Animals as Pets

[Emperor Cleon]

One of the players in my latest game wanted to have a pet animal called a Saberhound (kinda like a cross between a great dane and a sabertooth tiger). The CT rules are great for creating wild animals, but this one was a pet. So I came up with these basic rules;
Animals used as npc's have four characteristics, Strength, Dexterity, Endurance, and Intelligence.
The first three are based on the animals weight. I borrowed the rules from Jeff Kazmierski's Alien Builder Charts for these (find it at Freelance Traveller). Intelligence refers to Animal intelligence, and is subjective, determined by the referee. Smart animals would be 2d, others would be lower.
Animals an have a number of skills, equal or less than their intelligence rating. These skills represent commads that the animal understands Examples would be Attack, Hunt, Retrieve, Locate item, etc. When the PC issues an order to the animal, it will obey the command on a 2d6 roll equal or less than it's Intelligence.
Any comments?

 

[MT++]

Originally posted by Emperor Cleon:

One of the players in my latest game wanted to have a pet animal called a Saberhound (kinda like a cross between a great dane and a sabertooth tiger).

The only problem with this is that most sane humans pick pets that they can handle when it grows up!
In Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel he explores the idea that some animals simply cannot be domesticated for whatever reason (think horse vs zebra)
I think that, as a general rule, pets should be animals that are smaller than humans (I am excluding beasts of burden as pets)
Anything that is death on four/six legs is too dangerous (like idiots who keep large cats as pets)
Your mechanics idea seems fair

Suggestion:
Just roll the animal's hits to KO/kill and then generate an animal intelligence (2D6) and education (2D6).

The Edu represents their trainability. For an animal to be domesticatable they have to have an INT of 5+ and EDU of 10+, for taming they have to have INT 8+ and EDU 8+
You can train animals without domesticating them BUT they might turn on you (Lions are trainable but not domesticatable
Then again, look at chickens. Pretty much untrainable but VERY domesticated
This bears thought...

 

[MT++]

After some research I have found that of all the domesticated animals, two are carnivores and a whole heap are herbivores.

None are really well armed (the only one that is is quite small (housecats))

You can tame many animals but non-domesticates are VERY unreliable

There are no filters, eaters or killers domesticated

Random odds: Chaser roll 13+, DM +1 if 60kg or less and must be group animal
Pouncer: Roll 3D6 for 18, DM -1 per 10 kg weight
Grazer: 11+, DM -1 if 50 kg plus (small ones are too fast for us)
DM -1 if over 1 ton, DM -2 if over 5 tons
Must be group animals

So the total conclusion?

Most pets are likely going to be similiar to what we have. We can control them and if they go berserk we can kill them fairly easy
So that also precludes an armoured pet (unless it is vert docile, like a box turtle)
And most animals are really really stupid and untrainable

 

[rancke]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MT++:
The only problem with this is that most sane humans pick pets that they can handle when it grows up!
In Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel he explores the idea that some animals simply cannot be domesticated for whatever reason (think horse vs zebra)
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've been told (that is, I can't back this up at all that great cats are actually just as tamable as domestic cats. The catch is that it's actually the other way around. Domestic cats are no more tamable than great cats. It's just that when domestic cats throws a hissy fit, they don't have the strength to disembovel you.

In short, you can try to domesticate a great carnivore, but you run a hell of a risk because you can't afford even one mistake with someting that powerful.

That's not to say that there aren't animals that can't be tamed, it just doesn't relate very much to size.

 

[Christopher Jennings]

Truth be told, almost any animal has at least a 3-4 to 1 advantage over humans. Any cat larger than 30# and any dog over 50# can take out a human if it had to. The main reason the cats have an advantage over dogs is that, to quote the main character of "Calvin and Hobbs" is that "five out of their six ends are pointy"!
Here's what happened to me once. I had to adjust the coller on one of my cats. So he couldn't get away I layed over him thinking to hold him down. I'm 250+ and he was 16# at the time. He stood up, with me on top of him. Needless to say I was impressed by this and still can only imagine the power of a larger feline.
Near this time a friend was training Rottweillers and he was playing frisbee with hil oldest. The wind caught the frisbee and as he tried to catch it the dog ran full tilt into a 300# stone block and knocked it off of the retaining wall it was on. All the dog did then was shake his head to get the cobwebs out and he was ready to play again.
I think the main point I really wasn't to make is that when we do make it out to the stars we will either bring our animal companions with us or find local versions of them. If your worried about giving someone an unwanted advantage you can always and quirks to their behavior- such as you can't use pointers as watch-dogs as that is exactly what they'll do- watch as your goods go by-by. Add to that Traveller's concept of "semi-intelligence" and you could end up with wondering who's the pet and who's the owner.

 

[Gallowglass]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Christopher Jennings:
Truth be told, almost any animal has at least a 3-4 to 1 advantage over humans. Any cat larger than 30# and any dog over 50# can take out a human if it had to. The main reason the cats have an advantage over dogs is that, to quote the main character of "Calvin and Hobbs" is that "five out of their six ends are pointy"!
Here's what happened to me once. I had to adjust the coller on one of my cats. So he couldn't get away I layed over him thinking to hold him down. I'm 250+ and he was 16# at the time. He stood up, with me on top of him. Needless to say I was impressed by this and still can only imagine the power of a larger feline.
Near this time a friend was training Rottweillers and he was playing frisbee with hil oldest. The wind caught the frisbee and as he tried to catch it the dog ran full tilt into a 300# stone block and knocked it off of the retaining wall it was on. All the dog did then was shake his head to get the cobwebs out and he was ready to play again.
I think the main point I really wasn't to make is that when we do make it out to the stars we will either bring our animal companions with us or find local versions of them. If your worried about giving someone an unwanted advantage you can always and quirks to their behavior- such as you can't use pointers as watch-dogs as that is exactly what they'll do- watch as your goods go by-by. Add to that Traveller's concept of "semi-intelligence" and you could end up with wondering who's the pet and who's the owner.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not Traveller, but my group got months of amusement in one of my SkyRealms of Jorune campaigns from Zarbet, the pet Tarro. A skinless four-armed monkey with a ludicrouosly prehensile tail, an atrcoious sense of humuour and a bad attitude. Oh, and better Dysha (world specific Psionics) skills than any of the chracaters.

Only took them 9 months to realise it was a plot hook...

[This message has been edited by Gallowglass (edited 26 July 2001).]

 

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Christopher Jennings:
Truth be told, almost any animal has at least a 3-4 to 1 advantage over humans. Any cat larger than 30# and any dog over 50# can take out a human if it had to. The main reason the cats have an advantage over dogs is that, to quote the main character of "Calvin and Hobbs" is that "five out of their six ends are pointy"!
Here's what happened to me once. I had to adjust the coller on one of my cats. So he couldn't get away I layed over him thinking to hold him down. I'm 250+ and he was 16# at the time. He stood up, with me on top of him. Needless to say I was impressed by this and still can only imagine the power of a larger feline.
Near this time a friend was training Rottweillers and he was playing frisbee with hil oldest. The wind caught the frisbee and as he tried to catch it the dog ran full tilt into a 300# stone block and knocked it off of the retaining wall it was on. All the dog did then was shake his head to get the cobwebs out and he was ready to play again.
<SNIP>

I have to agree with you with the larger felines (Nasty run in with a Mountain Lion during a camping trip) but I have to disagree with you on "Any cat larger than 30# and any dog over 50# can take out a human if it had to." to a point.
That Point is "What tools are on hand for the human to use". No tools available and the human will get tore up pretty good but still win against the animals described.

Raise the cat's weight by 70 pounds and with out tools the human is cat-chow (again personal experiance with a 120pd mountain lion).
A dogs skelatal structure makes them vulnerable to a unarmed human even up to the giant breeds in a one-on-one situation. Put multiple dogs (ie. a Pack) against 1 human and the human is kibble in most cases.

Give the human a simple tool with reach (Broom Handle <again personal experiance with the damn mountain lion> )and a idea of how to use the tool correctly and the man sized cat becomes less of an issue (still a damn tough fight).
Same tool with the dogs. Tool vs 1 dog = human winning. Tool vs Multiple Dogs = Kibble.

Humans are tools users, that is our evolutionary advantage, cats have flexy bodies and large claws for their sizeas theirs and Dogs work best in groups, simple as that.
Take away a humans evolutionary advantage and we as one book put it are "soft, hairless taste treats".


[This message has been edited by Butcher (edited 29 July 2001).]

 

[MT++]

I did not say tame, I said domesticate
Many animals can be tamed but they will forever retain their feral edge (some animals cannot be tamed either, but I digress)
Domesticates must have certain characterisitics. With the merely tamed animals you always run the risk of them turning on you at the drop of a hat.
Many domestic dogs will not even defend themselves from an attack as they literally do not know how (many humans are the same way)
Domestic horses have been known to flee from wolves, when in reality a healthy adult horse can take on and win against a few wolves
A pet should be a domesticate. Unless the GM considers it funny to have the character's death dealing saber toothed animnal panic under fire and attack its master
(KILL! [RARRR} Not me you stupid son of a ... Bad guys watch with amusement as their foe struggles hand to hand with a carnivore that is like a cross between a wolverine and a big box of razor blades and chainsaws. Then as the near dead character is dragged off by the villains, who have shot his pet to save him, he vows "next time, a Lhasa Apso!")

 

[Jacqual]

you want a good pet have someone roll a Vargr. They can feed themselves and if they start to get iritating throw a stick out the airlock. Just Kidding but I really dont like Vargr dogs is good, Vargr bad lol.

 

[BlackBat242]

Just kidding, its more like "Lets do the Time Warp Again"!

 

[Darkhstarr]

Myself & characters in my games have had several different types of pets. Of course the more dangerous your profession, the more of a liability the pet is (unless semi-intelligent or well trained). Shipboard pets are at particular hazard if the ship is attacked or a malfunction. My wife's pirate captain only keeps catbots as pets since her Imperial Navy days. Then she was commander of a Gazelle Close Escort & tangled with two raiders. Her quarters took a missile hit and all contents (including the cat & its armored container) were floating around lots of messy pieces. She hasn't kept a live shipboard pet since then.

 

[Maladominus]

In my current campaign, one of the most popular shipboard pets is a 52nd century Terran mongoose strain (a genetically enhanced, very intelligent descendant of the original Indian mongoose from 20th century Terra).

 

[BlackBat242]

Actually, since my computer has arguments with PDFs (1 of 4 either don't open or lock up the computer), I rarely look at them unless I am really interested or have it recommended to me.


In the last Traveller adventure I ran, the group ended up with a mated pair of CatBats

Of course, that was instigated by the Aslan in the party... aided by the human-variant ex-bounty-hunter in the group (she had Animal Empathy, so she could calm them & help train them).

Catbats are described fairly completely in JATS #20... in the article which I posted in full here:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?p=166941

 

[Wrorianny]

I am glad you got your post up, because I dunno if this forum has a mod anymore.

Yes, Pack Animals need to be sped up. Your argument about newbies using pack mules is a good one, but I also want to add that a stupid little mob, "a snake" is 400x faster than a mule. How does that make any sense?

 

[aramis]

There are very few forum-specific mods, but there are 5-6 active supermoderators with site-wide authority.

 

[cajon5]

A dogs skelatal structure makes them vulnerable to a unarmed human even up to the giant breeds in a one-on-one situation.

Just in case I'm ever attacked by a dog: how? What should someone attacked by a single dog do?

Mountain lion story: a buddy of mine was fishing in Wyoming when the hairs on the back of his neck stood up. He looked behind him and saw a cougar doing that thing cats do when they dig in their rear paws before pouncing. He dropped his fishing pole and ran to the middle of the stream, and then almost got hypothermia before the cat decided to go hunt something drier...

 

[cajon5]

Given that genetic engineering capabilities in Traveller are high enough to have species uplifted to sentience, I would think that there would be genetically engineered pets for ships. They would be intelligent enough to obey many common commands and understand to run to their pet escape pod if alarms sound, et cetera. At the same time, certain behaviors would be engineered out of them, like poking at the buttons around the air lock...

 

[Tellon]

yeah -- shipwide -- you could easily get small monkeys uplifted -- as they do real work for people now --

we could laugh and say that the flaoting jellyfish -- in the large tank is just a pet -- until that jellyfish decides to shut off the engine until you appologize .. lol

 

[Malinor]

Given that genetic engineering capabilities in Traveller are high enough to have species uplifted to sentience, I would think that there would be genetically engineered pets for ships. They would be intelligent enough to obey many common commands and understand to run to their pet escape pod if alarms sound, et cetera. At the same time, certain behaviors would be engineered out of them, like poking at the buttons around the air lock...

The sci-fi author Peter F. Hamilton features genetically-engineered critters of various kinds in his stories. They're often seen as servants, guards or semi-sentient observation platforms. It's worth checking out his novels for inspiration.

 

[Higgipedia]

I hate to raise the thread dead, but I figured it's better than starting a redundant thread.

I rolled a Dilletante who recieved a Pet with an empathic bond as an Event result. Has there been any canon on pets in the 3I, particuarly ones who have a tendency to "bond" to its owner? I've got no problems making one up (I rather like the mongoose idea, especially since you can see them getting into all kinds of trouble on a ship), but I tend to defer to canon.