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Starports

atpollard

Super Moderator
Peer of the Realm
I was noticing that the Starport Design 101 section of T20 has been "closed for development" for 3.5 years.
Is it safe to say that the modular starport project is dead?

Is there any interest in resurrecting the project?
What about for inclusion in one of the online Traveller fanzines?

I'm just running an idea up the flag pole to see who salutes.


Arthur T Pollard

[EDIT Spell check complete]
 
Yeah, what the hell is the story with that?

And Living Traveller T20 is another project that appears to be sidelined.

Help us Obi-Hunter Kenobi. You're our only hope!
 
AT, Stofsk:

The project material lies in the hands of Mr Shane Mclean and myself, though to be truthful as possible, he has the majority of it collected in deadtree notes and e-mails.

Will we ever complte it?

His RL-RW schedule of family & day-job work has prevented that part time hobby called "writing for RPG's" to be set aside.

Have you tried PM messaging him?

I for one would like to see a better defined version than what we have now. And in light of legalities of which Traveller mechanic ( insert which of your choice here ), I'd propose again ( as we did back 3.5 years ago ) we do it "Systemless".

Helpfully yours,
 
I'm up for helping out on this. It looks like great fun. Is there any reason why the forum can't be re-opened? If Shane is too busy, then I reckon there would be many hands here available to help. If the existing material could be placed in a common pool we could all access, so much the better.

Ravs
 
I know I may come over as a spoilsport but with GT:Starports out and containing a Starport building chapter/rules, how important/valuabe/needed is that project?

If you say "very" than count me in to add my mustard to it. If you say "maybe conversion rules are enough" the same
 
I must admit a general unfamiliarity with GURPS products, so I have a few simple questions:

Does GURPS Starports include plans or is it a list of buildings/services available?

To what extent is it universal as opposed to GURPS specific? (if it existed, “Space 1889: Starports” would not be very “Traveller-like” in its feel – cool, but not Traveller like.)
 
To everyone who has expressed an interest in this:

I am a visual learner. While lists are all very well and good, a rough sketch is usually better than a detailed list. Would it be practical to approach this project with the goal of generating some crude sketches of typical starports? Just simple boxes with labels and brief descriptions.

As I see it, some people could work on compiling the data already gathered.

Other people could assemble simple functions into a rough starport plan. (type B highport: manufacturing here, commercial here, freight here, passengers here, shipyard here, etc.)

Still other people could create a simple plan detailing one of the starport functions (a typical bar, a typical freight terminal, etc).

Everyone would be welcome to work on whatever part they prefer. Each layer feeds the others.

Just offering ideas. Comments welcome (but please, don’t throw things).
 
Actually, what are YOUR visions for this project?
What do you see the coming out of this?

Go ahead, inspire me. I dare you. I double dare you. ;)
 
Hi, atpollard, I'm visual like you. A useful mission statement for the product for me would be:

A set of rules to generate a list of starport facilities and their relationships based on the UPP of the planet.

Working from that mission statement first we need a list of the facilities and the probability of those facilities appearing at a starport given its type and location.

Then we need to create a set of rules governing how those facilities ought to combine or work with each other so that someone creating a map of the starport will have sufficient parameters to produce a compliant starport (environmental factors of each planet will provide further design restrictions, but this is a good thing as hopefully this will mean that the starports do not look like clones of each other).

I'm a bit chary about a 'modular' starport idea where all the units are like porta-cabins which can be locked onto each other like bits of lego. My feeling is that this will make for very boring design. I would prefer to see parameters instead with graphics left up to the individual designing the starport to complete him/herself, taking into account factors relevant to that planet.

I'll need to give this more thought but those are my first impressions.

Ravs
 
Um...actually I've just looked at the what MB mentioned, the GURPS starport book excerpts and table of contents Here . It looks incredibly comprehensive and for what I had in mind, we'd be re-inventing the wheel. Like MB I'd still like to be involved, but perhaps we could put a different spin on it? Not sure what though.

Ravs

:Edit: And one of the Co-authors of the GURPS product is John M. Ford !
 
i made a cheesy "CT" type one for "Highports"
ONLY, you can get it on the link in my SIG..

it makes 3 "kinds" either commerical
navy or scout in nature...

i tried to incorporate planet populations
and ABCDEX types, and local trade type
into its "makeup", it also creates a sort
of ship ecounter either berthed, in orbit
or near orbit...

i also give a suggestion as to shape...
 
Actually it is

GURPS TRAVELLER: Starports

For me:

GT = GURPS TRAVELLER
CT = Classic TRAVELLER
TNE = TRAVELLER The New Era
MT = MegaTRAVELLER
HT = Hard Times
HG = High Guard

There are some differences between CT and GT that should be adressed and some spins that GT puts on the Imperial System that I do not like.

On the other hand the product (sometimes together with GT: Far Traders) delivers:

+ Detailed description of berthing fees and procedures

+ Cargo handling and cargo handling gear

+ Some sample starports and port construction rules (based on the GT variant of ship construction)


What IS definitly needed:

+ Translating the port generation modules to High Guard or T20

+ Translating gear and possibly adding some of our own

+ Replacing some of the Spins put on the Empire
 
Originally posted by ravs:
Um...actually I've just looked at the what MB mentioned, the GURPS starport book excerpts and table of contents Here . It looks incredibly comprehensive and for what I had in mind, we'd be re-inventing the wheel. Like MB I'd still like to be involved, but perhaps we could put a different spin on it? Not sure what though.

Ravs

:Edit: And one of the Co-authors of the GURPS product is John M. Ford !
Wow - looks like the product has a lot of good stuff. But I'm not too sure T20 should be tied to GURPS for material.

Any idea how much of the GURPS material is generic and how much involves GURPS specific rules?

EDIT: My slow typing catches up with me again. I see that my question was answered as I composed the post!
Steve B
 
I'm visual, too. Back in 1998 I figured the generic starport (not that there is such a thing) would have these bits:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> Fuel Control Landing Field
Depot Tower
| | starport maglev |
Maintenance--------------------------------------
| | |
| Warehouses Docks
| | |
Shipyard | Concourse
| |
------------------- Public Maglev</pre>[/QUOTE]My idea of landing facilities was inspired by the article "Happy Landings!"; the standard parkbay looks like this:

parkbays25.gif
 
Robject, I like it. Small but efficient.

If we already have the core for “Starport Design 101” in the form of “GURPS: Starports”, perhaps what we really need is “101 Starports: Systemless designs for all versions of Traveller”. Perhaps we really need to convert the existing data into useful plans.
 
Sounds like a very good concept for a supplement. Maybe a combination of:

</font>
  • 10-15 generic Starports
    </font>
    • </font>
    • One each per class</font>
    • With and without a highport</font>
  • Some generic port elements
    </font>
    • Some ships chandlers stores</font>
    • Some port establishments</font>
    • A number of patron encounters</font>
    </font>
 
Two points: For the visual, anyone remember the old Judges Guild (I think) "50 Starports" supplement? It had 50 supposed pictures of starports. Not great art, pretty cheap paper, but the idea was sound (and visual). It needed to be married to text in the worst way though.

To do generic, why don't you use BITS Skill System descriptions? They've got a conversion table between their generic traveller skill system and (I think) all particular skill systems for various versions of Traveller?

I'd also point out perhaps using Googlemaps or other reference to take a look at airports. That may give some ideas as to how a Starport should be laid out. Or find some pilots around here or on the TML who have any sort of clue about airport layout. There is a logic to the layout of these things and it might be good to steal what can be filched from the real world.

Having samples of each general port type (several of each) with Highports as appropos (I don't see the dreaded Starport X having a Highport... or even a Downport...) with some description of fees, typical delays getting through the traffic pattern (often related to starport size, but not necessariliy - perhaps a random chart?), surcharges, and all that sort of stuff plus any inward clearance issues... you have to figure to some extent the degree of cost and effort involved in clearing a starport inbound or outbound is related to the size (importance) of the port.

Perhaps also examples of ports at differing TL... not all ports will be a uniform TL, will they? So examples of differing ports at differing TL may be useful. Of course, I'd expect your A and B ports to have bigger entries.

Just some random thoughts...
 
Some tasks I wrote for MT for clearing port, fueling, etc:

To Link With The Local Traffic Control Grid, Easy, Commo, Int, 15 seconds. A catastrophic result may lead to collision. This task becomes Routine in Type A Starports due to the volume of traffic.

To Undock From A High Port, Routine, Pilot, Dex, (time increment varies with starport and pop levels). Base time increment is 2 minutes, add 2 for Type A Starport, subtract one for Type C, Add (POP UWP DIGIT-7) (possibly zero, but not negative) to the result to get the final time increment (e.g. - Pop 9 StPrt A means base 2 plus 2 plus 2 more for a basic increment of 6 minutes). This task is not terribly taxing on the drives and so does not suffer the annual maintenance penalties.

To Fuel From A Star Port, Simple, Engineer or Mech, Edu, (time by tankage). Refueling time will depend on tank size and flow rate. Typical high volume pumps can deliver 40 to 60 kiloliters per minute. Special Heavy Duty High Volume Pumps (military use mostly) can deliver up to 200 kiloliters per minute.

To Dock With A High Port, Routine, Pilot, Dex, (time increment varies with starport and pop levels). Base time increment is 3 minutes, add 2 for Type A Starport, subtract one for Type C, Add (POP UWP DIGIT-7) (possibly zero, but not negative) to the result to get the final time increment (e.g. - Pop 9 StPrt A means base 3 plus 2 plus 2 more for a basic increment of 7 minutes). This task is not terribly taxing on the drives and so does not suffer the annual maintenance penalties.

Note that the undocking time and docking time really just reflects issues such as how long you are kept in the local grid and how slow they make you approach, likely longer and slower with bigger ports. This assumes you don't make a "Hasty" attempt or request some sort of expidited clearance.

This will just give an idea how Starport Type might play a role in gameplay and those sorts of notes might be itneresting to include.
 
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