Book 2 Freight creation
- Thread starter whartung
- Start date
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
Yes:
No:
No:
A J-1 ship takes on cargo for a J-2 route, doing two jumps through empty space.
Yes, because that's how it's worded, and it keeps things simple and easy in the trading game.
No, because that's how it's worded. A world 20+ parsecs away on a jump-1 main could be accessible, unless there's a misjump, breakdown, theft, red tape, fill in the blank. Or you have fuel tankage & supplies for a double+ jump for closer worlds.
No, because that's how it's worded. A world 20+ parsecs away on a jump-1 main could be accessible, unless there's a misjump, breakdown, theft, red tape, fill in the blank. Or you have fuel tankage & supplies for a double+ jump for closer worlds.
The second, from The Traveller Adventure, is a special case as it is part of the campaign, rather than a reflection of what would be the general situation.
However, I don't see any reason why a GM couldn't allow searching for passengers and freight for a multi-jump trip, perhaps with a negative DM for each jump beyond the first to reflect lower demand for trips requiring more than one jump (as an alternative, you could adjust the World Pop Digit by -1 per extra jump).
A Jump-1 ship would be expected to charge twice as much as a Jump-2 ship for a Jump-2 route (even through deep space as it is 2 jumps, as I interpret it) for both passengers and cargo while taking twice as long. It could also carry less cargo because it would have to carry extra fuel and life-support. There is also the point that astrogation to and from a point in deep space is harder than astrogation to/from a star system, a point for the crew to bear in mind but that would also be one known to many potential passengers. Of course, a Jump-2 is a harder astrogation problem than a Jump-1 so there is that offsetting factor. So using a Jump-1 ship on a Jump-2 route requires careful consideration of the economics and the competition.
If your player's have a Jump-1 ship I think most referees would only offer cargo/passengers for Jump-1 destinations unless the players specifically requested something different. How ships obtain cargo/passengers depends on your own particular campaign but most systems would probably (I would think) prioritise offering 1-jump cargo to Jump-1 ships, then 2-jump cargoes on Jump-1 routes if there were no available Jump-2 ships. It would probably not occur to a system (whether computer or sophont-operated) to offer cargo to a ship that did not have the range to reach the destination so the ship would have to specifically request it. What a patron might suggest is a whole different ball-game.
Always remember that the rules are a framework to help you tell the stories you and your players want to tell. Some rules interact with others so changing them needs a little thought but ultimately it is your game. The rules are scaffolding, not a straitjacket, and you are absolutely entitled to change or interpret any of them that you see fit (just remember to tell the players what the changes are).
If your player's have a Jump-1 ship I think most referees would only offer cargo/passengers for Jump-1 destinations unless the players specifically requested something different. How ships obtain cargo/passengers depends on your own particular campaign but most systems would probably (I would think) prioritise offering 1-jump cargo to Jump-1 ships, then 2-jump cargoes on Jump-1 routes if there were no available Jump-2 ships. It would probably not occur to a system (whether computer or sophont-operated) to offer cargo to a ship that did not have the range to reach the destination so the ship would have to specifically request it. What a patron might suggest is a whole different ball-game.
Always remember that the rules are a framework to help you tell the stories you and your players want to tell. Some rules interact with others so changing them needs a little thought but ultimately it is your game. The rules are scaffolding, not a straitjacket, and you are absolutely entitled to change or interpret any of them that you see fit (just remember to tell the players what the changes are).
kilemall
SOC-14 5K
Given that the RAW has what should be higher value jumps cost as much as jump 1, multi jumps should be far less desirable, increasing cost while slowing down.
If one doesn’t want to do per parsec pricing home rules, how about-
* add 1d of lots per jump number the ship will do above 1, and
* subtract 1d for number of jumps to get to the final destination
If one doesn’t want to do per parsec pricing home rules, how about-
* add 1d of lots per jump number the ship will do above 1, and
* subtract 1d for number of jumps to get to the final destination
Or you can fold in some of the cargo rules from later editions, T20 in particular had a few interesting categories, Hazardous {25% chance of "mishaps"} Security {35% chance of attracting pirates/hijackers ETC } and priority cargo {must be delivered within 14 days} Or MGT 1E/2E had increased rates for longer distances.
While I like the basic idea I'm split on the implementation. It allows smaller ships like the scout to be more viable as long distance clippers but the rates for longer jumps climb quickly—the rates for J6 in MGT 2E are particularly ridiculous, no wonder they had to adjust the amount of freight downward.
Here for example you can see the high passage rates for CT vs MGT 1E and 2E. CT is a straight linear increase, MGT 1E is somewhere between linear and geometric, and MGT 2E is kind of geometric, {increasing at approximately 1.5x per parsec} except the J6 rates. It would be kind of interesting, paying extra for faster jumps, but less that the linear {parsecs * rate}
If you made it a 1.5x geometric rate you'd end up with something like this:
Which gives a discounted, but faster trips to a J-2, and J-3, and a charges premium for j-5 and J-6 trips. If you wanted to generate a cost modifier for all cargo types you might go with something like: J-1 = 1X, J-2 = 1.5 , J-3 = 2.5 X, J-4 = 3.5 X, J-5 = 5X, & J-6 = 7.5 X. That would come in close to the geometric rate.
While I like the basic idea I'm split on the implementation. It allows smaller ships like the scout to be more viable as long distance clippers but the rates for longer jumps climb quickly—the rates for J6 in MGT 2E are particularly ridiculous, no wonder they had to adjust the amount of freight downward.
Here for example you can see the high passage rates for CT vs MGT 1E and 2E. CT is a straight linear increase, MGT 1E is somewhere between linear and geometric, and MGT 2E is kind of geometric, {increasing at approximately 1.5x per parsec} except the J6 rates. It would be kind of interesting, paying extra for faster jumps, but less that the linear {parsecs * rate}
If you made it a 1.5x geometric rate you'd end up with something like this:
| Parsecs | High Passage | |
| CT (linear) | MGT (geometric) ( rounded) | |
| 1 | 10,000 | 10,000 |
| 2 | 20,000 | 15,000 |
| 3 | 30,000 | 23,000 |
| 4 | 40,000 | 35,000 |
| 5 | 50,000 | 53,000 |
| 6 | 60,000 | 80,000 |
Which gives a discounted, but faster trips to a J-2, and J-3, and a charges premium for j-5 and J-6 trips. If you wanted to generate a cost modifier for all cargo types you might go with something like: J-1 = 1X, J-2 = 1.5 , J-3 = 2.5 X, J-4 = 3.5 X, J-5 = 5X, & J-6 = 7.5 X. That would come in close to the geometric rate.
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 5K
Depends on how the starship is being operated.
If the starship is operating as a TRAMP ... meaning no set route, no pre-planned itinerary, simply go wherever the winds of supply & demand blow you towards ... then the operators are working on a basis of (only) 1 jump at a time (maybe 2 if they can double jump through empty hexes). Therefore, all worlds within Jn of the world of origin are potential destinations, roll for passengers+cargo to each of those possible destinations.
However, if the starship is operating on a pre-planned route ... for ease of illustration purposes, let's say from Vilis/Vilis to Lanth/Lanth @ J2 ...
Because of the pre-planned route (Vilis, Saurus, Tavonni, Lanth), a starship departing from Vilis for Lanth could roll for passengers+cargo going to:
- Saurus
- Tavonni
- Lanth
- Tavonni
- Lanth
- Lanth
Saurus -> Lanth = 2 tickets (because 2J2)
Tavonni -> Lanth = 1 ticket (because 1J2)
How do you reconcile "intermediate stops" along the way to your final destination?
LBB2.81, p4:
Implicit in that point is the notion that starships are (exclusively) "single jumpers" ... with the Type-Y Yacht being a rare exception (but it's hardly designed for commercial service anyway).
LBB2.81, p9 includes the following, which explicitly opens the door to pre-planned routes of multiple jumps:
The point about intermediate destinations requiring additional tickets per destination is what make pre-planned routes a "viable option" for starship operators.
What is NOT clear (or at least, not explicitly stated) is whether double jumping through empty hexes costs 1 ticket (starport to starport) or 2 tickets (double jump). My personal inclination is towards the simplest option in which tickets are charged PER JUMP, rather than on the basis of Per Parsec.
2J1 = 2 tickets
1J2 = 1 ticket
Vilis to Lanth via Saurus and Tavonni as intermediate destinations ... 3J2 = 3 tickets
In a practical sense, most TRAMP merchant starships aren't going to "lock in" more than 1 destination at a time.
They CAN do so, if they're determined to "get from here to there" across a distance longer than their drives can achieve in a single jump, but that's going to be done on an ad hoc basis depending on circumstances (usually involving a patron or a speculative goods opportunity).
Tramps prefer to "keep their options open" for where to go "next" based on the simple expedient of demand for their transport services (fill my manifest tends to win over empty manifest options).
Pre-planned "circulator" routes for merchants, where the itinerary is determined in advance and may not be deviated from makes it possible to "link up" pairs of origin/destination which the starship cannot traverse in a single jump.
The real quandary is the demand side of the equation. Suppose some one, or some thing needs to go across the sector. Suppose the players are traveling san starship. Surely someone in the Imperium can purchase a ticket from one capital to another, but how does one price such a trip? It's 36-33 Sectors, so anything from ~2.8 years to {w/ j-1 and drop tanks at certain points, and 2 weeks per jump} to 6 weeks for a with J-6 with fuel tenders and 1 week per jump. But what is the price for a low passage over this route?
6,000 Cr for 6 jumps on the J-6 clipper would seem quite a bargain at that point. Compare with 19,000 Cr for a J-2 ship. Surely a premium for fast travel is in order.
6,000 Cr for 6 jumps on the J-6 clipper would seem quite a bargain at that point. Compare with 19,000 Cr for a J-2 ship. Surely a premium for fast travel is in order.
Yes. I've always taken it to mean within a single jump of where the ship starts from. For my own sanity (and not wanting to waste time on anything that will not see the light of day at my table) I only roll for worlds accessible in a single jump. Anything beyond that is plot driven by me as the GM. Otherwise (in absurdum) the argument could be made to roll cargo for all worlds on the entire Spinward Main for any ship.
The aforementioned TTA section "In search of longer legs" was (IIRC) plot driven, which is something any GM can throw at their players anytime they like.
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
Sure, but it's canon doing it...
Agreed, but it's not what the LBB rules say.
I'm also way too lazy to roll for cargo unless the players specifically ask about the destination. By RAW, you have to roll for half the subsector (hundreds of dice?) for every jump, with decent jump capability.
Absolutely. My players regularly check further along their expected to route and have picked up cargo now to sell a few jumps along. My GM job is made easier as they've already said they want to travel from Glisten to Capital to shoot the Emperor. These players know nothing of the OTU and will be arriving at Capital sometime in 1116
Our play style is VERY loose and gonzo. Anyway, I've plotted their route on Travellermap and am able to plan some plot events along the way.
