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Sing to me of GURPS Space

I never got into GURPS, simply for lack of opportunity. But 4th edition, while pricey, is supposedly solid, and having looked at its table of contents Space seems to be a nigh-rules-free source book. Two questions:

How good is GURPS Space as a standalone resource for Traveller?

Which 4E books would one need to play a non-Traveller GURPS scifi game? The two rulebooks, Space, Spaceships, and Ultratech, right? That's a lot of cash and a lot of pages to read.

Is it worth the investment? Have people had experiences with it?
 
and we all know what opinions are compared too.....:rofl:

seriously though, gurps 4e is just like every game system out there- it has some good points and some bad points. it is an easy to use game system but i find some of the concepts and rules to be at best wildly inaccurate- for instance the dm's for range start at 1 meter. i will hit anything within 1 meter of my body without much effort, damn near regardless of its or my motion, so to be penalized in a game for something so damn easy to do irks me.... i would have to actually pull out a copy to find the others issues i have with it..
have a day
 
for instance the dm's for range start at 1 meter. i will hit anything within 1 meter of my body without much effort, damn near regardless of its or my motion, so to be penalized in a game for something so damn easy to do irks me.... i would have to actually pull out a copy to find the others issues i have with it..

The dms for speed/range start at *3* meters, not 1.

And the accuracy for most firearms starts at +2, so you're out to 7 meters before you have an actual penalty for a handgun, longer for a rifle.
 
what you need (in order)

1) Characters
2) the e23 4e character program
3) Campaigns

The above plus CT books 1-3 is plenty for me. Everything else is just detail.

Remember that GURPS Interstellar Worlds did not come with any equipment lists. Presumably you can run 'Firefly' just with the Basic Set list.

If you want more stuff and gadgets, there's High Tech and Ultra Tech.

If you want advanced char gen stuff for maybe some weirdo alien types, get Powers (the so-called "third core book')

If you want more combat options, get Martial Arts. (Pretty nifty.)

The new GURPS Spaceships series is well engineered and a clean design.
 
I never bought 4e Space, but GURPS Space 3e is one of the better books I own.

Asking on the GURPS bbs Space was their most popular book (in the past) hands down, winning awards for them.

To get into GURPS 4e, you'll need a slew of books (as mentioned above).

Since I have several GURPS Traveller 3e books, I'm sticking to those.


>
 
Assuming your question was about GURPS Space, rather than GURPS 4e:

I like GURPS Space. It enumerates all of the variables involved in creating a Space campaign -- what your choices are. It's a toolkit or a resource for building a setting from scratch.

I think that's what GURPS Space is. It's been awhile.
 
3e Space looks a lot different than 4e Space.

3e had equipment and ship construction. 4e doesn't.

4e has a new iteration of the Uplift type Alien generation rules.

4e has the next iteration of First In type world gen... though it looks like they broke it down between Basic and Advanced.

If 4e Space follows suit with 4e Fantasy, it will have more extensive coverage of the varieties of genres within the Space umbrella. (The TOC confirms this. If you want to toy with other concepts of FTL travel, you'll get a whole chapter to help you comprehend the consequences of your premise.)

Not much new compared to a stack of 3e books, but probably a needed refinment. For someone new to GURPS, the 4e books are broken down logically so that you don't keep buying the same rules over and over. If you have 3e stuff, then you've already paid for some of it.... :)
 
Quote mmbutter:
"[FONT=arial,helvetica]The dms for speed/range start at *3* meters, not 1."

you are correct- for some reason i recalled that table starting at 1 m....

i'll shut me mouth then, but i still find gurps to be merely ok as a game system.

[/FONT]
 
been playing GURPS since it first was a glimmer of a system, for a fantasy setting, Conan I believe, could be wrong, been a very long time. Been a player and gm through 4 editions and revisions so far. Still a great and flexible system.

Gurps space and the Gurps traveller materials are the bee's knee's. Can't beat it for the range of topices and thought put into it.

Like to say more, gotta jet to the bank, maybe later.
 
GURPS was generic from the get-go.
Even before it was released, the default fantasy setting was pseudo european (look at the weapons in Man to Man, which was released before GURPS by almost a year).

The 1st Ed GURPS Fantasy was Yrth and Magic rolled into one.
The 1st ed settings I remember were Horseclans and Fantasy. And I remember everyone I knew was ticked that cat telepathy was way mangled by the GURPS engine.

So if you were doing conan, it was homebew or later... because at the time GURPS came out, TSR had the license.
 
A couple of months ago I got hold of the GURPS 4E quickstart rules. This was the first time I actually read GURPS rules--I'm a real babe in the woods. I noticed that DEX and IQ (?) seemed to outweigh all other stats in importance by a wide margin. I mentioned this on a general board and got lambasted for it. Either I was called dead wrong, or I was told it's a known issue, nothing a good GM can't fix cetera cetera, and was I a troll?

What are your thoughts on this? Again, I'm really ignorant about GURPS. Intuitively, the centrality of DEX/IQ felt like a legacy issue to me. Like nonlinear saves/XP progression in D&D etc.
 
Keep in mind: I started with 1st ed, and 3rd is when I outgrew the GURPS wagon...

(In short, I'm no longer a fan of it...)

In 1st-3rdRev, ST is your carrying capacity, Stamina, and spell-points, and determines base damage with melee weapons, and HT is your hitpoints and Resistance rolls.

For wizards, HT can be a throwaway.
For non-combatants, HT is best bought split (Reduce hit points to increase health roll; it's allowed in 3, severely optional prior). Split ST (Fatigue vs Damage/carry) is easily abused for wizards....

But given the mostly-pre-modern settings it's fine; it really only breaks for modern and sci-fi, and only badly for mecha-jocks and Armor-Arses... who can afford to be St 8f/12c Dx14 IQ 12 HT 12r/8hp... or worse.

Functionally, it's really not well balanced for moderns nor sci-fi, but it does work, if one keeps in mind that the stat ballance is based upon fantasy and historical medieval norms.

3R had an option for switching Fatigue to HT and HitPoints to ST, and IIRC, 4 makes that the default... but still, it's best fit is pre-moderns.
 
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GURPS Space 4E is the only GURPS product I own.

I LOVE it. I have used the World Generation stuff in both of my Traveller settings. I think this part of the book is what LBB6 should have been. Scientifically accurate and reasonable on it's predictions of the unknowns in space.

It is broken down into 2 sections: Basic and Advanced, as mentioned above. Basic gives you a bit more detail than a UWP would, but comes at it a different way. Advanced is REALLY detailed, but can be determined as needed, so you don't have to spend all the time on every world.

Using their tables you tend to get a lot of systems with only a few planets in very elliptic orbits, which reduces the chance for a habitable planet, so from that point of view, it is quite different than Traveller, but might actually be more realistic.

If you really want a hard science background to your Traveller world gen, then GURPS Space 4E might be exactly what you are looking for.

There is also a lot of good stuff on how to run a space campaign and a big section on creating alien races. I don't need those sections too much personally, but the alien race creator section seems interesting and will certainly give you varied aliens.
 
Thanks, that was exactly the impression I got from the table of contents. I should get this thing. It seems to do for scifi what Fantasy Hero does for fantasy.

Of course, now that I want it I notice it's out of print. WTF? Wasn't it released only a year or two ago?
 
Well, we do play our current Traveller campaign using a modified version of GURPS 3rd edition with some ideas taken from the 4th. I like the quick rules and we have kept the number crunching to a minimum with our modifications - as the GURPS system allows to either keep it simple or make it complex, just as the GM and his group wants it. It may have it's disadvantages but in general I think it is one of the systems I favour most as it does not tend to get in the way of our playing style. I do not like about 4th edition that everything has gotten more expensive CharacterPoint-wise without offering too much compensation - but that is just my opinion and depends on the style of play You are using as the old 3rd edition admittedly allowed more generalists that were better at what they are doing than the characters created with 4th ed. rules.

For starters with GURPS I advise getting the Basic 4th ed. rulebook and GURPS: Interstellar Wars which nicely covers about everything You need to know about the Traveller background of the First Contact of us Earthlings with the Vilani Empire and the ensuing war. If You want to save some money get the 3rd edition rulebook(s) and GURPS Traveller (2nd ed): getting these books either as PDF or used should be rather affordeable and I actually prefer using 3rd edition rules. It is easy to adapt 3rd to 4th edition anyways.

@Rhialto: yes, most skills depend on either DEXterity or INTelligence, with a few exceptions based on STRength and HEAlth. With only four primary attributes that is nothing unusual IMHO: 4th ed. made the two primary attributes (DEX/INT) more expensive and few normal characters are able to raise these stats beyond the value of 13 without having to make compromises. Going below 10 in STR or HEA also lowers Your characters survivability as You have less hitpoints (which go on STR in the 4th edition, not on HEA anymore), less hand-to-hand damage and ability to use weapons with recoil or that require a minimum STR and less movement (total of HEAlth+DEXterity divided by four, rounded down). Movement also governs Your Dodge roll so You would not want to go down too far - and the mage needs the Fatigue points HEAlth provides for casting his spells, too. So both STR and HEA still have their importance - mayhaps less than before but this is covered by the different costs of the attributes.

Concerning books You "need" for a NON-Traveller SciFi campaign that uses GURPS Space 4th ed.:

Basic Rules and Space

Ultratech if You need more details about the technology for a campaign setting and You do not want to work that stuff out Yourself.
Hightech if You exspect campaigns to be around OUR current techlevel.
Spaceships if You want a really, really, really complex design system for starships.
Biotech if You want biomodifications to be part of Your campaign universe, perhaps Changing Times (the background for the Transhuman Space setting) might be the better idea.

GURPS Space as a standalone ressource for Traveller: hmmno, not really. Traveller is different and Space tries to cover every SciFi genre. You can use it but You do not have to.

If You want to be cost effective You can go for the 3rd edition stuff and use the update rules.
 
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Thanks, man.

Now, all I need is to actually find a group to *play* GURPS with...

I'd say chances for that are just a little less slim than for Traveller.

Why can't I just get with the program and play 4E? D&D, I mean.
 
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