Able to skim, but can't land in atmosphere - how is that possible?

[BytePro]

Layman wise, I generally consider a sphere streamlined...

In terms of drag coefficients, they are less than half a cube or short cylinder, so less than 1, hence I was taught that would be considered 'streamlined'.

However, spheres have over ten times the drag coefficient of a tear drop shaped wing, so I think HG had it right referring to them as 'partially streamlined'.

Where Traveller screwed up, IMO, is prohibiting 'entry into word atmos for the purpose of landing' for partially streamlined (in fact, I lean to thinking they had it backwards in allowing skimming instead - gas giant atmos tend to be very turbulent). My house rule is to allow landing, but with potential of damage (affected by atmo type) and with increased time to land, and with reduced maneuverability re: pursuit actions.

(Note, spheres and cylinders are considered 'bluff' vs. 'streamlined' in fluid dynamics, IIRC, as they are dominated by pressure drag and thus have large Reynolds numbers due to their wake. Any protrusions can have a drastic impact on this as well...)

 

[Easterner9504]

A pity many dinosaurs here reject Mongoose. They have at least 3 sections covering atmosphere landing and movement. MgT has 3 types: streamlined, standard and distributed.



A streamlined ship is designed to enter a planetary atmosphere,
and can function like a conventional aircraft. Pilot or Flyer (winged)
checks are required in high winds and other extreme weather.

A standard-configuration ship can also enter a planet’s atmosphere,
but is reliant on its thrusters to keep it aloft at all times and is
extremely ungainly. Pilot checks are required for all movement and
suffer a –2 DM.

A distributed ship must make a Pilot check at a –4 DM when it
enters an atmosphere and for every minute of flight. Each check that
is failed inflicts 2d6 points of damage.


Landing: Any ship with a standard or streamlined hull may land on
the surface. Unstreamlined ships suffer a –2 DM to any Pilot checks
made in atmosphere while a ship with a Distributed hull suffers a
–4 DM to any Pilot checks, and is likely to take severe structural
damage if it lands. Landing at a starport is a Routine (+2) task for
most ships taking 10–60 seconds (so most pilots will take extra time
and get a +1 or +2 DM on top of this – see page 50).

Most ships have landing gear, allowing them to touch down ‘in
the wild’, which requires an Average (+0), Difficult (–2) or even
Very Difficult (–4) check, depending on local conditions. Nondistributed
ships can also land on bodies of water without sinking.

Failing a landing roll means that the ship has landed improperly
or even crashed.

 

[far-trader]

A pity many dinosaurs here reject Mongoose.

The real pity is you resorting to name calling to promote MgT to fellow Travellers.

 

[aramis]

The real pity is you resorting to name calling to promote MgT to fellow Travellers.

I concur.

 

[BytePro]

Sure, MgT has some rules re atmo starship operations - that this dinosaur rejects for lack of quality...

...
A distributed ship must make a Pilot check at a –4 DM when it
enters an atmosphere and for every minute of flight.

OKAY - give me 60 (VERY DIFFICULT) pilot check rolls please... (gee, how well thought out...) o:

Landing at a starport is a Routine (+2) task for most ships taking 10–60 seconds (so most pilots will take extra time and get a +1 or +2 DM on top of this – see page 50).

SO... its an EASY task taking 10 to 60 minutes - but you can risk your ship if you'd like to speed things up... :devil:

Nondistributed ships can also land on bodies of water without sinking.

Sure... if they survived the 60 pilot checks. :rofl:

Failing a landing roll means that the ship has landed improperly
or even crashed.

Well, its a good thing the author spelled that one out ...

I've nothing against MgT and I know a lot of the posters on this thread have tried it or at least own some of the books. If CT didn't exist, MgT would be my version of Traveller. As is, I've house ruled my CT with several concepts borrowed from MgT.

But these particular rules really weren't thought out very well when it comes to playability and value.

 

[BillDowns]

The solution to this, at least for established space faring systems, is debris monitoring and removal. Lot of interesting RW ideas today about that sort of things (EDDE, 'harpoon', thermal mirror heating systems, Boeing's gas clouds, etc.).

Doesn't that involve a guy named Quark?

 

[Carlobrand]

A pity many dinosaurs here reject Mongoose. ...

Proudly perverse pterodactyl pities poor provocateur. Poster peddles product poorly.:rofl:

 

[aramis]

Proudly perverse pterodactyl pities poor provocateur. Poster peddles product poorly.:rofl:

Alliterative aggitation allows agitation absent administrative adverse abberency allegations.

 

[Carlobrand]

Alliterative aggitation allows agitation absent administrative adverse abberency allegations.

Administrator's boldly crafted declaration elicits fairly good hit. I jested kookily, lackadaisically, mildly neglectful of policy. Quite remorseful, sorrow, totally understand. Velociraptor was xenophobic, yielded zero.

 

[77topaz]

"Restricted writing" disadvantages grammar, clearly.
At least colourless green ideas haven't popped up yet...

 

[Carlobrand]

"Restricted writing" disadvantages grammar, clearly.

Yeah, but it's fun!

At least colourless green ideas haven't popped up yet...

That sounds cool! How do you do it?

 

[77topaz]

Yeah, but it's fun!

Ever heard of the book without a single "e" in it? Or the book, by the same author, in which the only vowel that appeared was "e"?

That sounds cool! How do you do it?

You get them to sleep furiously.