T5 Errata Discussion Thread

[Thoom]

ratings means enlisted men. it is a naval term.

OK but it still doesn't tell me how it affects Branch. Ratings seems to mean 'rank', but rank doesn't determine branch when promoted. The quote from p.90 is "...; Ratings determine Branch when promoted;..."

P.74 says "A character who receives a Commission may roll for Branch or keep his current Branch"

 

[Magnus von Thornwood]

Errata page 3.

Thoom, I saw your question regarding Ops and direct you to page 3 of Errata v0.71 which changes some of the Ops and Table titles. That should get you squared away.

Not sure what your question is regarding Enlisted changing Branch upon Promotion, what exactly is messing with you? Care to post an example? Sorry having a case of the stupids I guess, also kinda distracted doing an Army CharGen at the moment which is what made me respond since I am working on the page now.

 

[Thoom]

Thoom, I saw your question regarding Ops and direct you to page 3 of Errata v0.71 which changes some of the Ops and Table titles. That should get you squared away.

I had seen that and worked through most of it but your comment had me read it again and I had missed a few changes. It still leaves out 'garrison' which I don't know on which table to roll for.

Not sure what your question is regarding Enlisted changing Branch upon Promotion, what exactly is messing with you? Care to post an example? Sorry having a case of the stupids I guess, also kinda distracted doing an Army CharGen at the moment which is what made me respond since I am working on the page now.

Well, page 74 is clear to me but the text on page 90, which I quote above, doesn't make sense to me. Page 74 tells me that if you're enlisted and get commissioned, you can either change branch or stay in the same branch. Page 90 tells me that when I get commissioned my rank determines my branch? Ratings = ranks, right?

 

[aramis]

OK but it still doesn't tell me how it affects Branch. Ratings seems to mean 'rank', but rank doesn't determine branch when promoted. The quote from p.90 is "...; Ratings determine Branch when promoted;..."

P.74 says "A character who receives a Commission may roll for Branch or keep his current Branch"

rating, in naval parlance, is either a generic term for enlisted men, or a term congruent to specialty.

For example, TC3... Telecommunications is the rating, petty oficer 3rd class is the rank, and the TC3 is at least an e4 by grade (but could, in theory, be an e5 or e6 with a 2nd class rate striking into a the TC rating). Note that TC is a USCG rate.

given the context clues, it may be the character's specialty.

 

[Thoom]

Doh! Ok then Ratings = enlisted. Then the text makes sense. I would change 'ratings' to 'enlisted' in the text to make it clearer (for those like me who aren't familiar with this parlance).

Thanks.

 

[DonM]

Doh! Ok then Ratings = enlisted. Then the text makes sense. I would change 'ratings' to 'enlisted' in the text to make it clearer (for those like me who aren't familiar with this parlance).

Thanks.

I thought we had. Ok, let me get my highlighter and search again.

 

[thalassogen]

Playing with gun maker I encountered another oddity:

AMg-8 Assault Machinegun - 8
R=4 Cr4,500 6.40kg QREBS=5 0 0+1 0 Effects=Bullet-4 Blast-1 Bang-2
Recoil=Yes Loud=Loud Flash=No Heat=No Vacc=Ok UW=No CQ=-3

vs.

AG-8 Assault Gun - 8
R=4 Cr7,500 7.20kg QREBS=5 0 0+1 0 Effects=Blast-1 Bang-2
Recoil=Hi Loud=Vloud Flash=No Heat=No Vacc=Ok UW=No CQ=-3

1) Machineguns have Bullet as default damage type, Guns don't have such a type, but should have Bullet, too, I guess.
2) Machineguns can be constructed without an descriptor, Guns cannot. Shouldn't it be possible to just have a "Gun"?

 

[thalassogen]

While comparing

GR-12 Gauss Rifle - 12
R=5 Cr1,000 3.60kg QREBS=5 0 0 0 0 Effects=Bullet-5
Recoil=Yes Loud=Loud Flash=Mag Heat=No Vacc=Ok UW=No CQ=-5

and

GG-13 Gauss Gun - 13
R=4 Cr10,000 8.10kg QREBS=5 0 0+1 0 Effects=Bullet-3
Recoil=Hi Loud=Vloud Flash=Mag Heat=No Vacc=Ok UW=No CQ=-3

and in extension

VrfGGC-15 VRF Gauss Gun Crewed - 15
R=4 Cr90,000 113.40kg QREBS=5 0 0+7 0 Effects=Bullet-4
Recoil=Hi Loud=Vloud Flash=Mag Heat=No Vacc=Ok UW=No CQ=No

I started wondering if I got the whole GunMaker chapter wrong or if the printed chapter is bugged (maybe even accidentally from an older version of the manuscript?)...

The GR is better at everything or so it seems, so why bothering with the GG or even the VRF GG? I always imagined the VRF GG to spray away a cloud of small bullets and that amasses to just +1 damage die compared to the GG? And still one damage die less than the GR?

 

[Reban]

The GR is better at everything or so it seems, so why bothering with the GG or even the VRF GG? I always imagined the VRF GG to spray away a cloud of small bullets and that amasses to just +1 damage die compared to the GG? And still one damage die less than the GR?

Just a different view, yours is equally valid, but I'd always envisaged the Gun type to represent larger caliber weapons. For conventional weapons 20mm and up. I'm not sure what calibers Gauss Guns in the Imperium would come in. I know the standard Gauss Rifle round in TNE is 4mm so I'd assume Gauss guns start around 20mm as well.

Shorter range and lower effects suggest that a GG is using less power to lob a bigger projectile more slowly than the GR and its hypervelocity dart.

But thats just speculation, it doesn;t make sense to build weapons like that in the real world.

I think you may want to check your numbers again. Looking at the VRF Gauss Gun I'm getting Bullet-6. I'm combining D1 =2 and D2 =3 because they're both have the Bullet descriptor and VRF added a further D = 1

 

[thalassogen]

I'm combining D1 =2 and D2 =3 because they're both have the Bullet descriptor and VRF added a further D = 1

Checking my PDF D1 does not have the bullet descriptor...
But this question got raised several times in the errata over the last 6 months or so... Does the "*" apply to D2/H2 and/or D3/H3 (at least when Guns are concerned)...

 

[Reban]

D1 is linked to H1 and the note for Guns on p251 say: "* Hit Type is determined by other details of the weapon."

I think that should mean you take the D1 value for Gun and add it to the D2 descriptor and Effect. So in this case D1=2 added to Bullet D2=3 becomes Bullet-5

That seems to be the natural way for the fillform to work. Now this is at odds with the example for the PGMP-11 on p258, but I think there a very simple typo here in the D1D2 column that says 2+3=3 when it should be 2+3=5

Think about it. By not adding the D1 value for Guns the result is a Gun that does less damage than a Rifle.

We really need the updated errata....

 

[thalassogen]

Your statement makes sense and would answer several of my questions!
I am eagerly awaiting the updated errata document, too!

 

[Reban]

Your statement makes sense and would answer several of my questions!
I am eagerly awaiting the updated errata document, too!

I made sense? :nonono: That can't be good....

I do find that working through the fillforms slowly and treating the math as basic accounting, i.e. add everything in a column unless it says otherwise, helps me to figure out how T5 works.

Btw if I haven't said it before Thalassogen your apps are great, thanks for your work.

 

[thalassogen]

Thanks!

 

[OjnoTheRed]

Spaceport generation

This has been raised on the Errata Thread by thalassogen and received no answer as yet according to DonM.

To reiterate: as it stands, the lower the local population, the more likely the (non-mainworld) world is to have a good quality spaceport. As written, the rule leads to most population zero non-mainworlds having a spaceport, and the higher the local pop, the less likely a local spaceport is.

What I would like to propose is that the table stay the same but the roll become 2D-(Local Population). This would lead to the following results:

Roll	0	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9
2	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
3	G	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
4	H	G	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
5	H	H	G	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
6	Y	H	H	G	F	F	F	F	F	F
7	Y	Y	H	H	G	F	F	F	F	F
8	Y	Y	Y	H	H	G	F	F	F	F
9	Y	Y	Y	Y	H	H	G	F	F	F
10	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	H	H	G	F	F
11	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	H	H	G	F
12	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	H	H	G

Each column is the resulting spaceport for the population figure at the top of the column; local population 7+ (tens of millions) is guaranteed a spaceport; Local Population of 0 gives no spaceport on a roll of 6+ (72% chance).

There is a further fix I would like to see. On p. 437, Inferno is listed as YSB000-0 - i.e. guaranteed barren and no spaceport; RadWorld is listed as StSAH000-0 and so is guaranteed barren, but might have a spaceport; I would list RadWorld as YSAH000-0.

 

[Original_Carl]

From the errata thread...

On page 328, where discussing starship ergonomics the book text says calculate ergonomics as (f/c) - 5. This results in a max of -1 if you limit yourself to spacious controls. Then, it states to subtract two if there is no bridge. See page 348 for the specifics.

The conflict comes when you go back to page 327, where it talks about control ergonomics. It describes and defines a bridge, and then states:

The Benefits Of A Bridge. If a ship has a Bridge, then its Control Ergonomics Mod is increased +2.

These mods seem to contradict each other.

I've been giving this some thought after examining the Ergonomics equation in depth for another thread. Maybe this is intentional after all and the bonuses and penalties are as they should be.

After all, if you allocate a special room for your controls and stuff, you should get a bonus to your Ergos. Conversely, if you don't have a dedicated bridge, your Ergo score should take a hit.

Your Mileage May Vary and all that.

 

[Reban]

Robots

I'm puzzled


In the RobotMaker all the components have fixed volumes expressed in liters.

Are these volumes fixed or do they vary with the size of the sophont form or pattern.

For example:

A human is 72 liters or 72 units. It should probably have a Standard Bony Interior Skeleton which is 12 units or 12 liters. that sounds okay right?


For lack of a suitable example say we use a Giant Humanoid Alien as a pattern. If the GHA is 144 liters and has a Standard Bony Interior Skeleton. Going through the design tables I see no multipler for the number of units required so it's still 12 units or 12 liters.


Thats a 12 liter skeleton for a 144 liter body. Even if I require a "Strong" skeleton based on Str, thats only 16 liters.

This goes for all the components. I can understand that robot brains could stay the same, but legs, arms, baseplates etc.?

What am I missing?

 

[Licheking]

They are fixed, like all the other Makers its a plug and play system, with pre-built components added together to get the final item you want. The only place that size matters is when your assigning the values for the C1, C2, and C3 where you can get some outrageous scores if your form uses more dice for any of them. Bigger just means you can fit more in for all other components.

I have made several robots, including converting all the Robots from the old Travellers Aid supplement 101 Robots using just these rules and some little tweaks to make them fit with the supplement.

 

[Reban]

Thats what I thought. It just puzzles me a bit that regardless of total robot volume the important components will never need to take up more or less volume. I think the main problem with this is that the RobotMaker is biased towards 72 Liter humaniform robots despite stating that any sophont can be used as a pattern.

I have always assumed that the Lifter and Zero-G module just provided movement of the normal sophont speeds. If you wished more then build a vehicle and add an artificial brain. The Zero-G module works fine as is, more expensive but smaller if you take the above to be true.

Just to answer this here rather than in the Errata thread:

I don't mind if they do provide the same speed as the pattern sophont, but clarification is needed as to whether they do this or follow the more general rules for lifters.

Building strangeform robots using VehicleMaker and adding a robot brain is fine but only works well down to 0.5ton volumes. Below that volume it should be possible to make a range of robots with a wide range of capabilities including vehicle like speeds in RobotMaker.

Consider there are missiles with robot brains and high speeds (see Self aware Missiles p.393). Now think about all the recon drones, uavs, messenger bots that are around 100liters or less and have speeds equivalent to vehicles.

There are actually many paths to build anything in T5, I'm just pointing out what might be an error or omission in the undercarriage tables. If I'm right and the Mobile Lifter and Zer-G options fall in line with the extensive rules elsewhere for Lifters and G-Drives then they fill an important gap.

 

[Dagrill]

Naval Attache/Aide

Hi,

not sure if this has already been discussed, but one of the things I feel missing from HG in T5 is the Naval Attache Aide, with it's auto promotion & the possibility of 2 promotion in a term.

To me this reflects nepotism or just an admiral having his favourites and pushing through the accelerated promotion of a bright young(er) officer.

Kind Regards

David