Combat System: T20 vs Spycraft

[apoc527]

Hello all,

As a potential buyer of T20 (I own and have played GURPS Traveller), I am curious as to the specific differences between the T20 combat system and the Spycraft (AEG) combat system. Could someone who is familiar with both systems quickly give me a rundown of the specific differences between the systems? Thanks!

PS. Having recently played Spycraft, I can say that I like the system for the most part, but at low levels, the game is too cinematic for its own good. What I mean is, thugs don't die very easily.

 

[Neo]

There is definitely a certain realism which comes across in T20 combat.. you tend to learn pretty quickly that guns kill people, and that while armor helps it's generally best to stay out of the line of fire in the first place <chuckle>

 

[DrSkull]

I don't know about Spycraft, but in T20, if a dude is standing there without armor and is shot with a gun, he's in bad shape, shot twice he's probaly dying, 3 times, he's probably dead. If he gets hit b a critical it's even worse.

A good set of "bullet proof" armor makes life a lot nicer.

 

[solar_shipping]

Spycraft uses the d20 mechanics as seen in Star Wars. Hence it is (rightly IMHO) geared for cinematic genre.

BTW, I do like Spycraft, and it has some nice mechanisms I would most likely port to T20, like action die.

 

[tjoneslo]

http://www.enworld.org/d20reviews.asp?sub=yes&where=active&reviewer=Psion&product=trav

Psion review of T20 now includes a brief description of the combat system and how it differs from the SW/Spycraft system.

If you still have specific questions, post em.

 

[apoc527]

I'm slightly confused as to how armor reduces Lifeblood damage.

Let's say I have an ACR, and going by the damages in the TA1, we'll call it 1d12 damage per hit. Some random bad guy needs to get shot with it, and he has some armor on...let's call it Cloth and give it an arbitrary AC of 3 (which may or may not be correct, I'm just making up numbers).

Aside from adding to his AC, as D&D, when I roll that d12, I ALSO subtract 3 from the Lifeblood damage he takes, and he takes the full rolled damage to Stamina? If I understand correctly, if I were to do a 10 round burst, I would then do 4d12 damage to Stamina, and 1d12 to Lifeblood.

I think that's right, but the review isn't terribly clear.

Thanks! Btw: If I have this right, this is MUCH deadlier than the Vitality/Wounds system, and it seems to me that Vitality represents an entirely different thing than T20's Stamina. Vitality is really a cinematic action hero's ability to avoid damage in the face of great adversity (usually in the form of a hail of bullets or blaster bolts), whereas it seems like Stamina is being used to...well, actually represent tiredness in combat and the effects of blunt trauma through armor.

 

[DrSkull]

You are understanding the concept correctly, right on the money all around.

 

[apoc527]

Quick question-

Can enough armor reduce Stamina damage? I suppose this could be handwaved by saying that big armor has enough AC to make "hitting" difficult in the first place, but it seems to me that an autopistol isn't going to cause someone in battledress much pause at all. It's ok if they just the AC for that type of thing, but I really think that someone in Battledress should be immune to some schmuck with a handgun.

Anyone know how that works?

 

[tjoneslo]

Originally posted by apoc527:
Quick question-

Can enough armor reduce Stamina damage?

Anyone know how that works?

No, there are no rules for reducing Stamina damage with enough armor.

OTOH, Battledress is build using the Vehicle design rules, so unless you manage to critical hit the suit, the guy inside takes no damage until you destroy the suit. Vehicle damage is all Structual Integrity (Lifeblood for inanimate objects) and hence reduced by armor. Battledress has enough armor on it to reduce almost all handweapon to zero damage.

 

[apoc527]

Originally posted by tjoneslo:

OTOH, Battledress is build using the Vehicle design rules, so unless you manage to critical hit the suit, the guy inside takes no damage until you destroy the suit. Vehicle damage is all Structual Integrity (Lifeblood for inanimate objects) and hence reduced by armor. Battledress has enough armor on it to reduce almost all handweapon to zero damage.

Good, that's all I wanted to know. Most armor that's not battledress will probably make the wearer feel something, unless it just bounces off, which I assume is abstracted into the AC bonus that the armor grants?

Thanks! I think I will buy T20 now, just for the Stamina/Lifeblood system if not to play Traveller.