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How do you prefer your body-armor rules to work?

How do you prefer your body-armor rules to work?


  • Total voters
    85

Golan2072

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Generally speaking, Traveller uses three kinds of rules in regard to body armor (and vehicle armor as well in most cases):

1) Armor that reduces the chances to get hit (CT and T20).
2) Armor that absorbs damage (TNE, T4).
3) Armor that has to be penetrated; the amount of penetration determines the extent of damage (Azhanti High Lightling, Striker, MT).

Which of these approaches do you prefer to use?
 
I believe armor absorbs damage in T20 too ...

btw. I vote other. I use the T20 system with damage reduction (as it is writen in the T20 rules)
 
I had to vote "another" because my system uses both damage reduction and penetration.
 
Originally posted by Dunryc:
I believe armor absorbs damage in T20 too ...
It does? I don't have T20 (yet), but I was operating under the assumption that it uses usual D20 armor rules (i.e. AC modifies the Difficulty Class [DC] to hit).
 
Yay, I'm a lone data point! Celebrate my uniqueness!

I was thinking about this just the other day, actually, considering if I wanted to use the armor as DR and weapon penetration rules from Striker. After a couple of hours of reading and scribbling notes, I decided no, I'd stick with the original CT system. I realized that it didn't really add anything to the game, that the armor modifier to the attack throw already reflects DR and penetration adequately for my needs.
 
Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Dunryc:
I believe armor absorbs damage in T20 too ...
It does? I don't have T20 (yet), but I was operating under the assumption that it uses usual D20 armor rules (i.e. AC modifies the Difficulty Class [DC] to hit). </font>[/QUOTE]Armour in T20 does both.

The armour rating (AR) of the armour is applied just like regular AC in d20. It also subtracts damage dice and then damage from a successful hit.
 
Originally posted by Black Globe Generator:
Yay, I'm a lone data point! Celebrate my uniqueness!

I was thinking about this just the other day, actually, considering if I wanted to use the armor as DR and weapon penetration rules from Striker. After a couple of hours of reading and scribbling notes, I decided no, I'd stick with the original CT system. I realized that it didn't really add anything to the game, that the armor modifier to the attack throw already reflects DR and penetration adequately for my needs.
I agree, by changing perception of how the CT armour matrix works - i.e. the DM reflects the ability of a weapon to penetrate a given armour type - it becomes easier to sell the system to players.

I still prefer the armour as damage reduction of T4 because there is no need for a combat chart.
Roll to hit, damage dice are on your sheet, AR is on your sheet, the latter subtracts from the former.
It plays really quickly
 
Originally posted by the Bromgrev:
I had to vote "another" because my system uses both damage reduction and penetration.
Same here, armor reduces damage with weapon penetration determining how much armor can be ignored for damage reduction purposes.
 
I had to vote "another", because my suggested T5 prototype has a linear AV spanning from personal to dreadnought, and therefore all weapons have pen; however, personal weapons have Pen 1, which means the effect is identical to T4 for personal combat purposes; i.e. personal armor absorbs one die of damage per point, no table lookup required.
 
My problems with the CT (Armor as a DM to hit) are two-fold. First, the need to have two lists of DMs (range and armor) per weapon, which complicates character sheets and makes new weapons and armor more difficult to add. Second, combat with it is a hit-or-miss affair, with shots either causing full damage or not penetrating at all. The second disadvantage is also an advantage from the POV of realism: even if you're firing a weak pistol at someone wearing a kevlar vest (which stops most such rounds that hit it), you still (in the real world) have a chance to hit the unprotected face... And you have a greater chance to do so if you're skilled (as in LBB1). However, lethality is also realistically high in LBB1.

The advantages of damage-absorbance are twofold. First, it simplifies combat, as you only have to list range DMs, damage dice and armor penetration (i.e. how much armor the weapon ignores) per weapon, and adding new pieces of armor is easy (just list their armor value). Second, it means that on most non-critical hits, your armor mitigates some of the damage, so, on one hand, any shot that doesn't get wholly absorbed does some damage, and, on the other hand, most shots against an armored PC do only part of their damage. The second advantage is also a disadvantage from the POV of realism, as it reduces the lethality of combat and thus reduces realism.
 
Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Second, combat with it is a hit-or-miss affair, with shots either causing full damage or not penetrating at all.
That's what the range of damage values represents - if you penetrate armor (that is, "hit" against the armor type) with a 3D weapon, a roll of 3 means most of the damage was soaked up by the armor and/or produced a minor wound, while a roll of 18 means it found a seam or a gap and penetrated fully at a vital spot like the head or under the arm.

Ta-da! CT damage reduction, baby! ;)
 
Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
The amount of damage rolled can also give you an idea of which hit location was damaged.
Or you can use the hit location tables in Traveller's Digest 13 or 14.
 
Simple. As simple as possible. Cmbt in RPGs has got way too difficult. Armour since CT has always been a thorn in my side. I liked the simplicity of CT but not having to remember countless numbers. MT did a better job but I had a hell of a time understanding it. What I want is something simple but deadly.
 
Agreed.

I once used a combat system for Traveller that had:

a to hit roll

a hit location roll

an armour penetration roll

a damage roll.

I now only use two - roll to hit and roll for damage.

(and I've toyed with the idea of a single roll...)
 
Mmmm single roll!

Roll to hit; pen = roll - target number;
Pen x weapon rating equals damage;
Numbers on the dice determine location?

So a laser rifle (damage 6D);
Roll 8+ to hit. Say you roll a 10, so pen = 2.
Damage therefore = 6 x 2 = 12 points.

That would be slick.

Location might be tricky, especially low rolls generally fail. On the other hand, that means highly skilled folks have a chance of a critical hit... hmmm not bad.
 
I was thinking of dividing stats by 3, round up to get the damage track

Then roll to hit, for each point you exceed your target number by you add 1 to the weapon's base damage rating (which is its CT number of damage dice), armour subtracts 1 per point of armour rating.
 
Originally posted by robject:
Mmmm single roll!
<SNIP>
Say you roll a 10, so pen = 2.
Damage therefore = 6 x 2 = 12 points.

That would be slick.
<SNIP>
On the other hand, that means highly skilled folks have a chance of a critical hit... hmmm not bad.
You have looked at Dalton's system right? This is similar to what he proposed, and it looked like it worked quite well.

It was quite slick, but I prefer battledress to be proof from small arms, which means that I need to have penetration rules...

Scott Martin
 
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