What do the pseudo-French speak?

[rancke]

The language spoken in the Clasic Era that is the lineal descendant of English is called Anglic (or Galanglic). I'm not sure its official, but I've been referring to the language that is descended from German as Germanic. Now, to stay in that mode, what would you call the language that is descended from French? Frankic? Frenchic? Franconic? Something else? Nothing I can come up with sounds likely. Well, maybe Franconic...


Hans

 

[far-trader]

Francaisic? Parlez vous Francaisic?

I've never really figured there were other pan-stellar variations of root languages. Perhaps a bit Anglocentric of me. I always figured that English, the bastard rapist of all languages, made sense as Galanglic, while the other languages (if they survived, or enjoyed a renaissance) were still true to their roots.

I'm not sure Galanglic would be a lineal descendant of English. I think it would be truer to its history and borrow extensively from every language it encountered and over that much time be unrecognizable to us today. Think Shakespearean English to today for a short (time) view comparison, then add multiple alien worlds as well instead of just a couple European nations

So, imtu, there is no English as we of today would recognize it. Galanglic would be as foreign to me as ancient Sumerian. While the German spoken in the far future would still be understood by yourself. Likewise all the other languages.

For what my take is of help to you

 

[aramis]

Neofrankish, or just Frankish, as the language of the Franks historically was Frankish. Possibly Francish.

And I suspect, due to the sudden slowdown of linguistic change in the last 200 years, that we'd see english much as modern greeks do Koine: they can make some sense of it, often erroneously, and can easily read it aloud pretty closely. Unless, of course, as in Bujold's Barrayar, a new alphabet has been adopted. (Barrayar uses Cyrillic for Anglic)

 

[Lycanorukke]

I suspect the main reason for the slowdown is that the various languages have swiped what they need from each other until now and they have no new 'victims'.

But with the Trav timeline there was the interstellar wars period where Anglic (the 'offical navy language') would have mugged Old Vilani and stolen loose vocabulary from it. Another would have been just after the long night where a thousand years of 'language drift' across hundreds of planets was now mashed together into 'Modern Gangalic'.

 

[boomslang]

Now, to stay in that mode, what would you call the language that is descended from French?

It would be called Français; bear in mind that the modern French government -- for reasons of both national cultural pride and consistency in international law -- explicitly maintains an "official" linguistic standard with enough precision to make a Bwap swoon and enough conservatism to make a Vilani hang his head in shame... and the French can get quite passionate about any affronts to the purity of their language.

In the distant future, either the language would be lovingly and obnoxiously preserved with only slight amendments, or French culture will have died out entirely from excesses of caffeine and nicotine.


:smirk:

 

[aramis]

I suspect the main reason for the slowdown is that the various languages have swiped what they need from each other until now and they have no new 'victims'.

But with the Trav timeline there was the interstellar wars period where Anglic (the 'offical navy language') would have mugged Old Vilani and stolen loose vocabulary from it. Another would have been just after the long night where a thousand years of 'language drift' across hundreds of planets was now mashed together into 'Modern Gangalic'.

I suspect a lot more has to do with widespread literacy, and less to do with borrowed words.

After all, where the literate class all shared a language, the common languages they spoke remained closer.
EG:
France, Spain, Italy: the vernaculars are till mutually intelligible each other and latin; England, germany, the low countries, and scandinavia, not so...
Most of the slavic lands where Orthodoxy held sway, the pan-slavic synthetic language Church Slavonic was used by the literate for more than prayer... and it served to reduce drift considerably.
Chinese drift has been considerably less than would be expected; written Qin is supposedly still intelligible, tho' its child languages have drifted spoken to unintelligibility.

 

[rust]

I would also think that Francais would still be Francais, the language is at
the very core of the French culture, and the part of it that is least likely
to change.

A small problem with Franconian and Frankish would be that Franconia is a
German region, in northern Bavaria (the capital is Nuremberg), and Frankish
is the German dialect spoken there.

As for Germanic, that would be a step backwards, because Germanic is the
language modern German (Deutsch in German) was developed from. Anglic
speakers could of course call a future Deutsch "Germanic", but the future
Germans would probably consider this as pejorative.

 

[chrisr]

How about Gallic? or even Galgallic!!

 

[splicer]

Hello, and some thoughts.

Greets, all. I'm kinda new here, I promise I'll go introduce myself in the proper forum soon! I've been lurking for a few days, researching some ideas for a stomping ground which will include the Strend Cluster, The Federation of Garrone, and a francophone or two. So, I felt the need to jump into this thread since I've already been kicking around a few ideas on this subject and would love to hear more from you folks too.

Now, to stay in that mode, what would you call the language that is descended from French?
Hans

Fransaic?

It would be called Français; bear in mind that the modern French government -- for reasons of both national cultural pride and consistency in international law -- explicitly maintains an "official" linguistic standard with enough precision to make a Bwap swoon and enough conservatism to make a Vilani hang his head in shame... and the French can get quite passionate about any affronts to the purity of their language.
:smirk:

This may very well be the case, especially in areas with a multiworld francophone polity. French-Solomoni in the Confederation might have a double dose of cultural pride in this regard. It's possible they would continue to call their language Français and defend it against vulgarisms more than speakers from elsewhere. In that case, Anglic speakers would probably call it and its speaker French. Or perhaps, playfully or not, Frenchy. Farther away from Terra or the Confed, some Villainized variant of the term might arise. Or, did I already propose Fransaic?

From my notes, here are some possible variants (1):

Terran Confederation; Métropolitain or Français Terrien.
Third Imperium; Galactique or Français Impérial. (2)
Strend Cluster/Menorial; Dupacte (3) or Français Strendien.
The Islands Clusters/Reft; Îlois or Français Insulaires.
The Federation of Garrone/Beyond; Garronien or Français Garronien

Vilani megacorporations instill Vilani culture in their employees. Solomani corps might as well? Hortalez et Cie is at least half French? Others? I also think that everyone on the above list would refer to the language they personally speak as Français and refer only to the other variants by the above names, whereas Anglic/Galanglic speakers might call it all Fransaic or French or what have you.

Just my Cr0.02. Feel free to cherry pick. Any other areas where some sort of French might be spoken? Is there much cannon for any of this, other than what's implied by Solomani colonization? I think I read somewhere that there are a few speakers on the Irklan's homeworld, but I imagine that might just be some sort of Créole. Any French speaking CotI members still around? I noticed there was some discussion a few years back about a French CT translation, but I don't think any of those folks continued posting after their project fell through.

France, Spain, Italy: the vernaculars are till mutually intelligible each other and latin; England, germany, the low countries, and scandinavia, not so...

I was under the impression that Swedes and Norwegians (maybe others?) can understand each other's spoken languages fairly well, but to easily read another Nordic variant is a different story. Late literacy, along with independent scholastic decisions about spelling concerns, would explain the written differences. I imagine something similar - for slightly different reasons - might happen between Imperial Galanglic speakers using a Vilani script and Terran Galanglic speakers still using the Latin alphabet. (4) They could probably communicate just fine until somebody wrote a note. "Wait.. what? Aggghhh! What the hell does this say? And where is my transcomp? WHAT DOES THIS SAY AND WHERE IS MY TRANSCOMP?!!"

Cheers,
Chris


1. Keep in mind that I don't speak French IRL.
2. Francophone Confeds might call it something more colorful, say, "Français de la sale p*tes?" Perhaps I go too far.
3. Short for Français du pacte de Strend. The Pact is no more, but the name might stick.
4. Confed Solomani might also speak a form of Anglic not so defiled with Vilani vulgarities, but here I'm speaking of Galanglic. Plus, I realize now that you did make a distinction by refering to Scandinavia as a whole vs English, German, et al.

P.S. Sorry about the novel. Probably should have broken this up into seperate posts.

 

[far-trader]

Welcome aboard splicer

No worries about the post length, it's fine (short by some standards ), and a good contribution. Looking forward to more.

 

[Gadrin]

Remulakian ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coneheads

>

 

[splicer]

Welcome aboard splicer

No worries about the post length, it's fine (short by some standards ), and a good contribution. Looking forward to more.

Thanks, Dan. Nice to meet you!

An addition to the list, and some quick thoughts:

Terran Confederation; Métropolitain or Français Terrien.
Third Imperium; Galactique or Français Impérial.
Strend Cluster/Menorial; Dupacte or Français Strendien.
The Islands Clusters/Reft; Îlois or Français Insulaires.
The Federation of Garrone/Beyond; Garronien or Français Garronien

Third Reformed French Confederate Republic; Républicain or Français Terrien

I goofed and wrote Terran Confederation instead of Solomoni, but I think I'll leave it as being a historical variety, or something.

Also, I wanted to add that perhaps in the 3I, the language might be held together by something like "L'Académie Française Galactique." The Authentic movement might have led to a growth in the number of francophones, as well. Maybe as more Imperials of French descent became interested in their roots, they would turn to such an organization. Or the organization, dismayed by the DIY nature of such a movement leading to poorly understood and spoken versions of Fransaic proliferating, might have stepped up to provide language instruction and other cultural services.

Again all this is speculation on my part. Hans, you seem to have given this cultural stuff a lot of thought ( and have written professionally on the same). I'm wondering if you had something specific in mind regarding the far future French when you made the OP, or if you were just wondering aloud for something IYTU. I ask because there doesn't seem to be a lot of official info on the topic, yet there are a few French polities in the OTU. Maybe I should start a seperate IMTU or IISS topic later when I have a little more time? I dunno how to proceed or which forum is best. I'm kiinda new here.

 

[Easterner9504]

French

I agree with Boomslang. There is even a French Cluster in the OutRim Void. (Splicer so mentioned) The evilest world is of course Allemagne!!!

 

[Maladominus]

Now, to stay in that mode, what would you call the language that is descended from French? Frankic? Frenchic? Franconic? Something else?

"La langue de la 276th République" ...... would be their official language.

Lord knows... they require a new republic every 30 years or so.

 

[Trent]

Belgian. Just like Hercule Poirot.

 

[splicer]

There is even a French Cluster in the OutRim Void. (Splicer so mentioned)

Yep. I should also mention that said cluster is not canon, AFAIK (although fun! ). I'm just speculating for MTU based on these non-canon sources:

Mike Jackson. "Menorial Subsector." Third Imperium Fanzine. #11. Mike Jackson, 1988. 8.
James Holden, Mike Jackson, and Clayton R. Bush. "Trojan Reach." Travellers' Digest. #20. DGP, 1990. 29-34.
Peter Gray's Trojan Reaches @ BARD/OPAL

(TD#20 might be canon, IDK. No details of the Cluster are given, though. Just UWPs and a map.)

Garrone also is non-canon AFAIK. My source here is Pete Gray's Beyond Library @ BARD/OPAL. (I think it might be on a canon map, again without details.)

The Islands Clusters are canon (A5: Trillion Credit Squadron; but I don't have the source material, yet). Traveller Wiki says they were settled by pre-jump colony ships from the European Space Agency. This, plus the large number of French world names, leads me to assume French is spoken on some worlds.

But, further elaboration really is fodder for seperate threads. I'm not trying to pull this thread too far OT (honest!), I just mention these locations because of the language connections implied by the OP.

 

[splicer]

BTW, "Fransaic" is just my spelling variation on Far-Trader's "Françaisic", and is also informed by Boomslang and Rust. French might drift less than English (cultural pride), francophones might say "Français", and Galanglic might anglicize this and add "-ic". But...

Remulakian ?

...this one has merit. Très drôle! :rofl:

A+

 

[su_liam]

Quebecoise?

 

[Jame]

What does Allons-y mean, anyways?

 

[kafka47]

Let's go...is the translation of the above. While I cannot claim fluency (too many bad French teachers after Official Bilingualism was pronounced) I can claim compendency. Which leads me to the original point.

French, like how English becomes Anglic would undergo changes by the time we reach the 57th century that la mere langue would be vastly simplified. Furthermore, I would speculate that we would see many infusions of African languages as France becomes more dependant upon its African colonies in the Interstellar Wars era. It would also become more diffuse with the languages of the European Union. However, it being French, it would have a High Tongue (reserved for diplomatic protocal); Middle Tongue (language of intellectuals and other cultured types) and then a proliferation of dialects. Each world would claim to be speaking the original but the linguistic drift combined with the pressures of Anglic, Vilani and the other cultural regions would make French harder to sustain itself.

What I could also see an adoption of a pidgin French as a dominant language on certain worlds or even an archaic French, as a defence against the encroachment of Anglic. It would depend upon the settlement patterns of each world.

What would be interesting is how the adoption of Anglic within the Second & Third Imperium would effect/affect languages like French. I would see a vast simplification taking place in order to bootstrap fledging Solomani based colonies.