T20 Military TO&E

[justacaveman]

Does anyone have an updated list of Traveller Military Tables of Organization and Equipment.

I'm working on equipping a T20 marine platoon for MTU and need to know what the current canon for military units is.

Also does anyone know if T20 Battledress is going to be like CT, or more like T4. It would also help to know what the T20 Armor Ratings are for military grade armor, and the damage values for military weapons. The capabilities of the equipment will dictate much of the TO&E.

 

[MegaCredit]

I read in another forum that Battledress is treated like a vehicle in T20. If true this is quite different than CT or Megatraveller. I believe that this is the correct method seeing how Lifeblood and Stamina work.

 

[Vargr Merc]

According to Striker II, the standard Imperial Marine Line Company is composed of:

- One Command Post Section with: Captain along with your associated staff personnel, an Imperial Marine APC (Command Variant)and an infantry squad for security.

- Four Marine Platoons, each with:
Platoon HQ - Platoon Leader and an infantry squad
An Imperial Marine APC

5 x Marine Squads, each with:
Squad Leaders and one Marine APC

Marines in Imperial service are equipped with TL14 light Battledress. All infantrymen are armed with a TL14 fusion rifle with an integral TL15 fusion rifle. Leaders are armed with TL14 fusion rifles.

YMMV

Six Actual, Out.

 

[justacaveman]

Marines in Imperial service are equipped with TL14 light Battledress. All infantrymen are armed with a TL14 fusion rifle with an integral TL15 fusion rifle. Leaders are armed with TL14 fusion rifles.

Clarification Please?

 

[Vargr Merc]

Your guess is as good as mine. That is verbatim from the text. I did check through all available entries and if its a typo or misprint, it is the same throughout all the entire section.

My take on it is that the have a TL14 fusion rifle with an integral TL15 fusion built tandem with it....or the TL15 gun is mounted on the battledress. The text provides no definitive explanantion.

Happy hunting.

Six Actual, Out.

 

[eclipse]

Originally posted by Vargr Merc:
Your guess is as good as mine. That is verbatim from the text. I did check through all available entries and if its a typo or misprint, it is the same throughout all the entire section.

My take on it is that the have a TL14 fusion rifle with an integral TL15 fusion built tandem with it....or the TL15 gun is mounted on the battledress. The text provides no definitive explanantion.

Happy hunting.

Six Actual, Out.

I'd read that as there is an TL F Fusion rifle as an integral part of each Squad. i.e. the squad support weapon. I still like the idea of them having a Gauss carbine as a PDF. Sometimes you want to kill something without taking out the wall behind it.

 

[justacaveman]

Thanks for the help!

Now if I only had the technical info from the T20 book I'd be completely happy.

Barring the usual cash flow problems of course.

Thanks guys!

 

[Shadow Bear]

Originally posted by LordRhys:
Thanks for the help!

Now if I only had the technical info from the T20 book I'd be completely happy.

Barring the usual cash flow problems of course.

Thanks guys!

Nothing about Marine organization in the Play Test Rules I saw. There are some notes in the first PDF installment as side comments (mainly regarding the Cutlass tradition).

 

[justacaveman]

Was thinking more about the equipment capabilities.

Whether or not the Battledress will have built-in Grav-belts (like in T4), the damage from an FGMP-14 etc...

You have to have the info so that you know how a typical Imperial Marine would be equipped. After all, if a Gauss Rifle is ineffective against the Imperium's most common enemies he's not gonna carry one. Plus, the equipment and weapons for zero-g combat are going to be different than for a planetary assault, or a commando raid etc...

Since the Imperial Marines have a wide range of combat conditions, they're going to have to be equipped and trained for the various possibilities.

Guess I just have to wait for my book to arrive. Sometimes I'm so impatient. The wife says I'm like a kid waiting for Xmas.

 

[Vargr Merc]

I've done a bit more research with the material I have available.

Per Striker II, and after finding additional info sequestered away in one of the scenarios with that book, it appears that Imperial Marines (their commanders and regular infantry) are armed with TL14 4.7cm fusion rifle, the standard infantry rifle also has an integral TL9 4cm RAM grenade launcher.

Squad support is available in the form of a TL15 5.1cm fusion rifle and tl15 30kg Fire & Forget missles. As stated previously, they wear TL14 light battledress.

An additional note gleaned from the Regency Combat Vehicle Guide also indicated that nearly all marine infantry can be classified as "grav" capable. Whether that grav capability is integral in their battledress or in the form of a grav belt or harness is not detailed.

As to lighter arms, such as guass rifles and pistols, there is no indication that they have those arms in any of these sources. That is not to say that they could not be armed with them, if a particular situation warranted it.

That being said, it is my personal opinion that once the Imperial Marines are involved, your "discreet and gentile" combat options are moot. The Marines do not have sufficient numbers to passify and police a target world. If they show up in orbit, you can expect that they are there to melt down your citys and use the molten mass as a parking lot and spaceport.

YMMV

Six Actual, Out.

 

[Prometheus]

With the coming of the T20 system... is there a New version/form of striker coming out.. and in that vein of thought is there consideration or discussion of force structuring in relation to the lethality of technology? Also with the change in structure is there reference to the US Army IBCT/ Force XXI and the C4I/C7I style of Command and Control?

 

[tjoneslo]

If you are still interested in Imperial TO&E, I suggest a copy of GT:Ground Forces. This fine book discusses all aspects of the Imperial military from the Induction process and training through figuring out how big the army on each world is. Includes stats on equipment from blankets to grav tanks.

 

[doomhunk]

You might find this link useful:

http://www.d-n-i.net/second_level/boyd_military.htm

 

[Tom Schoene]

I've been rather disapointed with most of the Traveller TO&Es. They really don't seem to take advantage of the incredible amounts of intelligence, surveillance, and reconaissance (ISR) capability and remote firepower that a 3I combat unit ought to be using.

Here's a sketch of how I'd form a heavy Imperial Marine infantry platoon (a Army unit would have a pair of tanks in the platoon, but only three squads and one command team. It would rely more on external ISR assets). These are big units, and they depend on having a high proportion of long-service troops (including veteran junior officers) to build the necessary battlefield awareness skills.

Command Element: There are two command teams -- one led by the Platoon Leader (a senior LT), the other by the Assistant Platoon Leader (a junior LT). Each officer has a senior sergeant supporting them. In addition to the officer and NCO, each command APC carries an operations team of one ISR coordinator, one fire support coordinator, and one communications operator, and the vehicle crew of a driver and a gunner/commander. The APC has up to two-dozen reconaissance drones run by the ISR coordinator, (plus the standard APC armament of a fusion gun and tac missiles).

Four Squads: Each squad has a squad leader, two 4-man fire teams, and a 2-man vehicle crew, and is mounted on a heavy APC. The APC carries a half-dozen recon drones that can be controlled directly by the squad leader or APC gunner (plus the usual armament). The squad leader is given forward-observer equipment and training, and would generally dismount with his troops.

At the tactical level, grav combat is so fluid that trying to maintain the typical two up, one back reserve just doen't work, so it's typical for the platoon to operate as two sections, each of two squads plus a command team. In mobile combat, the two sections work in overwatch -- one moving, one supporting. In occupation duties, the two sections would cover overlapping patrol areas, and each would be on-call to support the other as needed.

In addition to the platoon's organic fire support from the APCs, the fire support coordinators can call in ground-based artillery (including disposable rocket launcher batteries), ortillery from the Marines' transport ships, fighter support.

And they do use nukes -- small ones, mind you, but nukes none the less. They don't have the numbers to play nice against planetary forces that probably outnumber them 10 to one.

 

[justacaveman]

Tom,

I like your TO&E. MTU has as a greater emphasis on robotics and cybernetics, so the following changes would be made.

Each Marine squad would have 2 Robotic Fire Support Units as part of their TO&E. These units are about twice the size of a marine in Light Battledress (mostly width), and have the squad support weapons mounted on them. The RFSU's are capable of performing sentry duties, and providing fire support on demand. They are not AI's, they're basically self-propelled support weapon systems. They're directed by a squad member who designates targets, and chooses which weapon to use. Because the marines are usually outnumbered, I use this setup in order to increase the firepower of the units. This also explains why G-Carriers are designed to hold up to 12 passengers (8 infantry,2 RFSU's).

Imperial Guard units are organized the same as Imperial Marine units (All Imperial Guards are former Imperial Marine combat veterans.). These units are the bodyguards of the Royal Family. The main difference between the units is that the Imperial Guards have the most cutting edge equipment (including cybernetics), and are all combat veterans. The RFSU's are replaced with CFSU's (Cyborg Fire Support Units), basically RFSU's with a human brain instead of a robotic brain. The CFSU's are also unofficially known as the Living Dead, as they're recruited from deceased Imperial Guards. The Imperial Guards are all volunteers heavily screened for loyalty and ability. The CFSU's are even more heavily screened, and must choose to be one of the Living Dead.

The current equipment list used will unfortunately have to wait on the arrival of my copy of T20.

 

[DrSkull]

I don't know, the Imperial prejudice against armed Robots and Cyborgs of any sort is pretty strong. I think that remote-operated weapons platforms are more likely than Robotic or Cybernetic ones.

 

[justacaveman]

Normally this would be true. However, IMTU the predjudice against cyborgs is not as prevalent.

The RFSU's are more mobile weapons platform than independent robot. An RFSU will only fire on targets that the controller has designated as hostile and given permission to engage. In sentry mode RFSU's are early warning devices, and do not engage targets on their own. The RFSU's robotics are used for mobilty, and fire control. The operater doesn't have to drive or aim it, he just has to tell it where to go and what to shoot. This could be as simple as follow me and engage red priority targets, or follow me and and operate in anti-missle mode.

The Imperium IMTU does not trust the judgement of robots, and the "only" armed cyborg troops are in the Imperial Guard.

Most cybernetics used by the Imperial Guard are sense enhancing, data storage, and target acquisition. The Living Dead are used instead of RFSU's because of their ability for independent judgement, and you can be sure there are loyalty safeguards in place.

 

[Arsulon]

In a sense you can't blame the Imperium for steering clear of RPV's and combat androids/robots: their foremost antagonist has been the Zhodani, who regularly employ remote combatants and may be assumed to field more advanced models guided by a greater resource of operational experience. Likewise, there is the risk of the Joes remotely hacking Imperial combots psionically or electonically (i.e. using computer empathy or conventional means). E.W. in general seems to have been ignored in most versions of Traveller: a pity since it need not be plodding "netrunning" on the order of Alternity (T.S.R.), but could be simulated by abstract attacking/defending pools like Space Master (I.C.E.). Personally, I'd like to see a more organic approach to military grade cybernetics, something on the order of David Weber's Imperial Cadre or Marines from "Path of the Fury". No need to assume people STILL find cybernetic enhancements wierd 3000 years in the future (even taking into account Vilani conservatism).

 

[tim_manley]

I once ran a robot heavy game where the players played what was called the 'chip squad'. They basically hunted down rogue robots. I was inspired by the Heavy Metal (which, btw, was much better when I was a teenager....just watched it on DVD again).

In that setting combot units used hunter-seeker-killer droids that were a lot like robotic dogs with laser rifles attached to their bodies (remember, I was a teenager then . Each combat team of 3 men would have 1 or 2 of these. They'd also have dedicated robotic artillery support.

IMTU (that campaign at least) wasn't prejudiced against robots, just simulacrums.

 

[Tom Schoene]

Originally posted by Arsulon:
Personally, I'd like to see a more organic approach to military grade cybernetics, something on the order of David Weber's Imperial Cadre or Marines from "Path of the Fury". No need to assume people STILL find cybernetic enhancements wierd 3000 years in the future (even taking into account Vilani conservatism).

Well, there is the persistent issue of why anything would be recognizable after 3000 years. But Once you get past that, I don't see why elective cybernetics would ever be commonplace. Chopping off perfectly good body parts runs right up against some very hard-coded instincts.