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A Wanderer's Return

Originally posted by Malenfant:
It's funny you should mention that actually... I have been working on a revised UWP generation system (am currently trying to get over a few stumbling blocks at the moment). I was pondering trying to see if I could get it formally published by QLI when its done.
Yes!

Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?

!!!

If it comes out as an official product, there is a chance that Stuart Ferris, of Heaven & Earth 2 authorship, will include support for it. That would rock!

Or, let me put that more substantially. I would immediately purchase such a product.
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
It's funny you should mention that actually... I have been working on a revised UWP generation system (am currently trying to get over a few stumbling blocks at the moment). I was pondering trying to see if I could get it formally published by QLI when its done.
Yes!

Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?

!!!

If it comes out as an official product, there is a chance that Stuart Ferris, of Heaven & Earth 2 authorship, will include support for it. That would rock!

Or, let me put that more substantially. I would immediately purchase such a product.
 
Originally posted by babbage_uk:
...So, my question is this - where is the best place (in the UK) to get my hands on all that stuff?...
First suggestion: e-Bay. MegaTraveller comes up reasonably frequently in the UK and mostly goes for reasonable prices (except Knightfall and COACC which can get a bit silly).

Some one else has mentioned DriveThru if you are happy with electronic verions...

Check out BITS (http://www.asbf58.dsl.pipex.com/BITS_website/) and do try and make something like Dragonmeet 04 in London.

Travelling Man are growing fast but are thorughly decent (http://www.travellingman.com/store/index.php), or there's Spirit Games in Burton on Trent (http://www.spiritgames.com/) or a number of other FLGS around the country who may wellbe able to get hold of MegaTraveller for you...

Cheers,

Nick Middleton
 
Originally posted by babbage_uk:
...So, my question is this - where is the best place (in the UK) to get my hands on all that stuff?...
First suggestion: e-Bay. MegaTraveller comes up reasonably frequently in the UK and mostly goes for reasonable prices (except Knightfall and COACC which can get a bit silly).

Some one else has mentioned DriveThru if you are happy with electronic verions...

Check out BITS (http://www.asbf58.dsl.pipex.com/BITS_website/) and do try and make something like Dragonmeet 04 in London.

Travelling Man are growing fast but are thorughly decent (http://www.travellingman.com/store/index.php), or there's Spirit Games in Burton on Trent (http://www.spiritgames.com/) or a number of other FLGS around the country who may wellbe able to get hold of MegaTraveller for you...

Cheers,

Nick Middleton
 
Originally posted by babbage_uk:
...So, my question is this - where is the best place (in the UK) to get my hands on all that stuff?...
First suggestion: e-Bay. MegaTraveller comes up reasonably frequently in the UK and mostly goes for reasonable prices (except Knightfall and COACC which can get a bit silly).

Some one else has mentioned DriveThru if you are happy with electronic verions...

Check out BITS (http://www.asbf58.dsl.pipex.com/BITS_website/) and do try and make something like Dragonmeet 04 in London.

Travelling Man are growing fast but are thorughly decent (http://www.travellingman.com/store/index.php), or there's Spirit Games in Burton on Trent (http://www.spiritgames.com/) or a number of other FLGS around the country who may wellbe able to get hold of MegaTraveller for you...

Cheers,

Nick Middleton
 
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?
It'll use the CT system, but without the extremely big orbits (which are just silly, I think).

I should also note that we don't really know what a "realistic orbital placement" system would be ;) . Right now it looks like most systems have two or three gas giants well within 1 AU of their star, which would mean that most systems in Traveller probably wouldn't have any habitable planets at all.
And we don't really want that, do we ;)
If it comes out as an official product, there is a chance that Stuart Ferris, of Heaven & Earth 2 authorship, will include support for it. That would rock!
So long as the implementation wasn't buggy, yes it would rock ;)


Or, let me put that more substantially. I would immediately purchase such a product.
Well, I guess I'd better get cracking on it then ;) .
 
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?
It'll use the CT system, but without the extremely big orbits (which are just silly, I think).

I should also note that we don't really know what a "realistic orbital placement" system would be ;) . Right now it looks like most systems have two or three gas giants well within 1 AU of their star, which would mean that most systems in Traveller probably wouldn't have any habitable planets at all.
And we don't really want that, do we ;)
If it comes out as an official product, there is a chance that Stuart Ferris, of Heaven & Earth 2 authorship, will include support for it. That would rock!
So long as the implementation wasn't buggy, yes it would rock ;)


Or, let me put that more substantially. I would immediately purchase such a product.
Well, I guess I'd better get cracking on it then ;) .
 
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?
It'll use the CT system, but without the extremely big orbits (which are just silly, I think).

I should also note that we don't really know what a "realistic orbital placement" system would be ;) . Right now it looks like most systems have two or three gas giants well within 1 AU of their star, which would mean that most systems in Traveller probably wouldn't have any habitable planets at all.
And we don't really want that, do we ;)
If it comes out as an official product, there is a chance that Stuart Ferris, of Heaven & Earth 2 authorship, will include support for it. That would rock!
So long as the implementation wasn't buggy, yes it would rock ;)


Or, let me put that more substantially. I would immediately purchase such a product.
Well, I guess I'd better get cracking on it then ;) .
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?
It'll use the CT system, but without the extremely big orbits (which are just silly, I think).
</font>[/QUOTE]How unfortunate. Stuart Ferris, author of Heaven & Earth 2 (and World Builder Deluxe and Heaven & Earth 1 before it), says that the toughest programming feat of the entire project is getting the oribtal placement to work right. In his words, essentially, "The printed rules are broken, and not meant to actually work for anyone not using pencil and paper and fudging as they go (becasue they don't work); they certainly aren't meant to be programmed into a computer." (I'm paraphrasing his words here, not quoting direclty.) Let us also note that Jim V., author of Galactic, didn't bother to use them at all (he probably found the same problem), and invented his own system orbit-generation process.


Originally posted by Malenfant:
I should also note that we don't really know what a "realistic orbital placement" system would
Ahem! I didn't mean realistic in terms of actual cosmic accuracy. I meant realistic as in terms of a set of rules that "worked" realistically, as opposed to not working at all (see above).

Originally posted by Malenfant:
So long as the implementation wasn't buggy, yes it would rock ;)
??

H&E 2 is *titanically* better than H&E 1. It is a complete ground-up re-write of H&E 1. Stuart himself admits that the gradual add-on coded-as-he-went in bits and pieces method used to create H&E 1 (along with several upgrades that were patched on) contributed to its slowness and bugginess. He also points to the incredible difficulties in programming the orbital generation and placement systems as the main intermittent crash bugs in H&E 1. And to top that off, it was incredibly slow.

H&E 2 does not have these problems.

It is incredibly fast now (generate a whole sector in less than 5 seconds on a 533MHz machine).

The UI is great. You can cut and paste worlds between hexes, cut and paste sectors, regenerate worlds, apply TNE knock-on effects, apply alien module knock-on effects during generation, manually adjust AU distances on orbits, provides places to keep sector, subsector, and world notes. Gaaaah . . . I can't describe it all!

It is not perfect, of course (polity control is weak, very weak; but then, none of the available programs handle this well in my opinion). But it's free!

Once the final is released I think it will absolutely blow you away.

Here, look at this dot-map of the Imperium and a sector map of Corridor, both produced by H&E.

Imperial Dot Map (180kb)
Heaven & Earth 2: Galaxy Module Beta: Imperium Dot-Map

Corridor Sector (210kb)
Heaven & Earth 2: Sector Module Beta: Corridor

Note carefully the "clock" style world colors, part green, part blue, indicating visually the percentage of land vs. water (all blue = water world; all green = desert; empty circle = asteroid belt). Yes, there are no borders (that part of the Sector Module is as yet not implemented).
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?
It'll use the CT system, but without the extremely big orbits (which are just silly, I think).
</font>[/QUOTE]How unfortunate. Stuart Ferris, author of Heaven & Earth 2 (and World Builder Deluxe and Heaven & Earth 1 before it), says that the toughest programming feat of the entire project is getting the oribtal placement to work right. In his words, essentially, "The printed rules are broken, and not meant to actually work for anyone not using pencil and paper and fudging as they go (becasue they don't work); they certainly aren't meant to be programmed into a computer." (I'm paraphrasing his words here, not quoting direclty.) Let us also note that Jim V., author of Galactic, didn't bother to use them at all (he probably found the same problem), and invented his own system orbit-generation process.


Originally posted by Malenfant:
I should also note that we don't really know what a "realistic orbital placement" system would
Ahem! I didn't mean realistic in terms of actual cosmic accuracy. I meant realistic as in terms of a set of rules that "worked" realistically, as opposed to not working at all (see above).

Originally posted by Malenfant:
So long as the implementation wasn't buggy, yes it would rock ;)
??

H&E 2 is *titanically* better than H&E 1. It is a complete ground-up re-write of H&E 1. Stuart himself admits that the gradual add-on coded-as-he-went in bits and pieces method used to create H&E 1 (along with several upgrades that were patched on) contributed to its slowness and bugginess. He also points to the incredible difficulties in programming the orbital generation and placement systems as the main intermittent crash bugs in H&E 1. And to top that off, it was incredibly slow.

H&E 2 does not have these problems.

It is incredibly fast now (generate a whole sector in less than 5 seconds on a 533MHz machine).

The UI is great. You can cut and paste worlds between hexes, cut and paste sectors, regenerate worlds, apply TNE knock-on effects, apply alien module knock-on effects during generation, manually adjust AU distances on orbits, provides places to keep sector, subsector, and world notes. Gaaaah . . . I can't describe it all!

It is not perfect, of course (polity control is weak, very weak; but then, none of the available programs handle this well in my opinion). But it's free!

Once the final is released I think it will absolutely blow you away.

Here, look at this dot-map of the Imperium and a sector map of Corridor, both produced by H&E.

Imperial Dot Map (180kb)
Heaven & Earth 2: Galaxy Module Beta: Imperium Dot-Map

Corridor Sector (210kb)
Heaven & Earth 2: Sector Module Beta: Corridor

Note carefully the "clock" style world colors, part green, part blue, indicating visually the percentage of land vs. water (all blue = water world; all green = desert; empty circle = asteroid belt). Yes, there are no borders (that part of the Sector Module is as yet not implemented).
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Will it include realistic oribital placement systems, too?
It'll use the CT system, but without the extremely big orbits (which are just silly, I think).
</font>[/QUOTE]How unfortunate. Stuart Ferris, author of Heaven & Earth 2 (and World Builder Deluxe and Heaven & Earth 1 before it), says that the toughest programming feat of the entire project is getting the oribtal placement to work right. In his words, essentially, "The printed rules are broken, and not meant to actually work for anyone not using pencil and paper and fudging as they go (becasue they don't work); they certainly aren't meant to be programmed into a computer." (I'm paraphrasing his words here, not quoting direclty.) Let us also note that Jim V., author of Galactic, didn't bother to use them at all (he probably found the same problem), and invented his own system orbit-generation process.


Originally posted by Malenfant:
I should also note that we don't really know what a "realistic orbital placement" system would
Ahem! I didn't mean realistic in terms of actual cosmic accuracy. I meant realistic as in terms of a set of rules that "worked" realistically, as opposed to not working at all (see above).

Originally posted by Malenfant:
So long as the implementation wasn't buggy, yes it would rock ;)
??

H&E 2 is *titanically* better than H&E 1. It is a complete ground-up re-write of H&E 1. Stuart himself admits that the gradual add-on coded-as-he-went in bits and pieces method used to create H&E 1 (along with several upgrades that were patched on) contributed to its slowness and bugginess. He also points to the incredible difficulties in programming the orbital generation and placement systems as the main intermittent crash bugs in H&E 1. And to top that off, it was incredibly slow.

H&E 2 does not have these problems.

It is incredibly fast now (generate a whole sector in less than 5 seconds on a 533MHz machine).

The UI is great. You can cut and paste worlds between hexes, cut and paste sectors, regenerate worlds, apply TNE knock-on effects, apply alien module knock-on effects during generation, manually adjust AU distances on orbits, provides places to keep sector, subsector, and world notes. Gaaaah . . . I can't describe it all!

It is not perfect, of course (polity control is weak, very weak; but then, none of the available programs handle this well in my opinion). But it's free!

Once the final is released I think it will absolutely blow you away.

Here, look at this dot-map of the Imperium and a sector map of Corridor, both produced by H&E.

Imperial Dot Map (180kb)
Heaven & Earth 2: Galaxy Module Beta: Imperium Dot-Map

Corridor Sector (210kb)
Heaven & Earth 2: Sector Module Beta: Corridor

Note carefully the "clock" style world colors, part green, part blue, indicating visually the percentage of land vs. water (all blue = water world; all green = desert; empty circle = asteroid belt). Yes, there are no borders (that part of the Sector Module is as yet not implemented).
 
I have to admit I gave up designing world P'n'P when HE1 came out (I just modified the random generation to suit my needs) - but HE2 - wow, it looks very nice - has any world gen stuff been beta'd yet - if so whats it like!

As to MT in UK - ebay has to be the first port of call - but DGP stuff always goes for big bucks (well pounds, actually)
!
 
I have to admit I gave up designing world P'n'P when HE1 came out (I just modified the random generation to suit my needs) - but HE2 - wow, it looks very nice - has any world gen stuff been beta'd yet - if so whats it like!

As to MT in UK - ebay has to be the first port of call - but DGP stuff always goes for big bucks (well pounds, actually)
!
 
I have to admit I gave up designing world P'n'P when HE1 came out (I just modified the random generation to suit my needs) - but HE2 - wow, it looks very nice - has any world gen stuff been beta'd yet - if so whats it like!

As to MT in UK - ebay has to be the first port of call - but DGP stuff always goes for big bucks (well pounds, actually)
!
 
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Stuart Ferris, author of Heaven & Earth 2 (and World Builder Deluxe and Heaven & Earth 1 before it), says that the toughest programming feat of the entire project is getting the oribtal placement to work right. In his words, essentially, "The printed rules are broken, and not meant to actually work for anyone not using pencil and paper and fudging as they go (becasue they don't work); they certainly aren't meant to be programmed into a computer." (I'm paraphrasing his words here, not quoting direclty.) Let us also note that Jim V., author of Galactic, didn't bother to use them at all (he probably found the same problem), and invented his own system orbit-generation process.
I'm a bit puzzled here. What's so difficult about implementing the CT orbital placement system? It's a fairly straightforward set of numbers.


nbsp;Ahem! I didn't mean realistic in terms of actual cosmic accuracy. I meant realistic as in terms of a set of rules that "worked" realistically, as opposed to not working at all (see above).
Again, I'm perplexed. How does it not "work"?


H&E 2 does not have these problems.
Then I'd be interested to see it. I presume it's not officially been released in any form yet though, yes?


It is incredibly fast now (generate a whole sector in less than 5 seconds on a 533MHz machine).
People still use those slowpokes? ;)


The UI is great. You can cut and paste worlds between hexes, cut and paste sectors, regenerate worlds, apply TNE knock-on effects, apply alien module knock-on effects during generation, manually adjust AU distances on orbits, provides places to keep sector, subsector, and world notes. Gaaaah . . . I can't describe it all!
Sounds promising...

Still. Call me a weirdo, but I think generating a whole sector (probably plus all the other bodies in each system) in a few minutes takes all the fun out of it ;) .
 
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Stuart Ferris, author of Heaven & Earth 2 (and World Builder Deluxe and Heaven & Earth 1 before it), says that the toughest programming feat of the entire project is getting the oribtal placement to work right. In his words, essentially, "The printed rules are broken, and not meant to actually work for anyone not using pencil and paper and fudging as they go (becasue they don't work); they certainly aren't meant to be programmed into a computer." (I'm paraphrasing his words here, not quoting direclty.) Let us also note that Jim V., author of Galactic, didn't bother to use them at all (he probably found the same problem), and invented his own system orbit-generation process.
I'm a bit puzzled here. What's so difficult about implementing the CT orbital placement system? It's a fairly straightforward set of numbers.


nbsp;Ahem! I didn't mean realistic in terms of actual cosmic accuracy. I meant realistic as in terms of a set of rules that "worked" realistically, as opposed to not working at all (see above).
Again, I'm perplexed. How does it not "work"?


H&E 2 does not have these problems.
Then I'd be interested to see it. I presume it's not officially been released in any form yet though, yes?


It is incredibly fast now (generate a whole sector in less than 5 seconds on a 533MHz machine).
People still use those slowpokes? ;)


The UI is great. You can cut and paste worlds between hexes, cut and paste sectors, regenerate worlds, apply TNE knock-on effects, apply alien module knock-on effects during generation, manually adjust AU distances on orbits, provides places to keep sector, subsector, and world notes. Gaaaah . . . I can't describe it all!
Sounds promising...

Still. Call me a weirdo, but I think generating a whole sector (probably plus all the other bodies in each system) in a few minutes takes all the fun out of it ;) .
 
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
Stuart Ferris, author of Heaven & Earth 2 (and World Builder Deluxe and Heaven & Earth 1 before it), says that the toughest programming feat of the entire project is getting the oribtal placement to work right. In his words, essentially, "The printed rules are broken, and not meant to actually work for anyone not using pencil and paper and fudging as they go (becasue they don't work); they certainly aren't meant to be programmed into a computer." (I'm paraphrasing his words here, not quoting direclty.) Let us also note that Jim V., author of Galactic, didn't bother to use them at all (he probably found the same problem), and invented his own system orbit-generation process.
I'm a bit puzzled here. What's so difficult about implementing the CT orbital placement system? It's a fairly straightforward set of numbers.


nbsp;Ahem! I didn't mean realistic in terms of actual cosmic accuracy. I meant realistic as in terms of a set of rules that "worked" realistically, as opposed to not working at all (see above).
Again, I'm perplexed. How does it not "work"?


H&E 2 does not have these problems.
Then I'd be interested to see it. I presume it's not officially been released in any form yet though, yes?


It is incredibly fast now (generate a whole sector in less than 5 seconds on a 533MHz machine).
People still use those slowpokes? ;)


The UI is great. You can cut and paste worlds between hexes, cut and paste sectors, regenerate worlds, apply TNE knock-on effects, apply alien module knock-on effects during generation, manually adjust AU distances on orbits, provides places to keep sector, subsector, and world notes. Gaaaah . . . I can't describe it all!
Sounds promising...

Still. Call me a weirdo, but I think generating a whole sector (probably plus all the other bodies in each system) in a few minutes takes all the fun out of it ;) .
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
Right now it looks like most systems have two or three gas giants well within 1 AU of their star, which would mean that most systems in Traveller probably wouldn't have any habitable planets at all.
Though watch your selection bias there. If you look at the (admittedly very few) worlds detected with methods other than radial velocity, the incidence of close-in gas giants goes way down.
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
Right now it looks like most systems have two or three gas giants well within 1 AU of their star, which would mean that most systems in Traveller probably wouldn't have any habitable planets at all.
Though watch your selection bias there. If you look at the (admittedly very few) worlds detected with methods other than radial velocity, the incidence of close-in gas giants goes way down.
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
Right now it looks like most systems have two or three gas giants well within 1 AU of their star, which would mean that most systems in Traveller probably wouldn't have any habitable planets at all.
Though watch your selection bias there. If you look at the (admittedly very few) worlds detected with methods other than radial velocity, the incidence of close-in gas giants goes way down.
 
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