Robots

[Prometheus]

Does anybody else think that Droids/Robots get the short end of the stick in CT Book 8? And On top of that, would it be reasonable to conclude that Bots should be more of a pressence in Traveller?

An example: the Amiee Bot from the Mars movie with Cary-Anne Moss ( nice in the tank top meow") and Val Kilmer. That would be a great Robot to have but the Robot would be tech 16-17? Any Opinions out there?

 

[trader jim]

yes - i agree - the LBB just didnt cut it, either did the other suppliment 101 robots, i sold 101 robots on ebay and dont regret it at all!! i dont know why folks cant get it right (my opinion).
robots should look like TERMINATOR or whats his name in Aliens - was it a mrk 4 they were always kind of "twitchy".....t20, i hope does better!!!

 

[Vargas]

I think there should be more robots in Traveller than generally portrayed, but I've increasingly been thinking about Carrie-Anne. . .whoops, sorry

. . . the robots from the 70's movie 'Silent Running' as a kind of model for Traveller 'bots.

Unfortunately, my opinion, CT Book 8 was just another clunky DGP design system that made it a pain to design anything cool.

Hmmm, I think I need to give this more thought.

 

[Prometheus]

Maybe a Carrie-Anne Moss Robot .. er .. I mean that the tech tree in robots was 70ish ... I believe the Terminator robot was def. tech 14-16 for it synaptic functionality .. but R2D2 (wash my mouth out) is a Tech 12, and the lame companion of his is TL12-13...

Also the idea of Replicants ... Like n blade runner.... I hear now they are designing Bio-chips made out of organic matter....

More opinions or fresh fruit...rotten produce....

 

[lisagb]

Dont mean to be advertising a rivals products but...
the Transhuman space series of books for Gurps is great for replicant type stuff.

 

[Uncle Bob]

Hmm, "Westworld" and Priss...

 

[FlightCommanderSolitude]

I thought Bk 8 blew chunks.

I think the various reasons have already been discussed. I also must admit to cringing at the robots in OTU adventures, ie the tin can on wheels with the glass dome for a head and the metal tentacle arms.

As for the general question of robots in Traveller, it's always an interesting issue.

[Side question: I never got into TNE that much, but was there a situation with Virus and robots? Or did they just sidestep that entirely?]

IMTU, robots are essentially extensions of today's manufacturing drones, only smarter and a little more autonomous. Eg, automated cargolifters that scoot up to your dirtside trader like a bunch of ants and whisk your cargo away.

It also seems that human capital is cheaper than robotic technology in the Traveller universe, and so there's an argument that robots and replicants of the Terminator/Blade Runner variety would be prohibitively expensive to develop/acquire/maintain. There are of course counterarguments to this (which I'd love to hear) and special situations, but personally I'd rather just sweep the whole mess under this rug and avoid robots IMTU unless there's some very cool scenario that requires them.

Essentially, robots are widgets IMTU. I'm personally less interested in cyborgs, androids and battlebots (and the attendant ironmongery) than in actual characters.

 

[Prometheus]

I guess it was my intention to bring forth the debate of why robots were really developed as a concept in CT (I being a purely CT player and "slightly" curious about T20 I will probbably buy it). I feel the need for them to really come forth in the adventures and the ability to make it more of the adventure in the Far Future But solitude raises an interesting point. I counter with the blade runner scenerio for traveller outlawed or banned .. they could still be made...

 

[Prometheus]

To further my irritation with Book 8 I feel that the tech tree for the robots is not instep with my concept of how tech could advance.. synaptic funtion I believe could begin as far as TL:12...
nasty comments anybody?

 

[T. Foster]

From a metagaming standpoint I think robots were never really emphasized in Traveller for the same reason there are no supercomputers or (currently active) super-aliens: to maintain the human-dominated universe where the actions of individual people (specifically PCs) are what make the differences. If you can build super-competent robots for reasonable prices then you're going to send them out to do all the dangerous stuff while you stay safe at home -- which defeats the purpose of the game (unless of course the PCs ARE the robots -- but then it's becoming some other game, no longer really 'Traveller').

A couple of pertinent quotes from 'The Foundations of Traveller Universe' by Marc Miller:

A Cosmopolitan Universe. Traveller accepts diversity and allows a wide variety of beings to interact for their mutual benefit. Such a universe is richer than a purely human environment.

A Human Dominated Universe. Although the universe is cosmopolitan, it is human dominated in order to retain an element of familiarity for the players.

Robots. Although robots are possible and present, they are not an overwhelming influence.

 

[Prometheus]

Granted you want the human dominating element to be maintained. But wouldn't it seem more futuristic to have robots present in more of a capacity. One could argue as tech advanced the development of the Six races would as well.. genetic selection and engineering..etc...the mentats of dune? Also I could see robots and cyborg/replecants be usedas interesting NPCs ..i mean who wants to run around worrying about the supply of WD 40 on the planet.

 

[N.I.C.E. Labs]

Yeah...at least in my Traveller universe it seems that the "do it yourself" line of thought holds true. Bots are useful for industry, but Travelling we never got into it. Of course when you're shy on crewmembers or moving heavy cargoes they're certainly useful and not unheard of, but for the most part we didn't use 'em in our campaigns. Even the Merchant cpt the players worked for, who had a robot steward was considered eccentric for it. Granted it was a rebuilt Zhodoni warbot and he named him 'Mongo', but still.....

 

[FlightCommanderSolitude]

Originally posted by Spaceman Spiff:
I guess it was my intention to bring forth the debate of why robots were really developed as a concept in CT....

Well...they kinda weren't. Bk 8 was a pretty feeble attempt at "development of a concept". I wonder why they went with robots, instead of continuing the logical progression of the later core booklets and coming out with a volume about the Other career. [Although, I guess Supp 4 Citizens of the Imperium dealt with that a little bit with the Pirate, Hunter, etc careers.]

It might be a great question for "Ask Avery", eg: "What was the deal with Bk 8?"

 

[FlightCommanderSolitude]

I should add that I think robots are totally cool in the real world. And, of course, you should fully exploit the idea of robots in your Traveller universe, as you see fit. Goodness knows there's plenty of room for improvement, and there are a lot of potential adventure scenarios and situations that can be derived from robots. I'm merely trying to point out (as Mr Foster did, more clearly) that the Traveller Universe is, in its conception, not really interested in robots.

 

[doomhunk]

Yep, Book 8 had a 70's tech tree and a 50's conceptualisation of robots.

But really, there could be billions of replicant robots out there in the OTU and how would we know? Ok, they'd be discovered when they went through security gates etc if they had enough metal in 'em....

One of the things I always liked about Traveller was that it did not follow the self-fulfilling-prophecy science fiction style of cyberpunk. So just because it looks to us now like robots are likely to be common, a few thousands years from now that may not be true for reason x, and its up to you to decide what reason x is. I can't think of a good analogue right now, but the continued use of fossil fuels to drive our cars etc when we have had patented electric and natural/hydrogen technologies for decades, springs to mind. Economics rule in place of what would seem to be logical. Spock out.

 

[justacaveman]

IMTU robots are prevalent, and useful servitors. They are receptionists, valets, cleaners, cargo handlers, security devices, manufacturing devices etc.. They are everywhere, but aren't paid any more attention than pocket computers, and grav cars. While robots are useful, they are limited to what they're programmed to do. Robots are more function specific than characters, and don't perform well outside of their design specs. Character races are more generalized and able to adapt to unusual situations. A security robot isn't going to be able to cook, clean, or load cargo with any degree competence. There are more general purpose robots able to do a variety of tasks, but they are very expensive, and it's usually cheaper to have some PC race do the job.

IMTU it is possible for a PC/NPC to be a robot (ala Data, or Short Circuit etc..), but these tend to be unduplicatible unique robots or major programming flukes. This can provide opportunities for adventure hooks etc. as uknown organizations try to capture the robot for study or other unpleasant possibilities.

Don't the the Zhodani use warbots? I remember something about that in the OTU.

 

[T. Foster]

Originally posted by FlightCommanderSolitude:
It might be a great question for "Ask Avery", eg: "What was the deal with Bk 8?"

I'm not Avery but I suspect the answer lies in the facts that 1) DGP had already done the work, and most of what became Book 8 had already been published in issues 1-3 of their (at the time) little-known fanzine The Travellers' Digest, and 2) at the time (c. 1986) the creative and editorial staff at GDW were otherwise occupied launching T2K and T:2300 and Traveller had been put on the far-back burner. Thus, the opportunity for GDW to publish a substantial new Traveller product without having to actually do the work of writing and developing it probably just seemed too good a deal to pass up, far outweighing the fact that it didn't really fit the thematic progression of the earlier Books (or, alas, the fact that it wasn't very good...).

 

[Prometheus]

thanks for all the dialog... I have to go away for a while... hopefully when I return ... maybe there will be some designs posted ( hint..hint)

take care

spiff

 

[vegascat]

How many warbots could you pack into a single 400 Ton Subsidised Merchant for a planetary invasion? when compaired to live troops, a huge amount.

 

[trader jim]

DANGER.....Trader jim.....DANGER.....Trader Jim.....DANGER!!!!!.....