters (AR 14), Or 9943 Dryad Fighters (AR 0), For the cost of a Squadron of Perishers I can get 50,000 Likuurka Bombers, Someone want to play out a 50,000 bomber strike against a squadrom of Perishers?

 

[BetterThanLife]

Actually If I was the commander of a Perisher I wouldn't be too concerned with PAWS. Under the T20 system the Meson gun is King. Any spinal mount Meson gun, even a Factor 9 Meson Bay Destroys the Perisher with one Crit. (And a Spinal Meson Crits 55% of the time, while the bay 30% of the time.) A Crit from a Factor 4 Meson Bay won't quite kill a Perisher outright (with average rolls) but it will get very close. Two will kill a Perisher with room to spare. A Spinal Meson Crit with average rolls will kill a 10,000,000 Ton ship with one Crit. (Yes that is 10 Million tons.) Well at least at that size it isn't just vaporized.

See the discussion T20 Drednaughts, whats the point?