VehicleMaker: Notes, Tips & Tricks

[Reban]

I started a similar thread in the old secret T5 forum to discuss ways of using VehicleMaker. Some of what is below are reposts from that now that everyone can see them, and some are new ideas.

Everything below is within the rules but pushes the envelope of what can be done. Anything that is outside the rules I'll mark as Houserules.

I'm interested in constructive criticism and your own discoveries and houserules. Once I'm satisfied that there are no major mistakes or pitfalls in my own work I'll compile it as a pdf and post it in the File Library.


In the meantime: Gearheads! Technical pens, at the ready! Go!

 

[Reban]

Removing automatic Weapons Mounts

I’ll kick off with something I’ve noticed about the Military Vehicles.


Tanks, Carriers and Vehicles all get “automatic” weapons mounts according to the notes on the Military Vehicles Table on p.298.

Tank
A Tank hull displaces 5 dtons and automatically installs ONE Turret Mount and ONE Vehicle Mount at no cost. A Tank hull has no Load.

If you remove both Mounts you get 2dtons of Load. This space could be used for 10 dismountable troops reflecting a real world vehicle like the Namer APC which is based on the Merkava tank chassis.

Those 2dtons could be used for a Workstation or Workbench (p.629) to create an armored Recovery Vehicle.

Install a Clinic (p.347) in those 2dtons and you have an Armored Ambulance or Armored Medical Aid Post.


Carrier
A Carrier hull displaces 4 dtons and automatically installs ONE Turret Mount at no cost. A Carrier hull has 2 dtons Load. A tracked Carrier might be equivalent to a Bradley IFV. Remove the Turret Mount to retrieve an extra 1 dton of Load from the hull.

Make it a Lite vehicle and you end up with a 3 dton tracked Carrier with 2 dtons Load (10 dismounts), which approximates an M113 APC.


Vehicle
I’m not really sure that Vehicle deserves a Fixed Mount. It seems to me to more properly belong to the Weapon descriptor on the same table. Fixed Mounts represent turrets for large caliber artillery or erector arms for ballistic missiles, in general weapons systems over 1000kg. Removing the Fixed Mount frees up 1 dton of Load, which gives you a 2 dton hull with 2 dton of Load. This could form the basis of anything from a Bren Carrier (Tracked descriptor) or a military air/raft.

Removing these automatic Mounts does not affect cost because they are free, and there is no alteration of the basic hull, because essentially what you’re doing is gutting all the internal mechanism and equipment meant to carry the weapon.


Comments and critiques welcome.

 

[Reban]

Remote Weapons Stations

Remote Weapons Stations

One of the technological solutions that has emerged since the last edition of Traveller has been the Remote Weapons Station now commonly seen on all sorts of armored vehicles. Wikipedia defines an RWS as “A remote weapon station, also known as a remote weapon system, (RWS) is a remotely operated weaponized system for light and medium caliber weapons which can be installed on ground combat vehicle or sea and air-based combat platforms. Such equipment is used on modern military vehicles, as it allows a gunner to remain in the relative protection of the vehicle. It may also be retrofitted onto existing vehicles”.

GunMaker provides us with the descriptor “Remote” and says “The weapon is designed to be emplaced or installed in a location at some distance from the operator, or emplaced to operate independently. Remote weapons are controlled by a Designator and traverse to track a target which is being designated. The operator can trigger a fire signal from the Designator.

Most RWS systems include optics. To reflect this I’d include an Electronic Sight on the Remote weapon and have it send the sight picture to the gunner/operators control console.

So you can use a weapon with the remote descriptor as a RWS by fitting it to a vehicle. Obviously the RWS should have one crew member designated as the gunner/operator. Going strictly by the rules this gunner or operator should have a designator but can a vehicle sensor be used in place of the designator? I think from reading the description in GunMaker. I think so as it infers the Designator is a handheld or portable device used by a forward observer on foot.

The RWS can also represent a number of types of small remote turret as well. Such as a helicopter gunship’s chin turret or defensive counter measures launchers. Anything over 200kg however requires a Weapons Mount.

 

[Reban]

Houserule: Crew served weapons

Crew served weapons

Weapons mounts contain all the mechanical infrastructure for mounting big weapons systems in, or on the vehicle hull, but do you really install a one ton weapons mount for every personal or crew served weapon? Does a 50cal Machinegun need a weapons mount? I don’t think so, so I’m offering the following houserule:

Weapons that mass less than 200kg do not require a Weapons Mount (If the sum of all the weapons installed goes above 200kg you must install a Weapons Mount). Weapons mounted in this way are considered to be pintle mounted or in open ring mounts. To fire or use a weapon one crew member or passenger must be free to control the weapon. An alternate mounting might be fixed to the chassis, in which case the vehicle driver or operator may control the weapon.

 

[Reban]

Houserule: Trailers

Trailers

Something missing from VehicleMaker is a method for designing trailers. Here’s my take on it.

Code	Descriptor	TL	Tons	Speed	Load	    KCr
TLR	Trailer        -	  2	    -	      2	    10

Rules:
You may apply any Mission from Table G Ground Vehicles or Table M Military Vehicles.

You must apply a Motive descriptor from either of these tables. Speed becomes maximum safe towing speed.

From Table 12 Vehicle Enhancers you may apply any Bulk modifier and any Environ modifier.

From Options you may apply: Weapons Mount, Luxury, Passenger Module, Cargo Module, or Off Road.

Trailers take their Speed rating from the towing Vehicle.

Grav and Lift vehicle may only tow Grav and Lift Trailers.


I’m leaving out Stage effects because trailer technology doesn’t vary as much as other vehicles.
Question for you: Should a trailer impose a penalty to Speed? Say Speed -1?

 

[Reban]

The Tank Crew Rule

Bumping with something that was controversial the first time I mentioned it. expanded and better explained (I hope).

The Tank Crew Rule

p287 Standard or larger can carry operators and passengers equal to tonnage. But, A Tank has a crew equal to its tonnage divided by 2.

A Standard Tracked Tank is TL7, 7 tons and Speed 4 (30kph) with a vehicle mount and a turret mount (I'd see this as 2tons of turret and 5 tons of hull).

So 7tons/2 = 3.5 crew or a crew of 3 or 4 (I’d leave it up to the designer).
I have no problem with this result. It describes quiet well most Main Battle Tanks designed in the 1960’s, 70’s and 80’s. For example the M1 produced in 1979 displaces 6.5 tons* has a max speed of 67km/h (Speed 5**). Crew is 4 a driver, commander, gunner and loader.

The Russian T-80 built 1976 is 5.5tons has a max speed of 70km/h (Speed 5). Crew is 3, Driver, Commander Gunner.


*Interestingly to get this displacement I had to use the length over the main gun, leading me to conclude displacement tonnage in VehicleMaker includes the volume that a weapon traverses through.

** This is okay because the Vehicle Operations Table on p290 says the driver can travel at Speed +1 at one Difficulty Level higher. I interpret this as absolute maximum speed.


Okay so the Tank Crew rule works fine for Standard Tracked Tanks. A quick look at Improved Tracked Tanks would make them 6tons and TL9. That’s fair enough for current design trends that look for lighter, smaller platforms with reduced crew requirements. A Very Early Tracked Tank is TL5 and 8tons. Most 1930’s tanks, Char B, Sherman, Churchill, were around the 3-4ton displacement mark so probably need to be given the Light descriptor, but as most of these tanks had 4 crew the Tank Crew rule breaks down for them. It might make a better fit to design these early tanks as Carriers or Weapon Carriers The German Panther is about 6.6ton but 4 crew, The Maus is 10ton but 6 crew. The British TOG1 is 7tons with 8 crew! From these last two we can say that a Very Early Tracked Tank maps to a class of real world tanks called super heavy tanks.


If we try to recreate the 2crew (driver, commander/gunner) 10ton TL15 Trepida Grav Tank we might end up with something like this: Improved Very Heavy Grav Tank with the High Powered option which is TL15 and 12tons with Speed 4 (30km/h). Not an impressive mover, it might be more effective to design it as a Flyer and add armor, something for a future post. The point is a 12 tons according to the Tank Crew rule there are 6 crew (12tons/2= 6crew). Six crew members seems a lot to me for a very advanced piece of technology. We obviously have a driver, a commander, a gunner and three others?

It has been pointed out to me that the more crew you have the better your situational awareness will be. You might say that for every Weapons Mount fitted you should have one gunner, but the commander and driver can both fire weapons and an additional gunner can control more than one weapons system. Robot brains, proximeters and Visors or Holovisors can improve situational awareness for a reduced crew.

So coming to the point of this post:

A Tank is not a Tank

If I say Tank to you, you may imagine an M1 Abrams or a Sherman. In T5 VehicleMaker terms a Tank is an armored hull with two weapons mounts. It emphasises armor, and the volume available in other hull or chassis types for passenger is taken up with this armor and protections. This is the origin of the Tank Crew rule but there are two ways to interpret it. 1). The derived Tank Crew is the required crew for the vehicle, or 2) derived Tank Crew is the maximum amount of sophonts that can fit in the available volume. I recommend the second interpretation as it gives the designer greater lee-way when it comes to assigning crew responsibilities. Every high TL vehicle is still going to have a driver, a tank will have a commander (who might also act as gunner), a gunner for the main weapon, sensor operators and dismounts or passengers. For example in my Trepida analogue above the 2 extra crew positions could be passengers or in a Command Tank variant they could be a commander and signaler.


I hope there are some useful things in this post, particularly that the VehicleMaker “Tank” type goes beyond the traditional idea of a tank, and that the Tank Crew figure is a maximum not a required figure.



Next up will be Armored Flyers: An alternate way of designing Grav Tanks.

 

[Murdoc]

Another reason why some RL examples might have more crew than the T5 rules would normally say could be bad QREBS, particularly Ease of Use. I'm just picturing some of those early designs needing more tasks to keep running, and they automatically come with a lower EOU, being early designs. So one could say, for example, EOU penalties result in higher crew requirements (maybe one per), and possibly the opposite for positive EOU, explained with the inclusion of better controls, computers, brains, etc.

Man I love QREBS. Best rules in T5.

 

[Reban]

Another reason why some RL examples might have more crew than the T5 rules would normally say could be bad QREBS, particularly Ease of Use. I'm just picturing some of those early designs needing more tasks to keep running, and they automatically come with a lower EOU, being early designs. So one could say, for example, EOU penalties result in higher crew requirements (maybe one per), and possibly the opposite for positive EOU, explained with the inclusion of better controls, computers, brains, etc.

Man I love QREBS. Best rules in T5.

Oh that's good. I can see some of the very early tanks having poor EOU and requiring a co-driver to help pull the steering levers. Poor Reliability might indicate the need to have a mechanic in the crew. High Bulk might prevent a vehicle from using normal bridges or modify a bridge crossing task.

Great input Murdoc.

 

[Reban]

An alternate design route to Grav Tanks

An alternate design route to Grav Tanks


An important lesson to learn with all the Makers in T5 is that just because the Maker produces an item with a particular Long Name doesn’t mean you can’t call it something else entirely and employ it to fill a niche in your game.

Going back to CT Book 4 Mercenary we find Grav Tank being introduced at late TL9 and by TL10 “Track-laying tanks are now completely supplanted by grav tanks and lighter wheeled armored fighting vehicles”.

In T5 Standard Grav Tanks are TL10, 4tons and Speed 5 (50kph) Armor 50. We could also do Lift Tanks at TL9 but they’d be a bit slow. Compared to other editions Grav Tanks that are 10-12tons and fast our standard Grav Tank looks small and slow. We can improve it by making it Heavy or VHeavy but only at the expense of Speed, requiring us to take options such as High Powered or Fast which in turn eat away any extra Load we’ve gained that could be used for more weapons mounts.

Again CT Mercenary gives us some guidance here. It says that at TL9-10 the roles of Grav Tanks and Battlefield Attack Helicopters start to merge, with Grav Vehicles of all kinds starting to dominate the battle space from the ground to close orbit so that by TL12 “All vehicles have sufficient free-flight performance that ground combat vehicles effectively no longer exist, having merged with aircraft.”

So lets kick the Tank type to one side a pursue that higher tech bigger faster “Grav Tank” found in other sources. Let’s try building the TL15 10ton Trepida from the post above based on an armored Flyer chassis.

We can build a Standard Grav Attack/Combat Flyer at TL12 and 18tons, Speed5 (50kph) Armor 20, Load 6

Lets make it a Light version and it becomes Light Combat Flyer TL11 9tons Speed6 (100kph) Armor 10 Load 5.

Its about the right size but barely protected. Its standard speed is 100kph but this can be increased by the pilot taking one extra level of difficultly in tasks to 300kph.

Trepida’s are TL15 but we need to increase armor so let’s leave the Stage at Standard and give it the UpArmored option so that we get:

Light Combat Flyer TL14 11tons Speed6 (100kph) Armor 70 Load 5.

Now to make it closer to a Tank we have to install at least two Weapons Mounts, in fact we have room for four and the High Powered option.

Our final “High Trepida Grav Tank” looks like this:

Light Combat Flyer TL15 12tons Speed7 (300kph) Armor 70 Weapons Mounts 4
Crew/Passengers: 2 max call it Pilot and Commander/WO.

Compared to “Low Trepida Grav Tank” designed in the post above:

VHeavy Grav Tank TL15 12tons Speed4 (30kph) Armor150 Weapons Mounts 2
Crew: 6max call it 2 +4 jump seats.


At this point you should glance at p291 Terrain Effects to see that both Grav Ground Vehicles and Grav Flyers can operate in a range of terrain types, in fact Flyers seem to have an Easy task operating at altitudes <5 meters while Grav Ground Vehicles have a Staggering task to operate in terrain types that most combat operations would take place in.

My High Trepida is fast, heavily armed but vulnerable. It can operate near the surface or in orbit at 300kph. It has a pilot and a commander that acts as weapons operator. the pilot might also have control of some or all of the weapons systems.

My Low Trepida is slow, well-armed and very well armored. It tends to hug the surface and likes to skim along the highway at 30kph. It has a driver and a commander/gunner and can transport a fire-team or a commander and a forward observer.


I’ve always liked the idea that Grav Tanks can drop from orbit, fly NOE to find its target like an attack helicopter then engage it with the main armament like an MBT then re-position itself somewhere on the planet at high speed as the situation dictates so I like my High Trepida but there is also a place for my Low Trepida on the battlefield. An important point: if you design your grav tanks as Flyers remember the operator will have to have the Flyer skill and/or Grav Knowledge.


Things I’d like you to take away from this post:

• There are lots of ways to design any vehicle but all have trade-offs
• Don’t be confined by the Long Name a maker comes out with. Above I decided the way I’ll use my Light Combat Flyer means that it fits the name and role of a Grav Tank IMTU.
• You might look at me oddly for using a Grav Combat Flyer which on the page screams “I’m a high tech Fighter Jet!” as a Tank, but I haven’t broken any of the rules I’ve just used a dose of imagination alongside the cold hard numbers.

Thanks for reading, tell me what you think.


[EDIT] spotted a mistake that Lite vehicles can only have an operator and passenger and amended the description of the High Trepida to remove references to 10 passengers