My house rules for chargen

[atpollard]

100% My Opinion:

Skills in CT are a big deal. Each skill represents about 2 years of professional training (based on 2 skills gained in a 4 year term). It takes 8 years of experience to gain a permanent +1 to a skill in CT. And a skill of 1 qualifies you as a professional in that skill (able to get a job doing that).

Let’s look at a Vehicle operator skill. One level of skill represents 2 years of school or 8 years of On The Job Training. If I wanted to learn to be a pilot, I could certainly learn the basics of propeller aircraft, jet aircraft and helicopters in 2 years of full time training (Pilot School from CT). The ability to operate 1 type of vehicle would appear to be a level 0 skill.

I prefer to cascade vehicle skills so that they require greater specialization at higher levels. A sample progression of “VEHICLE-1” skills might look like :
Ground Vehicle-1: The character is trained to operate any ground vehicle (wheeled/tracked) – as opposed to water craft, aircraft or grav vehicles.
Wheeled Vehicle-2: The character has chosen to specialize in wheeled vehicles and can operate all cars/trucks/busses at skill-2 and any other ground vehicle (tracked) at skill-1.
Ground Car-3: The character has chosen to specialize in driving automobiles (like a race car or stunt car driver) and is able to operate a ground car at skill-3, any wheeled vehicle at skill-2 and any other ground vehicle at skill-1.
Street Racer-4: Since a +4 or a –4 on 2D6 roll means almost automatic success or failure (91 to 98 percent chance) I feel that skills over level 3 represent some form of extreme specialization. This character can hold his own against any driver in “Fast and Furious” when behind the wheel of a properly equipped street racer and operates at skill-4. The is still able to operate any ground car at skill-3, any wheeled vehicle at skill-2 and any other ground vehicle at skill-1. [Remember that Street racer-4 represents 16-32 years of training and experience as a professional driver, stunt driver and street racer.]

Only levels 1 to 3 would be listed as a cascade, for levels 4+ the player/ref need to just pick a vehicle to suit the campaign. Skills of 4+ are custom made.

If it inspires you, use it with my blessings. If not, then ignore it.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Golan, I want to make those compromises - to keep the skills broad - without having to make exceptions (well, that applies to everything except this, where a different rule applies). Of course, I've already blown that with some of the skill overlaps, anyway.... :nonono:

atpollard, that's a interesting way of looking at it. However, how do you write it down on a character sheet? Do you end up with a lot of Vehicle skills written down (as in your paragraph above)? Or, do you simply write down the high skill and assume the rest?

BTW, atpollard, I've always had trouble with the idea that getting 2 skill levels in 4 years equates to skill-1 = 2 years of training. (You're not the only one who uses that equation.) It's not just because the training takes place in a short time period and the rest is hands-on experience (yes, I see you take that into account). It's that in that two-year term (really, about 17 months) of pilot training, I wasn't exclusively learning how to fly - there was lots of other learning going on and skills improved. Also, 5 months of that time was learning one specific aircraft: including doctrine, tactics, rules and regs, etc. I see how the equation happens; I guess I'm just not happy with it. heh.

One other nit: CT skill-1 isn't a pro, but a competent person. I've always taken skill-2 or -3 to be a professional. If you have a quote, though, toss it at me. Those don't hurt when they hit home. (And, thanks for the input! )

 

[atpollard]

However, how do you write it down on a character sheet?

You just write down the highest skill and trust the gamers are smart enough to figure out that a Ground Car is also a wheeled vehicle (skill minus 1) which is also a ground vehicle (skill minus 2). I was originally inspired by the actual equipment lists where most of the items are already broken down into general categories. The actual cascades would be defined by the equipment list. The skill could also be written as a cascade (Vehicle, Ground-Wheeled-Car-3) so you knew that you had Car-3, Wheeled-2, Ground-1.

BTW, atpollard, I've always had trouble with the idea that getting 2 skill levels in 4 years equates to skill-1 = 2 years of training.

A valid point. One skill = 2 years seems to agree with the CT “sabbatical rules” where the character disappears for 4 years and returns with 2 skill levels. The strongest support that I have found is where Medical-3 makes the character a Licensed Doctor – going from HS graduate to M.D. is at least 6 years of full time effort with no outside life. So 2 years per skill level seems quick for medical and suggests that 1 skill level is more than a month of training.

To me, your pilot training experience reinforces that skills are meant to be BIG. Even using the official CT LBB 1 skills, I would imagine a skill like “Autopistol-1” should include a lot more than just “how to shoot it”. (Heck, I’ve never fired one but I bet that I could hit a man sized target at 10 meters in 2 or 3 shots.) I believe that Autopistol-1 would make you an expert on that weapon. You can shoot it. You can strip, clean, and reassemble it. You have completed a 2 month gun-smith course and learned to repair semi-automatic pistols. Given the proper tools, you can repair or modify the gun (like add a scope mount) or reload your own ammo. By autopistol-2 or 3, you are a marksman able to “accurize” your gun to match grade by fine tuning the parts and creating special bullet loads to match that specific make and model of gun (plus shoot a falling quarter at the same range that I could shoot a man).

As a result of my personal views, I prefer few skills but allow a great deal of flexibility in using that skill. I view each CT skill as equal to a minor ‘prestige class’ in other game systems.

One other nit: CT skill-1 isn't a pro, but a competent person. I've always taken skill-2 or -3 to be a professional.

I agree. I meant the word “professional” as someone with enough skill to be hired for a job of the same name (as opposed to an amateur at skill-0). So a vehicle-1 will allow you to work as a cab driver, but you are not a professional race car driver. You are a ‘professional’ when some one is willing to pay you to do it.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

You just write down the highest skill and trust the gamers are smart enough to figure out that a Ground Car is also a wheeled vehicle (skill minus 1) which is also a ground vehicle (skill minus 2). I was originally inspired by the actual equipment lists where most of the items are already broken down into general categories. The actual cascades would be defined by the equipment list. The skill could also be written as a cascade (Vehicle, Ground-Wheeled-Car-3) so you knew that you had Car-3, Wheeled-2, Ground-1.

I can see that working. It's tougher to explain in a paragraph, though...

The strongest support that I have found is where Medical-3 makes the character a Licensed Doctor – going from HS graduate to M.D. is at least 6 years of full time effort with no outside life. So 2 years per skill level seems quick for medical and suggests that 1 skill level is more than a month of training.

Huh. I'll agree with that.

I believe that Autopistol-1 would make you an expert on that weapon. You can shoot it. You can strip, clean, and reassemble it. You have completed a 2 month gun-smith course and learned to repair semi-automatic pistols. Given the proper tools, you can repair or modify the gun (like add a scope mount) or reload your own ammo.

Hmmm. I would agree with the "strip, clean, assemble" part. I would bump everything else up by a level or two: simple gun-smithing at AP-2, reloading ammo at AP-2, repair and modify at AP-3, accurizing would be up at AP-4 at least, along with shooting the quarter out of the air.

You are a ‘professional’ when some one is willing to pay you to do it.

I understand. My definition is the more "professional" one. But, we essentially agree.

And, again, thank you for your thoughts. I end up drifting more and more back toward a CT+.... :smirk:

 

[aramis]

AT:
that system sounds quite a bit like 5th ed Paranoia...

 

[atpollard]

AT:
that system sounds quite a bit like 5th ed Paranoia...

I'll take your word for it. I just grew tired of having a character with AutoPistol-3 who shoots a revolver with the same skill as a barbarian spearman. The weapon cascade already existed in the equipment list - all swords are obviously related, and are just as obviously related to other edged weapons. This was just a way to quantify what items are related and how closely they are related. Book 4 started it with the Combat Rifleman skill. I just tweaked it a little and expanded the concept to apply to a broader range of skills.

Another silly aspect is that the Ship's Engineer cannot fix a door latch - that takes "Mechanical" skill. :nonono:

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Well, that's partly why I shifted the Engineering skill to be more design oriented, while Mechanical skills are the actual wrench turning. 'Cause you don't need to know how to design a car engine (with the accompanying thermodynamics, etc.) to know how to fix (or even build) one. And, a ship's engineer is more likely to get the hands-on skills than the Engineering skills (unless he uses the Higher Ed table).

 

[aramis]

I took a similar approach but different path to fritz...

IMTG's Engineering is knowing how to keep a drive operating, and diagnose the problems specific to Ship Drives. Repairs take Engineering for PP and Jump Drive, Gravitics for Maneuver (Engineering serves as at half)....

ANd designing Ships is Naval Architect.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Yup, aramis, Architect is a separate skill (though it overlaps somewhat). And, since I put cascades with Engineering and Mechanical, you can define more readily what's meant with certain skills.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Another question: What should be the range of success (when combining Enlistment and Survival odds) for careers? And, don't forget, the odds will change for those who gain the DMs. (Sometimes that changes the odds dramatically.) Please give answers in terms of Career, no DM odds, odds with all DMs.

 

[atpollard]

A subtle concept that I always liked is a college degree (like Mechanical Engineering) is both better and worse than the comparable experience based skill (like Mechanical). Assume that two characters are attempting the same repair (requires 10+ on 2D6 for a hard problem) and both characters must roll once to identify the problem and once to repair it (assume that multiple attempts are possible). Character A has Mechanical Engineering-2 which grants him a +4 to diagnosing problems (+2 per skill - superior theory) and a +1 to repairing problems (+1/2 per skill - inferior experience). Character B has Mechanical-2 which grants him a +2 to diagnosing and a +2 to repairing problems.

This always seemed fertile ground for generating role-playing scenarios and two characters who are much better as a team than either one is working alone.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

And, AT, it makes sense if the guy with Mechanical has a Mech-4, and he can look at the snot-nosed university grad (ME-2) and say, "Fat lot you know, pup. I been working on these engines since before you were born, and the problem with the EB47X3 is almost always the frappalator. It comes loose right back here - and there ain't nothing you can do about it, 'cept tighten it back up every so often. And, you gotta remember to get your hand out of the way fast, cause this sucker'll start spinning again in a right hurry." Etc., etc.

Edit: Ooooh. I just noticed you didn't give a swap out - ME-2 gets +4, +2 while the Mech-2 gets +2,+4. Yours is ME-2 gets +4,+1 while Mech-2 gets +2, +2! Interesting! end edit

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Here's what I mean about the odds. Using CT as the example, the primary six careers have the following odds of a successful term (Enlistment, followed by Survival).

w/o DMs to the rolls:

[U]Navy   Marines   Army    Scouts   Merchant  Other[/U]
35%      [b]20[/b]%      20%     34%       49%      81%

w/ all DMs added to the rolls:

[U]Navy   Marines   Army    Scouts   Merchant  Other[/U]
81%      66%      97%     76%       89%      97%

With the initial cut at numbers I have, my success possibilities (w/o DMs) range from 12% for the Marines to 89% for Citizen; w/ DMs, they range from 52% (Marines) to 100% (Official and Citizen).

Where do you think these ranges should lie, and should they be similar (to each other) or should they be different based on career?

 

[Golan2072]

Here's what I mean about the odds. Using CT as the example, the primary six careers have the following odds of a successful term (Enlistment, followed by Survival).

Does this include re-enlistment as well?

 

[Fritz_Brown]

My numbers above are only for initial enlistment and the survival roll. The odds go up for re-enlistment, as it is always a lower roll you have to make.

This is calculated by multiplying the odds for a successful Enlistment (such as 21/36 for 7+) by the odds for Survival (15/36 for a 8+) to get the result (24%).

I also screwed up the Marines example above. The probability w/o DMs should be 20%, not 70%.

 

[Ptah]

A subtle concept that I always liked is a college degree (like Mechanical Engineering) is both better and worse than the comparable experience based skill (like Mechanical). Assume that two characters are attempting the same repair (requires 10+ on 2D6 for a hard problem) and both characters must roll once to identify the problem and once to repair it (assume that multiple attempts are possible). Character A has Mechanical Engineering-2 which grants him a +4 to diagnosing problems (+2 per skill - superior theory) and a +1 to repairing problems (+1/2 per skill - inferior experience). Character B has Mechanical-2 which grants him a +2 to diagnosing and a +2 to repairing problems.

This always seemed fertile ground for generating role-playing scenarios and two characters who are much better as a team than either one is working alone.

I love this. Can the ME grad eventually convert some of the skill into M then have both ME & M?