Beowulf blueprints

[Trent]

Does anyone have any really good blueprints of a beowulf classic free trader? I'd live to get 6 views of one for modelling purposes.

BTW, don't want the GT pack, I got the marave one, they're too big, too fragile and not worth it.

 

[far-trader]

I posted my take on the old ship around here somewhere...

...ah there we are:

Beowulf class Deckplans

No fore/aft view sorry, didn't get to it yet. I think the overall tonnage is close, ballpark anyway. Deckplan tonnage is pretty much bang on by my method (which is also around here somewhere, back with a link... Deckplan Guide). I don't recall if I mention it in that thread or not but it's built from the old lead mini and the excellent (but grossly dimensioned) blueprints, and interior visuals, from Starship Operator's Manual 1.

 

[Trent]

I was kind of hoping to find something like this: http://members.cox.net/alathan/beowulf-hero.pdf

It doesn't look a lot like a classic beowulf, but it does at least have retro thrusters, unlike many beowulfs I've seen.


Hell, by god I just might make a 3d model of this version! It's not the one I was looking for but it's not bad, I think I'm modify it a little. I'd have too, the fuel intakes have no width to their walls. Make the walls a little thicker, maybe even thicker at the outer edge and mount the retro thrusters there.

Yeah, I might do something with this design, it needs some work but I could maybe fix it. I may internalize the cockpit, making it like the normal beowulfs, I.E. with cut windows into the hull, but then again the semi external one looks kinda cool too, don'tcha think?

Yours wasn't what I was looking for either, far trader, but if I'm going to do one that isn't the version i was thinking of, I.E. the one that appears in the GT products, I might do it too.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

I ended up making it up as I went along.

 

[Gadrin]

I posted my take on the old ship around here somewhere...

...ah there we are:

Beowulf class Deckplans

Very nice !

I just did a BBS Topic Downloader for phpBB (Palladium BBS) and vBulletin
(Steve Jackson Games BBS) using PHP. It downloads all the pages in
the topic (or as many as you want) and re-writes the navigation links
so you can view the topic off-line.

The SJG one is very similar to this BBS, just have to get the cookies
right.

I'm thinking about an option to download IMG that are imbedded in
the posts too (ignore any others).

Normally I rip-out all IMGs and neutralize all HREFs/ONCLICKs so that
you can't get any errors.

However your post and another BBS has many starship illos on it
and would be perfect for getting those too. Have to think that one
over... o:

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[leo knight]

Dan, thanks for the Deckplans Guide link. I missed that the first time around. Good, workable rules of thumb. A copy is going in my referee folder.

 

[Trent]

I ended up making it up as I went along.

Yes, I know yours ended up on the cover of T5, or is supposed ti if it ever gets printed. (Maybe it'll come out in time to give people something to do during the tedium of the Long Night... )

I respect you for getting it done, I just didn't like your design as much as I liked the more classic ones like the 3d ones that appear in some GT products, like starports or starships.

Yours kind of looked like a modern minivan to me, maybe advanced, but kind of cold and sterile. I thought the older beys had more personality.

But I do respect you for getting it done, I thought I had my old one done when I found a flaw where the 3 man sections come together, the intake ring, the upper deckhouse and the forward hull, I just couldn't get that right.

I guess you did somehow, I'd love to see a closeup of where those three parts come together on yours.

The neat thing with the design I found and posted a link to was that it eliminates the problem by keep the 3 parts from ever touching.

And anyway, there isn't really a "right" design for a fee trader, in traveller the FT hull has been around for literally thousands of years, dating back to the heor design of the 1i. I'm sure the vilani (Zzzz! Zzzzz!)) had a rigidly standardized design that allowed for no variance whatsoever, but once the terrans got their eager little mitts on a few there were doubtless dozens, if not hundreds, of variants made over the ensuing millennia, many of which I['m sure looked different than the baseline model and were made due to bifferent tech levels, resources, end user preffs, etc.

Hell, did you see my HOAP free trader variant in the fleet section? The hull was more or less OK, too bad I haven't got into texturing yet...

So I didn't find views of the FT style used in the GT books, no biggie, I have full views of an acceptable version I can model after making some alterations and corrections.

The thing is I do sort of need at least a basic model for proportions and scale, as I have very poor articistc senses of scale and proportion and need at least a basic guide to keep things reasonable.

 

[Sturn]

My version of the Beowulf is in a link in my signature.

 

[Trent]

Here's a link to a page full of really nice traveller ship deckplans, with full detail external views and internal plans.

As if those weren't more than enough, they come in two flavors: Square grid and hex grid.

http://members.cox.net/alathan/deckplans.html

Some people may not like they fact they were done mostly with an eye towards hero traveller, and I'm no fhan of the hero system or the company making it. but jeez, the maps and illos are good for any traveller system and I say the guy who did them deserves a gold imperial starburst for his efforts.

 

[far-trader]

Those are nice but being simple copies of the official versions (for the most part) they suffer from many of the same problems, chiefly being over size.

As a quick example, count the cargo hold tonnage of the Beowulf it looks like 124tons (not counting the air/raft, but then that's probably covered by the fewer lowberths, just 6 it looks like).

Likewise the stateroom tonnage, even allowing the 20% slop it looks over too. I'd guess the whole thing is closer to 400tons than 200ton.

If that matters to you

 

[Trent]

"Copies of official blueprints"? The beowulf and sullieman don't look a whole lot like the official versions I've seen. Most beys I've seen had internal cockpits, for example, and the fuel intakes almost wrapped around the central hull, not stuck out of it's sides.

Likewise, most suilieman scouts had a pair of recessed windows, not a semi exposed cockpit.

Are these the mongoose versions? mI haven't seen mongoose traveller, just gurps traveller and the disastrous botch that was t4...

 

[far-trader]

"Copies of official blueprints"?...

Note the "(for the most part)" please. There's no denying it. There are minor differences but overall the same plans, and problems.

Nope, not Mongoose, Hero Traveller, and I'm not familiar with the design system for it.

 

[Trent]

Note the "(for the most part)" please. There's no denying it. There are minor differences but overall the same plans, and problems.

Nope, not Mongoose, Hero Traveller, and I'm not familiar with the design system for it.

Oh, OK, they're variants of the official ones. Yes, sure, I noted similarities, but notable differences too.

I kind of like some variances in design, makes the traveller universe feel bigger and more detailed.

The exposed cockpit variants here could be from worlds that still valued human piloting and wanted the pilots to have a wider field of view than offered by the standard, fly by instruments versions, as a possibility...

 

[ThunderChilde]

Oh, OK, they're variants of the official ones. Yes, sure, I noted similarities, but notable differences too.

I kind of like some variances in design, makes the traveller universe feel bigger and more detailed.

The exposed cockpit variants here could be from worlds that still valued human piloting and wanted the pilots to have a wider field of view than offered by the standard, fly by instruments versions, as a possibility...

Always nice to see variants based on local schools of design, or perhaps regulations causing a change from the Imperial Baseline.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

Mine (loosely based on plans by atpollard) vs MT vs GT:

 

[Gadrin]

Obviously not deckplans, but I got these off the web years ago.

I remember showing them to Jesse DeGraff and he kinda went
for them. He remarked about the "Battletech missile launchers".

I call her the THOKK in MTU...

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[Andrew Boulton]

Yeah, I found those too.

 

[Trent]

Always nice to see variants based on local schools of design, or perhaps regulations causing a change from the Imperial Baseline.

Did you see my "Volturnus" in the fleet forum? It's a radical FT variant that's classed as a HOAP: Highly Optimized Atmospheric Performance. It's the basic old FT design with radical streamlining, improved fuel intakes and an extra intake/processor for mining exotic gasses from gas giants.

 

[Trent]

While we're talking about free trader designs here, I thought we could talk windows, especially cockpit ones. (BTW, I wonder how long before the PC speech gestapo decides that the "cockpit" is offensive, "sexist" or otherwise intolerable and forces people to start calling it something else, like maybe the genitalpit or something...:rofl: BTW, yes I know the origin of the term cockpit. It was a joke at the expense of PC types. Pull the stick out...)

Anyway, now that you're done laughing or groaning, I was going to talk about the windows on FT cockpits and be default other small craft.

While some of the FT models I've seen rendered for things, mostly GT, are well made and painted, and better than anything I'm making with my 3d software, (As seen by my "Volturnus" model in the fleet section.) I've noticed that a lot of FT models have very small and poorly arranged windows on the cockpit section.

OK, now we can debate whether a starship, especially a jump drive one from traveller, needs windows at all as most flying would be done by computer and instruments. Also some people claim that you must block the windows before going into jump or people go insane from seeing jump space. (Niven's "hyperspace blindspot" thing..)

Some guls might reasonably claim that a starship would need no windows at all as all flight is done by computer and avionics and windows would be as useless as tits on a bull. The argument that windows would be needed in case the instruments failed could be countered with "If there's enough system failure to knock out all instruments the ship wouldn't be flyable anyway."

Others might counter that having the ship flyable by the Mk.1 Eyeball could be a useful emergency backup anyway as the ship might have manual controls as emergency recourses.

Windows would be epxnesive in any event, I'm sure fitting them would be more expensive than simply having regular hull over the area in question, and even with exotic materials, anything short of niven's GP hull magic glass, windows would likely be vulnerable spots on the hull.

So, as a matter of personal tastes I'd say that ships should eithert have useful windows with a useful field of view for emergency flight by Mk.1 Eyeballs or none at all.

The worst of both worlds would be tiny, useless windows that still cost a lot and weaken the hull while not really offering a useful FoV to the pilot.

Looking at the blueprints for the hero version of the FT with it's semi exposed cockpit and very large windows made me think it was a variant from, maybe, something like the sword worlds where individual initiative and skill are still valued, hence their FTs have those bookoo windows for manual piloting.

Hopefully this could lead to a nice useful, intelligent discussion instead of a flamefest.

 

[Trent]

Obviously not deckplans, but I got these off the web years ago.

I remember showing them to Jesse DeGraff and he kinda went
for them. He remarked about the "Battletech missile launchers".

I call her the THOKK in MTU...

>

>

>

DAMN! I wish I knew where these came from, they're niiiice. I'd love to ask the artist what software he used.

I'm not sure I agree with the "turbofan" on the FP intakes unless this is a FT converted to serve maybe as an atmospheric craft that may use some sort of air breathing engine. That could be what it is and why it has those honking missile launchers, it's been turned into an air defense craft of some sort, possibly after blowing it's jump engine or during a military emergency.

Some of the windows seem to be armored over, supporting the "converted to military usage" theory/