Miniature grunge

[Lord Kalvan of Otherwhen]

I recently acquired some official Traveller 15mm miniatures (these were the minis I wanted, but couldn't afford back in the early 80's). Anyway, I'm very happy to have them, but many have a "corrosion" on them. I assume that this needs to be cleaned off before I paint. Two questions:

What exactly is this "corrosion"?

And how do I remove it correctly?

Thanks in advance..

 

[outrider11]

simple green or pinesol should remove the grunge. you will still need to scrub the figures with a toothbrush and remember to wear gloves when doing so

 

[Granpafishy]

Well, corrosion is the oxidation of a substance. In a more layman term, it is the equivelent of rust. Yes, it should be removed before you paint. As far as removeal, what are the miniatures made of. If you're not sure, my suggestion would be CLR or BUG Juice and a stiff nylon brush.

 

[Redleg58]

Originally posted by outrider11:
simple green or pinesol should remove the grunge. you will still need to scrub the figures with a toothbrush and remember to wear gloves when doing so

This'll work on it,particularly on 15mm troops you don't want to use anything harsher.

 

[kaladorn]

I'm also told there is some sort of a rot that affects unprimed lead based minis - some sort of contagious thing that can spread to other similarly unprepared minis if they are housed together. You may want to make darn sure you get these things cleaned up, based (pennies, or whatever you use) and primed up. After that, they should be safe enough.

I thing a toothbrush and some pinesol or simple green are good first places to start. You may consider soaking them in (no word of a lie, it is an incredibly powerful detersive) brake fluid.
Then use a toothbrush and wear some good rubber gloves. Acetone would work too, but why handle a hazardous material (quite nasty stuff, really) if you don't have to?

 

[far-trader]

Acck! Contagious! I'd heard of this grunge but thought it was just the regular patina you get on metal after many years. So do I need to quarantine and isolate any new (usually old oop) metal I add to my collection until they get paint? Do you have any links on this subject? Is it just certain mixes of metals? Thanks for any help on this, I gotta go scrub some minis and shelves and then primer everything now.

Oh yeah btw, while brake fluid will likely work it also does the same to less durable material so be careful working on the antique dining table.

 

[GJD]

Lead Rot is a term that crops up occasionall on the oracle of minature gaming that is www.theminaturespage.com I don't think its acyually contagious, rather that it is found on lots of old minis together.

I've always found that soaking the miniature in Coca Cola is stunningly effective at getting rid of rot, grot and old paint. Or, if you are in the UK, HP Brown Sauce is just as good. I don't know why, but it cleans them up just fine.

 

[far-trader]

Hi GJD, good suggestion with the Coke though I recall a grade school science experiment popular in my youth involving dissolving different metals in it so I guess don't leave it too long eh I surf TMP occasionally but it looks like your link missed an i and should be www.theminiaturespage.com

Originally posted by GJD:
Or, if you are in the UK, HP Brown Sauce is just as good. I don't know why, but it cleans them up just fine.

Hmm, I wonder if that's the same as the HP Steak Sauce over here, much too good to waste on stripping paint

Thanks for reducing my panic, I was pretty sure it wasn't anything that could be 'contagious' like a mold or something but you never know what somebody might discover. Or it could be yet another urban legend running amok

 

[kaladorn]

Apologies to Trader Jim for a scare. Jim, I *have* heard it said that it is contagious, in a similar fashion to how rust is contagious (place a rusty bit of metal up against a not-yet-rusty one... and it is sort of contagious....). It isn't like a bacteria or anything (just a chemical reaction). Best thing for any of these minis is to get a coat of primer on them and seal them up. Then put them away from dust in a case or something if you aren't going to paint them for a time. If need be, you can always strip the primer later (I've stripped off figures glued to washers with epoxy using acetone and brake fluid does an awesome job removing paint - even where you don't want it to, so be careful!).

I'd say try Coke (with a single figure), Simple Green and Pinesol (not togther...). Those are the cheap solutions. Failing that, try a bit of gas, brake fluid, and if all else fails, try Acetone. But don't go that route unless you have to and be aware that the things further up the potency scale tend to also come with an associated materials handling/health issue (gas, brake fluid, acetone, etc).

I think you'll be all right. I've never (myself) given up on an old figure yet! (Heck, I just ordered a bunch of OOP Traveller ships!).

Tomb

 

[far-trader]

Originally posted by kaladorn:
Apologies to Trader Jim for a scare.

Acck! Trader Jim! Where! What me?

Acck! I've been mistaken for TJ!

Run! Hide! Where's my armor!

Sorry kaladorn that was too funny. Actually I've kind of half expected someone to confuse the two of us someday, its almost a relief to have it done .

Thanks for the clarification, though I wasn't quite as worried as I might have intimated in the post. I was in a bit of a goofy mood.

FT looks around, "TJ? Yeah, I've heard of him. No, I have no idea where he is."

 

[GJD]

Originally posted by far-trader:
Hi GJD, good suggestion with the Coke though I recall a grade school science experiment popular in my youth involving dissolving different metals in it so I guess don't leave it too long eh I surf TMP occasionally but it looks like your link missed an i and should be www.theminiaturespage.com

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by GJD:
Or, if you are in the UK, HP Brown Sauce is just as good. I don't know why, but it cleans them up just fine.

Hmm, I wonder if that's the same as the HP Steak Sauce over here, much too good to waste on stripping paint

Thanks for reducing my panic, I was pretty sure it wasn't anything that could be 'contagious' like a mold or something but you never know what somebody might discover. Or it could be yet another urban legend running amok </font>[/QUOTE]Gosh darn it but I just can't spell. Thanks for the right link.

Contagious/noncontagious? I think its just that minis that get it tend to get it together. Lead rot is a bit of a misnomer, as its actually the allowing metals that get corroded, antimony and tin in some cases. I've got a heap (literally) of old minis, including some with really bad lead rot, and it has never transferred from one to another as far as I can see. However, If you are concerned about it then I'd get em cleaned, primed and based asap.

One thing you will notice with older lead miniatures is that ther react to skin oils much quicker than newer stuff, so after being cleaned up they will tarnish again fairly quickly.

You also need to make sure that you thoroughly clean off all the cleaning agent as well, or your primer won't stick, or, if you're using something noxious like acetone or brake fluid, will react badly to the primer.

 

[Lord Iron Wolf]

It's called lead rot and one it starts in a miniature it is time to send it to be melted at a refiner as it never stops. Prime and paint and it will still continue to ruin your paint job by continuing to blossum.

Sorry for the bad news,
LIW

 

[kaladorn]

Originally posted by Lord Iron Wolf:
It's called lead rot and one it starts in a miniature it is time to send it to be melted at a refiner as it never stops. Prime and paint and it will still continue to ruin your paint job by continuing to blossum.

Sorry for the bad news,
LIW

I've heard that said. Do you have any kind of link to a site that has a more full description? What condition exists that, if properly removed from the surface, can somehow reappear right through primer and paint? That suggests that this should happen to ALL painted figures with that kind of constitution.... I can't see that. And it isn't like it can 'penetrate' the metal.... so what's the science behind the claim?

I've had grunged up figs, but never ones I could verify as having this kind of rot.... but they cleaned up and painted okay. Most show no signs of anything bad, though the comments you make are ones I've heard echoed around.

I'm just wondering if this is a 'mini gamer urban legend' or if there is some science to back it up and explain why a painted fig would remanifest the condition.... and why you can't clean a fig successfully. If something gets onto the surface to cause this in the first place, you'd think it could be gotten rid of with the right treatment.

So, I've heard what you've suggested before. But a lot of 'grunged' figs probably don't have exactly that problem. And again, is it really the problem identified? And if so, how does it really work/occur?

Not arguing... just curious.....

 

[Lord Iron Wolf]

Lead Rot,

The biggest problem with it isn't the white powder but rather the lead underneath that is still being worked on by fingerorganic acids. Even if it's cleaned the part that is corroding hasn't been removed and the process continues. It may vary due to different lead/tin mixtures but I don't know of any literature on it--so it may be a legend.

The single thing I've noticed in my old ones is the less they were handled, the less chance they had lead rot. I'd look for a mini which still had the parting powder upon it and avoid ones which looked polished due to handling.

LIW