Etiquette and Protocol

[rancke]

The program Etiquette and Protocol described on p. 231 is said to give an intelligent computer a SOC score that depends on the complexity of the program.

I don't understand this at all. Surely social status is something conferred on a being from outside? If Emperor Caligula makes his horse a senator, he is a senator however dull his conversation. And if Grand Director Argelbargel says robots are not citizens, then intelligent robots are at best slaves (SOC 0) or else mere machines (so SOC at all), however erudite.

Hans

 

[Shadowdancer]

Yes, but the program allows the robot or machine to properly interact with people as if it had that appropriate SOC level. In other words, it would phrase its responses in the proper way to avoid giving insult, and would be less likely to commit any social faux pas.

The same can be said of many servants who work for people of high SOC level. The servants themselves don't have that SOC level, but they are trained to appropriately act and re-act within that environment. Watch the movie "Gosford Park" for a good example of this.

 

[Commonman]

The name of the program says it all the program allow the robot to act as if there SOC was as high as that, so they know how to walk the walk and talk the talk. Also, people will act friendlier towards the robot and with more respect because of the way the robot acts. Remember while SOC bestows rank it also, denotes a certain style and behavior.

 

[rancke]

Originally posted by Commonman:
The name of the program says it all the program allow the robot to act as if there SOC was as high as that...

That's not what the description says. It says that it allows the intelligent computer to have a given SOC score. But your manners are not the cause of your social status. If anything, your social status is the cause of your manners, and that's not always the case. Take your basic SOC 10 Joe Citizen who has the luck to do the imperium a huge favor. The Emperor waves his hand and says "Bing, you're an Imperial knight!" and, hey presto, Joe Citizen is now SOC 16, but his manners are the same. Take his pal Joe Actor who learned all about eqiquette and protocol. He may be able to fool people into thinking he is SOC 16, but that doesn't make him SOC 16.

Hans

 

[themink]

No, even after the knighthood, he is still Soc 10

He acts and is comfortable with a particular social circle.

If Soc was actual "rank" within society, then there would be bonuses for having a job, Bonuses when commisioned etc etc.

Instead it represents the social level you feel comfortable at.

Result : The Child of a Baron has a Baron's SOC even though they don;t get the title until their parent dies.

At least that is my understanding of the rules.

If you read it the other way, players with low SOC would not be allowed to be commisioned in prior history

 

[Commonman]

SOC standing is a very wierd stat, being a baron in the core would mean little on the frontier. But having a high SOC, to me, means having a certain style wether you have the title or not, otherwise why would you have to spend so much for you standard of living? So, the robot with a higher SOC would be able to interact better because it has a bearing about it. IMTU SOC is not just your standing in society but also your bearing so that if you crash your spaceship on a back water planet where they have never heard of Baron Bunny it is his bearing as a SOC 18 char that will get him respect not his constantly saying "Do you know who I am?"
Also the name of the program does give a clue of its fuction otherwise why not just call it Social Standing?

 

[rancke]

Originally posted by The Mink:
No, even after the knighthood, he is still Soc 10.

He acts and is comfortable with a particular social circle.

That does seem to be what the explanation on p. 21 is saying. I must say this differs markedly from what social status meant in CT. It also means that a Duke's butler would have the same SOC as his master. And it means that an Imperial noble who used to be a middle-class slob doesn't get any benefit to his SOC based skills from having earned a title. I'd really like to hear if that is the authors' intention.

If Soc was actual "rank" within society, then there would be bonuses for having a job, Bonuses when commisioned etc etc.

Instead it represents the social level you feel comfortable at.

But Social standing do sometimes change during Prior History. What does that represent? In CT it represented an actual increase in social level.

Result : The Child of a Baron has a Baron's SOC even though they don't get the title until their parent dies.

The family of a noble is usually considered to have the same social status as the noble, so that doesn't prove anything either way.

Hans

 

[themink]

Originally posted by rancke:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by The Mink:
No, even after the knighthood, he is still Soc 10.

He acts and is comfortable with a particular social circle.

That does seem to be what the explanation on p. 21 is saying. I must say this differs markedly from what social status meant in CT. It also means that a Duke's butler would have the same SOC as his master. And it means that an Imperial noble who used to be a middle-class slob doesn't get any benefit to his SOC based skills from having earned a title. I'd really like to hear if that is the authors' intention.

If Soc was actual "rank" within society, then there would be bonuses for having a job, Bonuses when commisioned etc etc.

Instead it represents the social level you feel comfortable at.

But Social standing do sometimes change during Prior History. What does that represent? In CT it represented an actual increase in social level.

Result : The Child of a Baron has a Baron's SOC even though they don't get the title until their parent dies.

The family of a noble is usually considered to have the same social status as the noble, so that doesn't prove anything either way.

Hans

</font>

I think that the small changes as a result of prior (and there are only a couple) are a result of the character's changed social circle and changed social mores.

He may have been a farm boy when he joined the navy, but now he is comfortable chatting with the upper echelons of society.

I think in my ATU, I will be assigning SOC rather than having it rolled. If someone wants to play a noble, then they ask for it. Otherwise the players get a SOC based on their likely circumstances (so Rogues have low SOC on average, Navy has high, Professionals have high etc)

The rules as written don;t seem clear to me.