Need advice on the future of my CT game... TNE?

[korg]

Hi, ive got a problem that I need your wise advice on.

*** Classic Traveller Adventure Spoilers Ahead!!! ***
*** Traveller TNE Adventure Spoilers Ahead!!! ***

[edit: Please dont post TNE _VRS_ CT stuff here. I didnt realise there was 'vrs' stuff, im _not_ looking for one or the other, but more opinions on what the future of my CT universe should be. No flames of either, please. ]

Background
----------

Im running a single player CT game, trying to link all the cool
stories into one big meta adventure. The outline of them is here:
http://darkqueen.org/docs/rpg/traveller/gm/storyline.html
(although that is a little behind in being updated).


The story so far is that our little hero has found a golden coin in
the 'shadows' LBB adventure and it sank into her skin (the rest of the
crew blame oxygen deprevation due to a hydrogen pocket and cheap vacc
suit seals, but Im thinking Ancient Nano tech).

Now, she worked out it was the droyne symbol for 'flame' and has decided
to go visit a professor at the university of Rhylanor who will take her
to meet some droyne (after all she just saved some chirpers from the
start of my rewrite of Research Station Gamma)...

Now the Droyne are going to recognise her as a droyne not a human
(thanks to the coyne) and do a casting to work out her caste (leader)
and probably offer to do a future telling (potentally with drugs and
psi powers in some weird visionquest type thing) and I was thinking
of what the future would hold.

My current plan is to run all the cool CT LBB/Journal adventures that
I have and this means:

* dealing with the Zho in the 5FW

* getting on the trail of the Ancients in Twilights Peak and Secret
of the Granddaddys

* ending up being helped by Grandfather to come back and help ease
the Empress wave (which in my game is going to be forcing Zhodani
infront of it).

Now this is _way_ in the future... I havnt even started the 5FW yet,
so all this is _WAY_ off. But I guess with the casting happening soon,
I need to think about it.

Previously I havnt liked the Megatraveller shatter the Imperium and
the TNE kill everything and start again, but recently Ive been
thinking that after all the CT traveller adventures are over (and the
character is suitably rich, noble and jammed with Ancient tech

,
that this would be a good chance to _metagame_ and have her involved
with the Shattered Imperium and setting up of the Regency and dealing
with the Zho/Empress wave.

So, I was thinking that the 'vision quest' for this poor victim, err,
player could get the following:

* see herself at Norris' "Keep the Flame" address.

* notice that she is different/cyberteched up/other
worldly/modified somehow

* realising she is involved in this 'Regency' (whatever that is

(and a great sense that something _really bad_ happened).

I figure that the game arc would be something like:

* CT adventures and 5FW

* Working out the Secret of the Ancients (bickering with kids seems
very immature for an Ancient, so maybe that will need to be
changed too)

* Being 'Ancient Tech'ed up by grandfather and sent back to help
sort out the Empress Wave chaos

From that point on, individual adventuring is over and the game moves
into 'meta game' mode where, as an 'Ancient' power or rich Imperial
Noble (with some grandfatherly advice) she becomes involved with:

* helping hold things together in the Shattered Imperium

* fighting the Virus, forming the Regency.

* helping the Zho/Imperials/Regency co-exist over the Empress Wave


Need advice
-----------

My trouble is that I know only a very little about the TNE setting (as
I said having previously not liked the idea) and so I want to know if
people think this could 'work' as a meta arc for traveller, or if Im
better to ditch that and go with the GURPS 'everything is fine' line.

I did read some online writeup of the TNE universe that had the K'Kree
turning the Capital into a genocidal death camp and some massive fight
between an insane Lucan AI ship (somehow?) and the K'kree, but Ive
been unable to find that again.

Im not sure if I want my game as black and gloomy as to turn the
turn the Capital into a concentration camp, but then I
guess billions of people are going to die form the virus alone, so
I shouldnt be squeemish about K'Kree invasions too.

I dont know, it just seems a little bleak to set a game _IN_ the fall
of the imperium.

Does TNE cover this? I know its ment to be set after things start
again, but I read somewhere someone posted that it delt with good
plots and emotional material and Im hoping that means 'mature' and
adult.

I guess, having ignored it previously, Im looking for opinions on the
TNE setting and how well it would sync with this story outline.

Has anyone run something like this? Is rocking up to your ex-Imperial
corrosive atmosphere billion pop planet and finding it _dead_ too
depressing? :-/

(I think reading the 'What would you ask Dave' thread helped reform my
ideas.)

[Edit: Im a recent 'convert' to this idea, so I really have _no_ idea about the TNE setting, so Im looking for advice or some background to measure if I can use TNE or if I should make up my own or stick with a gurp'sy future.]

 

[Elliot]

The later stuff about Kkree death ships etc is the background (note: background) to the forthcoming TNE 1248 setting - if you pay a few dollars you can read about it (i.e. get the pdf of the whole thing in playtest format) on the 1248 playtest board.

 

[mike wightman]

Wow, that's a pretty ambitious campaign plan you've got mapped out - I like it.

If you're based in the Spinward Marches then the whole Rebellion thing happens off stage - unless you can get the characters invoved in Arrival Vengeance - the voyage of an AHL class cruiser sent by Norris to contact the other fraction leaders.

With a bit of artistic licence this could give the Domain of Deneb the warning it needs to do something about virus.

When the dust settles you can then think about adventures during the TNE setting during which the Regency heads out into the wilds, and then bring it all the way up to 1248 and the new setting.

 

[jfetters]

My peice of advice would be to get (in addition to Arrival: Vengeance), Survival Margin and, especially if you are staying in the Regency, the Regency Sourcebook, if you haven't already.

It has enough meta information that fills in the big gaps between 1130 and 1202, but not so much that you can't add your own flavor.

But I do really like your idea - the nice thing about Traveller and all the previously published material is that it truly allows you to create a rich and almost epic campaign if you want to. Especially since game time when travelling through space just zips by, it is nice to be able to start in 1100 and then do whatever you want while "staying in the lines" of the OTU.

Overall, I agree with you - I like my sci-fi more high tech and fun rather than post-apocalyptic, but I really do love the TNE RCES setting as well. I am thinking about planning something for a recontact adventure or something between the Regency and the Wilds. That gives the best of both worlds - the cool high tech Regency environment vs. the bootstrapping Wilds.

 

[korg]

Excellent! I have no TNE idea at all, so this advice on which things to look at is _excellent_! Ta, Ill look into it all!

Wow, traveller has such rockingly wonderful fans (and still, after all this time too!)

I was thinking of trying to get involvement in the whole shattered imperium or virus thing and maybe even to avoid it being so horribly bad (players tend to think of amazingly brilliant solutions to problems sometimes, so I shouldnt rule that out

) so thanks for putting a name to books and stuff I should look at!

 

[jfetters]

No problem - That is the nice thing about the Marches area. It has always been a "reserve" for the original universe.

In MT, I think there are some Vargr and Aslan incursions, but that doesn't wipe the slate like Virus. But in TNE, the Regency is behind a huge wall, so it is more or less the same old Marches, which is great.

If you haven't already, check out http://www.drivethrurpg.com for PDFs of those books.

 

[Spinward Scout]

I think you should go with the GURPS timeline and incorporate ideas from MT and TNE. Say, the Imperium doesn't Shatter, but maybe a Domain destablizes in the same manner after an assassination of an Archduke (it would be so ironic to use Dulinor this way). You could do the same things, just keep it at a Domain level instead of Imperium-wide. Set forth the Virus in Illesh or Antares and quarantine the whole Domain while the rest of the Imperium holds it's breath waiting for an outbreak.

Anyways, that's how I'd do it,

Dameon

 

[korg]

I like the idea of an AI. I have a synthetic robot in the game (who is partially AI, or atleast enough to make my player freak out).

Im not sure about wiping out the Impie family, as I was going to steal the gurps timeline and put it in the game (the princess getting hooked up and stuff) and I think that humanises the character too much to be wiped out at a distance. (Yes, I realise bad stuff happens that players cant fix

but its a game).

Im forming the core of some very interesting interaction with the zhodani. So Im thinking the Empress wave driving a migration of Zho towards the spinward marches is an evil and excellent idea.

So I guess Im thinking that some Black Curtain (great name) is a good idea and that requires some form of MT (although it could be released some other way).

The more I write here, the more Im thinking I should head through the assassination idea. The news/info about the Grand Princess' life just makes it a more tragic and agnsty thing.

[Am I going mad, or did I read something about a child involving Norris and the Emperor.. or am I thinking of Norris' daughter visiting the 'Real Steffie'?)

Arrg, brain not grep'able.... damn it.

 

[jfetters]

[Am I going mad, or did I read something about a child involving Norris and the Emperor.. or am I thinking of Norris' daughter visiting the 'Real Steffie'?)

Arrg, brain not grep'able.... damn it.

Both. Kinda. It's all in the books mentioned earlier.

So I guess Im thinking that some Black Curtain (great name) is a good idea and that requires some form of MT (although it could be released some other way).

Which is one of the core reasons I like the TNE setting. The premise of the intrepid high-tech explorers of the Regency crossing the rift and finding a wasteland with a living hell at its center is just too cool.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

It is going to be tough to stretch a campaign for a single character over 120 years, though (5FW to 1248). Have you given thought to how you will do that?

 

[mike wightman]

Anagathics, cold berth, fast drug, Ancients device - psionics, electronic memory transfer, brain transplant, rejuvination...

 

[Chuck Anumia]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
Anagathics, cold berth, fast drug, Ancients device - psionics, electronic memory transfer, brain transplant, rejuvination...

Nano-Tech Implants?

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Well, aging can be dealt with, but what about plot? Does the character disappear for a while into lo-berth, only to re-emerge a few decades down the timeline?

 

[korg]

Ive been running this for about a year and im +200-300 days ingame, some skipping will be required if im not going to be 200 years old when I get to this stuff....

Seriously though, this is my story arc 'idea' currently (both pre and post where I am now).

Character comes from Louzy (approx earth like up near Efate) so I 'over ruled' the universe and said that it had been red zone/prime directive and had only just been contacted by the Imperium. (Thus player needs no traveller knowledge and gets to 'discover' everything.)

This has led to some interesting ideas on just what will happen once the system fully joins the imperium (and becomes an economic pawn of Efate). There is lots of politics (with a noble from Feri who is trying to make sure that Louzy doesnt become a pawn of Efate) and details on the trade situation.

[I havnt got off my ass and written a 'trade' simulator yet, but im going to have to to work out the volumes and trade routes. The noble from Feri is trying to set up an xboat route via Feri down to Rhylanor avoiding Regina to cut off some weeks.]

Anyway, once I run all the CT adventures, that will leave me with a player who has made contact with the Ancients and done a lot of travelling etc and foiled the zho at twilights peak (thus Im assuming becomes a player in Imperial politics thanks to Imperial recognition for that, if she doesnt manage to get herseld en-nobled some other way).

Ok, keep in mind that Im only about 1/3-1/2 of the way into my story arc, so this may all totally change... and some of these may work out differently.

To the end of the CT story arc
------------------------------

Player has 'foiled' the Zho base in Twi Peak (one assumes becoming an Imperial hero). She already helped stop the Chamax Plague on Louzy, so thats another few billion people saved. That has to get you Imperial recognition somehow.

We have Ancients say, 'Oh, bad stuff is going to happen and some of it is our fault' (Empress Wave) then Im assuming my player will go 'oh crap' and wants to help/make it better.

A low tech planet with no previous imperial contact (thus no psi-hate) that happens to be on the zhodani border is in a good position to broker some peace/agreement between the Zho and Impies. (Fallout from the 5FW and Zho immigration fleeing the empress wave.)

If any of those come off, then Im left with a player who is going to be 'important' in the Imperial politics of the Spinward Marches, so lets assume that.

MT time line
------------
Assuming:
* important player (well duh

, aint they all)
* indepentant Louzy being a buffer between the Zho and Imperials.
* possible nano-tech? (not player controlled, but more a GM magic tool to allow more 'meta' game stuff).
* the player stops 'travelling/adventuring' and settles down to work on louzy.

Im assuming that many parts of the stuff below will involved 'skipped time' in the form of 'We build the starport, +3 years'. Or something. Much of this stuff will just skip months or years.

'Raising' Louzy to be a major player. (Its got big population, but crap tech and starport). The character is an Engineer, so there will be some involement in this (and I love John M Ford's work and I cant wait to get involved in setting up a starport)

. Assuming there is a little runoff from the ancient tech, then that ups Louzy's tech, the startport and its already got the population. Add in trade with Imps and Zhos and its suddenly important.

Politics with Efate (Louzy growing will raise Jewel and may start to eclipse Efate). Start playing imperial politics, moooahahahaha.

Buffering between the fleeing Zhos and the Impies after 5FW. Bad blood. Waves of colonists. Trade. Security. Bickering. Its got it all.

Once Louzy is stabilised and important and plugged into the Spinward Marches political situation, then its time to look at the MT story line.

There will need to be some better transport, so Im considering leaving the ship in Secrets of the A's ship with the player. (Maybe, im unsure, it could be too powerful, although trying to keep other empires hands off it could lead to some interesting adventures).

So if we then add the MT assassination and chaos, then suddenly the player needs to 'warp' into dealing with what this is going to do. First is make sure the zho dont come charging in.

Im not sure how much the player should be involved in this. To really be involved, you'd need to have advanced warning (which is 'magically' possible thanks to the ancients) and some way to get there 'in time'. But that would possibly stop it, so some of it needs to happen.

If Im going to use the Rebellion and virus, I need some civil war in the Imp, so it cant be stoppable. Hmmm. Still thinking about this. Forgive the stream of conciousness here.

Maybe arrive too late to stop it, but spend some time zipping round trying to stop the shattering (which, even with a jump36 ship would be impossible as you cant be everywhere at once). (And even if you did, Im not sure that people would listen.)

So by the end of this, Im assuming that civil war is kind of 100% to happen.


Post MT
-------
Civil war is breaking out. Maybe the player can hold a few factions together and try and make it less destructive, but still you have maniacs running round battling for power.

Virus starts to break out. Have to run back to the Spinward Marches to set up some kind of defence. (The fast ship would make this too easy, unless its on the far far far side of the imperium and has to travel across the virus center of the Imperium to get back?) (So maybe the ship has to be ditched at this point? Its too far ahead to be able to guess how its going to turn out

.)

Head back, set up the Regency defences against the virus.

Dunno what will happen here, I havnt had a chance to read up on the regency stuff, but Im assuming a mix of trying to set up defences and trying to go out and rescue as much as possible or hold it off.

Anyway, by the end of this Im assuming there is some kind of Regency, some kind of zhodani peace and some kind of louzy pocket (independant or linked with zho or imp or maybe they all band together against the AI's and k'kree or something).

Id hope that there wouldnt be such a huge time from the Virus to the 'TNE'esque recovery. Hopefully the player driven growth of the Spinward Marches (via Ancient tech, peace or reduction of the impact of the whole thing by personal action).
With the correct 'building' I think the Regency would be on a better footing to expand back and retake the Imperium quicker than +200 years.

Phew.... anyway, I hope that helps. Yes Im fully aware that this all all bogus space opera

and not hard scifi.

Character aging
---------------
Well there is the nanotech infection (the GM's cheat for keeping the player around), anagathics (she should be rich enough at the end of being involved in building the starport and setting up trade routes).

I was also considering running a GURPS transhuman-eqsue timeline for Louzy (assuming that the ancient nano-tech allows them the ability to do some bio-manipulation at the genetic level) (Ie, they cant run the ancient tech, but they can use it for examination of cell structures and some low volume tinkering). If this is the case then Louzy's biotech revolution could easily expand the characters lifespan sufficently. But this requires the ancient tech, so who dont I just use it directly... duh. Silly me.


Are you insane?
---------------
Yes totally. I know the game will probably never get this far, but having to think about the future started me on this whole 'what will happen' thought process.

I really dont expect to get this far, but given im going the bogus droyne future telling route, I may as well go the whole space opera 'magic' route.

 

[jonathonbarton]

One advantage of running the MTU after the whole shebang has been written, printed, and obsoleted is that you can decide which parts of the storyline are dumb, and just dump them.

Personally, I kinda like the whole "Power grab at the top inspires a power grab all the way down the chain of command" feeling, but (in the MT materials I've read) haven't been to impressed with how it was handled, necessarily.

Perhaps IYMTU might be *all* the Imperials shooting each other up in a quick bloodbath, kangaroo court, executions loop. Then the Dukes and Archdukes follow Norris' unintentional "lead" and go through a quick grab for power (more assassinations and intrigue, but not open war), followed by "brushfire wars" over disputed worlds (which will tend to *NOT* devastate the worlds in general, because it's a fight for ownership, and nobody really wants to own a giant radioactive slag-heap.)

So, in this MTU, Core/Capital and some indefinite surrounding area = Giant Slagging Wasteland as two Imperials (*shrug* Lucan and Dulinor?) trade blows back and forth and draw reserves from the Imperial Navy (from Corridor and Solomani Rim, mayhaps?) to continue fighting for the Iridium Throne...not really realizing (or caring?) that the Archdukes (and some Dukes-cum-Archdukes-by-way-of-a-bullet) don't care, and won't recognize *whoever* takes the throne.

The Sectors and Domains and whatnot have their own problems establishing borders between a dozen or more newly independent states. Sollies try to expand to their original borders, just because they can, and they don't *necessarily* use military force to get there... Just some good old fashioned Diplomacy and an offer of *stability* might be a welcome gesture in this Time of Troubles. Vargr pirate raids increase.

Domain Border Worlds with value, but not much in the way of population will be slagged out. The garden worlds will remain (mostly) OK.

Until 1130ish, when Virus "escapes" the dugout of Lucan's team and hits one over the centerfield fence.

Fairly easy to mitigate the effects of Virus, as well, if you go with the thought that it's "software" and can't re-program non-programmable hardware.
Nothing like Lucan's Tigresses (and auxilliaries) with TL17-18 AI computers retrofitted going around the arm of the galaxy infecting the ships they can, and blowing anything else away to put a fairly rapid halt to Interstellar Trade.

If you're on a Vaccum, Trace, Insidious or Exotic Atmosphere world, you're screwed.
If you import any significant percentage of your foodstuffs from off world, you're screwed, etc.

Gives the ability to 'crash' the universe, without going the whole "Maximum Overdrive" route, where every toaster and DVD Player and Soda Machine becomes infected with Virus - unless it's convenient for your plot (then you can say that the Net-Enabled-Soda-Machine was built with a General Purpose processor, and enough software space to put something nasty in it (and probably something silly, in the process... "Honey! This ATM's calling me an A--hole!!!"))

 

[Chuck Anumia]

Originally posted by Jonathon Barton:

Perhaps IYMTU might be *all* the Imperials shooting each other up in a quick bloodbath, kangaroo court, executions loop. Then the Dukes and Archdukes follow Norris' unintentional "lead" and go through a quick grab for power (more assassinations and intrigue, but not open war), followed by "brushfire wars" over disputed worlds (which will tend to *NOT* devastate the worlds in general, because it's a fight for ownership, and nobody really wants to own a giant radioactive slag-heap.)

The Sectors and Domains and whatnot have their own problems establishing borders between a dozen or more newly independent states. Sollies try to expand to their original borders, just because they can, and they don't *necessarily* use military force to get there... Just some good old fashioned Diplomacy and an offer of *stability* might be a welcome gesture in this Time of Troubles. Vargr pirate raids increase.

Until 1130ish, when Virus "escapes" the dugout of Lucan's team and hits one over the centerfield fence.

Fairly easy to mitigate the effects of Virus, as well, if you go with the thought that it's "software" and can't re-program non-programmable hardware.
Nothing like Lucan's Tigresses (and auxilliaries) with TL17-18 AI computers retrofitted going around the arm of the galaxy infecting the ships they can, and blowing anything else away to put a fairly rapid halt to Interstellar Trade.

Gives the ability to 'crash' the universe, without going the whole "Maximum Overdrive" route, where every toaster and DVD Player and Soda Machine becomes infected with Virus - unless it's convenient for your plot (then you can say that the Net-Enabled-Soda-Machine was built with a General Purpose processor, and enough software space to put something nasty in it (and probably something silly, in the process... "Honey! This ATM's calling me an A--hole!!!"))

I like this approach!
It reminds me of an alternate virus script I read somewhere that said virus only infected the x boat network and the damage was limited in extent (except on those worlds with unhealthy atmospheres).

 

[korg]

Well I ran the droyne 'casting' thing and did the Norris 'keep the flame' talk and it went brilliantly!

There was lots of... "... but he said Regency, not Imperium? Oh, something really bad has happened!"

Moooooooooooohahahha. Excellent, Smithers!

I havnt gone any further yet, but I just wanted to say it worked a treat!

Thanks for your feedback!