T5 Support and Supplements

[mike wightman]

One of the reasons I think MgT is doing so well is that it is attracting a lot of younger players.

Like it or not the sci-fi of the youth of today is very different to the sci-fi of our day.

Now what is it that allows MgT to run B5, JD, SD, HS and yes the OTU - adaptability, flexibility, or how about the fact that it has moved beyond the tropes of the OTU?
It's still much the same rules system underneath.

I noticed the other day that by the time you get to LBB5 the OTU is becoming a straightjacket. In the original LBs B1-4 you could freely make stuff up - by the time of HG though it becomes very difficult to adapt the tech in that book without some very liberal interpretations.

LBBs 6-8 were 3rd Imperium sourcebooks with all generic traits thrown out.

All a very long winded way of saying - make up a new setting for T5.

Or perhaps re-image the 3rd Imperium (personal bias would be to go back to the darker Imperium of the proto-Traveller movement).

Update the tech sort of in line with current sci-fi (Iain Banks, Peter Hamilton, Alistair Reynolds, Richard Morgan, Stephen Baxter are my current favourites), TV , cinema and gaming sources should not be overlooked.

This need not break the OTU setting - it's all about the description and flavour rather than the actual tech paradigm (how much magic tech is in the OTU again? )

 

[aramis]

I agree with Mike on why MGT is doing well...

But not on the OTU content of Bk5-Bk8... All of these provide an OTU baseline, yes... but all three of them have a non-OTU rules chunk. The CGen in Bk5-7 is very much OTU centric (And Bk4 was not), but the non-character rules in Bks 5-8 is not OTU specific.

Adventures 5 and later are also very clearly OTU driven.
Supplements 3,5,8,9,10,11: all very much OTU
Supplements 4,6,7,12,13: OTU oriented, but not OTU specific
Supp 1, 2: generic.

Mongoose has no "OTU Oriented" books, really, aside from Sup 3 Fighting Ships and the separate OTU subline.

It's utterly failed at one of Matthew's goals for it; it's further fragmented the fanbase, not unified it as Matthew claimed as a goal.

But its succeeded at several more...
1) revitalizing the brand in retailer eyes
2) establishing a player base
3) establishing a 3rd party publisher base
4) providing Mongoose a consistent base for its non-OTU settings.
5) picking up use by a goodly share of grognards... (but by no means all...)
6) Making Mongoose and Marc Miller money

Bottom line in the modern world... if it doesn't make someone money, it doesn't get done. And it's still supported and thus it must be making enough money to pay the labor.

 

[Blue Ghost]

What are; "B5, JD, SD, HS"

 

[DaveChase]

Mike, I disagree with you on LBB 6-8. Sure they made the rules a bit tighter but they were not purely OTU/Imperium.

Especially Book 8, it was wide open. It meantioned the other races robots but only showed Imperial ones. But it was only as examples. The build your own was very nice.

What are; "B5, JD, SD, HS"

B5 = Babylon 5 (TV show)
JD = Judge Dredd
SD = Strotium Dog (spelling, I know its wrong but let the true fans correct me )
HS = I cant remember right now. Must be the heat, old age, and I just cant remember and I am too lazy to look it up. :lol:

Dave Chase

 

[aramis]

Strontium Dog
Hammer's Slammers.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Ah thanks. I can't say I've ever opened a page of Strontium Dog comics, but I've heard of the others.

To tack on and reinforce the more salient points;

The other amazing thing is that Traveller, for of it's official milieu, is supposed to be a generic sci-fi RPG. So where you can do the OTU or one of those mentioned, you can also do something infinitely more interesting or entertaining with the rules, like your version of Doc Who, or some anime thing, a 1950's B-movie classic, or even Jules Verne. Heck, you can also do Homer or Chaucer if you were so inclined.

Me, I'm a CT kind of guy Love the whole before-during-and-after Frontier war thing in the Spinward Marches. I love the 7+ task/to-hit throw, and will always have fond memories of storming hotels, plunging the depths of those pyramids in Starter Trav, or trekking across the frozen tundra that is Mithril.

But the game has got to grow. We move onward.

 

[aramis]

Uh, BG, CT is 8+, not 7+...

 

[robject]

One of the reasons I think MgT is doing so well is that it is attracting a lot of younger players.

It is definitely doing this. But I suspect the draw has little to do with what the youth of today view as sci-fi. Yes, Mongoose does an awesome job in extending Traveller to other settings. But most of the supplements are for... Traveller as a generic rules set. It helps enormously to showcase the system with such different settings. What folks end up doing is what Traveller originally was for: rolling your own setting, and having a resource base to borrow from.

All a very long winded way of saying - make up a new setting for T5.

There are many possible new and alternate settings. I think a good bet is to build a setting that draws from the huge body of material already existing. That basically implies something grounded in the OTU, though it doesn't have to be the Old Traveller Universe.

The other amazing thing is that Traveller, for of it's official milieu, is supposed to be a generic sci-fi RPG.

The OTU is best seen as a resource. A vast resource. At the same time, I'm still thinking about Wanderer for T5.

At any rate, the game has got to mature. Old Traveller material focused on the Third Imperium. And there's plenty of stuff left to do there. But Mongoose is doing a great work in showing us how Traveller can do more than just the Imperium.

 

[Blue Ghost]

uh, bg, ct is 8+, not 7+...

doh!

 

[Andrew Boulton]

You could say that the two different published sectors (Spinward Marches and Solomani Rim) for CT were different milieus even if set at the same time period. Did they fragment the market?

A little - I didn't buy SMC because I'd moved my campaign to the Rim.

Some milieux are similar enough that a few supplements can be shared (eg fluff for CT, GT, and some MT & T20), but in many cases they'll only appeal to one segment.

 

[Gray Lensman]

A little - I didn't buy SMC because I'd moved my campaign to the Rim.

But you were still buying/playing in the same rule set right? I just don't see how that is fragmenting the market.

Now, having T5 and MgT in production at the same time I would consider fragmenting the market.

Thanks,

Dan

 

[robject]

Maybe, but there's also overlap: many who will buy T5 already have Mongoose, and vice versa. I own and use both.

And weapons and armor can convert from one to the other; to some, then, T5 might be considered a supplement for Mongoose.

 

[Supplement Four]

...T5 might be considered a supplement for Mongoose.

If T5 is a hit, you'll see Mongoose producing products for both systems, I'm sure.

 

[MJD]

I'm going to bet against you there, Ken.

I see your logic, but I suspect the counter argument may be stronger. Ie Mongoose will support their own rules set. If they were a smaller company (or if T5 achieved the success of CT in its day) then economic pressure might make Mongoose want to gain revenue from the T5 sector of the market.

But unless T5 is not so much a hit as a gigantic nuclear explosion, and posibly not even then, I think that Mongoose would continue to support one rules set (their own).

My impression is based on how I've seen Mongoose operate. I may be wildly wrong (usually am) but that's my general feeling. Be interesting to see which of us is right.

 

[robject]

If T5 is a hit, you'll see Mongoose producing products for both systems, I'm sure.

I don't think they'll do that. I don't think they'll need to, either. In fact Mongoose sourcebooks would work fine with any system, so I think that's as far as they'd want to or need to go.

 

[Supplement Four]

I'm going to bet against you there, Ken.

I see your logic, but I suspect the counter argument may be stronger.

I don't think they'll do that.

The reason I say that is that Mongoose has proven in the past that it will go multi-system.

Before they stopped publishing for the Conan game, their plan was to continue publishing using the Conan RPG 2E rules but also publish Conan using the RuneQuest rules. Their plan was to have the game under both rule sets and then publish rules-lite supplementary material useable by players of both systems.

I could (not would) envison them doing the same with Traveller. You'd open a new book, and there'd be an introduction telling you that the book you hold in your hands can be used for Traveller using either rule set. Maybe there's a three-page conversion section in the back of the book for the few rules that are included.

It wouldn't be a stretch for me to believe that they'd produce a one-off to support T5, rules heavy, and it that suceeded, that they'd do more.

But, most likely, I see them producing books for both--not just focussing on MGT.

I'm only guessing though. You guys know better than me.

 

[aramis]

the differences in tech are big; the characters are far worse. Every NPC wold need dual stats; all equipment as well. Ship plans wold be more than 10% off.

 

[Vargas]

Here's what I wanted to know.... who is going to write these sourcebooks? The list of potential candidates is rather short these days. In fact, pretty much everyone with a recent track record of publishing for Traveller (and who's still in the game) is writing for Mongoose.

Perhaps this is an opportunity to recruit freelancers with a fresh take on the game?

 

[robject]

Perhaps this is an opportunity to recruit freelancers with a fresh take on the game?

And recruit freelancers who have produced Traveller material before.

If T5 really does score, then perhaps Mongoose would be thinking about it. But I think they have plenty on their plate now, though, and for the foreseeable future. It is just as likely (i.e. not very) that they might tweak peripheral bits of their system towards T5 for the sake of some "free" compatibility.

It's more likely that there might be some Signs & Portents articles on conversion between the two systems. Armor and weapon damage are relatively easy to convert, and are worth no more than an article.

Any way they do it, their best best, I assume, is to press on.

 

[HG_B]

Hmm, from what I've just read, unless T5 will ship as only a rules set (at first) it is still at least a couple years off.