T5 CDROM Progress Report

[hunter]

It isn't ready yet; if you can't wait, we (as always) offer a full refund on
request. For those who continue to have patience, we are making progress.

As we approach finalization of the texts for T5, I wanted to
make preliminary files available for what I call "constructive criticism."
If something doesn't work for you, if you can't understand it; if it
produces absurd results, then tell me (and include your suggestions for
desired results, if you have them). Your feedback will help shape the
ultimate usability of the texts.

I want to add that file access is restricted to that special set
of players who have shown their support for T5 by pre-ordering the T5 CDROM. If you have pre-ordered, you should have received an email letting you know how to access this private file and discussion area.

I sincerely thank you for your continuing support.

I also want to thank Hunter Gordon for making this file posting
possible, Don McKinney for moderating the forums for these files, and Rob
Eaglestone for his rules insights.



Marc

 

[Stainless]

Does this mean Marc has released a beta version of a beta version of the rules so he can ge twice as many rules written by other people who payed for the privelage to create his IP? What a business model!

 

[atpollard]

... And yet it is 100% voluntary, requested by the people who paid their money, and no skin off our nose.
(our = people who did not pay for T5)

It is not Illegal.
It is not Immoral.
It is not Fattening.

 

[Stainless]

I take your point, but that still doesn't change what is happening here. In essence, someone is selling a beta version of a game (in fact it's currently a beta of a beta), and is then going to use the customers to help build the full game and then charge those same customers yet again for the privelage of the final release! If paying for the privelage to work for someone is your idea of entertainment, then by all means. I'm not attempting to stand in anyone's way (not that I could). I'm just somewhat incredulous that it's happening and suspect many who have payed for the CD didn't realise it would pan out quite like this. Then again, they can ask for their money back.....

[Just walks away shaking his head....]

 

[coliver988]

I take your point, but that still doesn't change what is happening here. In essence, someone is selling a beta version of a game (in fact it's currently a beta of a beta), and is then going to use the customers to help build the full game and then charge those same customers yet again for the privelage of the final release! If paying for the privelage to work for someone is your idea of entertainment, then by all means. I'm not attempting to stand in anyone's way (not that I could). I'm just somewhat incredulous that it's happening and suspect many who have payed for the CD didn't realise it would pan out quite like this. Then again, they can ask for their money back.....

[Just walks away shaking his head....]

For some people it may be like the 'making of' books that often sell well: you see the movie, but also buy the books explaining what they did behind the scenes. So for those of us who pre-ordered, it is also a chance to see a lot that may or may not make it into the final release.

And for me, personally: playing Traveller was a great way years ago for me to meet and interact with real, live (if usually odd!) people. I pre-ordered the game simply to read it - I'll probably not get a chance to actually play it. But it invokes good memories, and I'm making new memories as I (mostly) read the boards here.

Finally, as I've previously indicated, a pre-order is a crap-shoot: I had no expectations, and $35 is not a significant sum of money. I'll read the rules and play with them when I get the CD, I may even add some commentary if I can come up with anything worthwhile. I'm not paying someone to work for them: I'm paying someone for the entertainment and enjoyment I get out of doing this. It's my hobby and $35 is a pittance for the amount of fun I get out of it.

oh - and coffee is also my drug of choice!

 

[robject]

I take your point, but that still doesn't change what is happening here. In essence, someone is selling a beta version of a game (in fact it's currently a beta of a beta), and is then going to use the customers to help build the full game and then charge those same customers yet again for the privelage of the final release! ...

It is interesting that the forum was created partly out of buyer interest. That people feel they have a stake enough (paying for it implies a stake of sorts I guess) to perhaps contribute time to a product of this sort can seem quirky. Or perhaps taking a hobby to an extreme.

 

[Trouble]

I have been a Traveller enthusiast since 1978. I still believe CT to have been the greatest RPG of all time, unlike many here and elsewhere we converted a lot of other games to Traveller because we prefered the system. Because of its multiple TL approach it proved very adaptable. I think T5 has the potential (based largly on no information I admit) to surpass CT. Am I a Traveller extremist perhaps even a fanatic? Probably so.

 

[rhialto]

I take your point, but that still doesn't change what is happening here. In essence, someone is selling a beta version of a game (in fact it's currently a beta of a beta), and is then going to use the customers to help build the full game and then charge those same customers yet again for the privelage of the final release! If paying for the privelage to work for someone is your idea of entertainment, then by all means. I'm not attempting to stand in anyone's way (not that I could). I'm just somewhat incredulous that it's happening and suspect many who have payed for the CD didn't realise it would pan out quite like this. Then again, they can ask for their money back.....

[Just walks away shaking his head....]

Well, I've volunteered for a similar project before: the Vance Integral Edition, over a few years, for several hundred hours and many tens of thousands of words...and then paid far more than $35 for the final results. No regrets, either: the final result was worth every bit. Hopefully this will be a similar experience.

 

[Overlordbob]

I take your point, but that still doesn't change what is happening here. In essence, someone is selling a beta version of a game (in fact it's currently a beta of a beta), and is then going to use the customers to help build the full game and then charge those same customers yet again for the privelage of the final release! If paying for the privelage to work for someone is your idea of entertainment, then by all means. I'm not attempting to stand in anyone's way (not that I could). I'm just somewhat incredulous that it's happening and suspect many who have payed for the CD didn't realise it would pan out quite like this. Then again, they can ask for their money back.....

[Just walks away shaking his head....]

Well..first of all, I woulda spent the $35 on the the completed project anyways..and this way, I get to preview the materials, offer commentary, and actually have the author briefly consider/discuss my commentary with other like-minded individuals. How cool is it to look over a book, or game system, and be able to say "Hey, that was *my* idea!" or "At least the author fixed that before printing!". Being part of the construction process, even in just a limited fashion, is just plain neat.

 

[Daoloth]

For myself...

If I'd known how this was going to play out, I probably wouldn't have pre-ordered the thing. I find the acrimony and egoism on most RPG lists distasteful and so choose to absent myself from most of them.

On the other hand: The couple of forums I've seen work are ones where the people who read & post are the 'true believers' in the principal of "The point is to have fun." Thusfar the atmosphere on at least the private forums is positive... For myself and the majority of folks posting: We love the game and the idea of being involved, even peripherally, in its creation is well worth the price of admission.

So yes, I bought a product that was still in development with no firm date on delivery. Yes, I'm going to help work on it, and in essence I have paid for that privilege. If this is stupid, well... then I'm stupid. But I'm having fun being stupid, and the three movie tickets I could have bought instead probably would be less entertaining than what I'm already getting to do in talking with other enthusiasts.

So maybe it's not the trip I signed up for, and if I had a problem with it, I'd get off... but thus far, I'm enjoying the ride.

 

[Renaissance Man]

So maybe it's not the trip I signed up for, and if I had a problem with it, I'd get off... but thus far, I'm enjoying the ride.

That's a pretty good way of looking at it.

 

[robject]

...this way, I get to preview the materials, offer commentary, and actually have the author briefly consider/discuss my commentary with other like-minded individuals. How cool is it to look over a book, or game system, and be able to say "Hey, that was *my* idea!" or "At least the author fixed that before printing!". Being part of the construction process, even in just a limited fashion, is just plain neat.

This forum is for you, and others like you.

 

[DonM]

Actually, no. This is the public forum. The forum for people like him is over there, behind the curtain. In this area, I have to let comments like Stainless' one above pass by...

o:

 

[robject]

Actually, no. This is the public forum. The forum for people like him is over there, behind the curtain. In this area, I have to let comments like Stainless' one above pass by...

o:

Good point.

 

[Guardian]

So has anyone who has preordered gotten the email? I haven't.

 

[Sstefan]

Yes, I have received that email; as well as noticed the formation of that access on this site. Check the email address that you used to pre-order; or drop a line to Don M and he can work with that info.

 

[Pagoo]

T5

I'm a tad dismayed the release of the CD being delayed so often, on the other hand, ours is a dying hobby and if we want to keep it alive and well, it is we who need to be proactive in supporting those with the means and talent to move things forward.

So if my $35 helps create a better end product, I can smile and believe I have done something for my gaming hobby. And then to get a CD of the prerelease and a shot at visiting with folks who have been rolling dice nigh on as long as I have, well that’s just fine with me.

Just my nickels worth.

 

[robject]

I'm a tad dismayed the release of the CD being delayed so often, on the other hand, ours is a dying hobby and if we want to keep it alive and well, it is we who need to be proactive in supporting those with the means and talent to move things forward.

So if my $35 helps create a better end product, I can smile and believe I have done something for my gaming hobby. And then to get a CD of the prerelease and a shot at visiting with folks who have been rolling dice nigh on as long as I have, well that’s just fine with me.

Just my nickels worth.

Plus, you can participate in the playtest forum if you'd like to see material sooner.

 

[GrandFatherCoyote]

In for a penny, in for a pound!

Personally, I'm happy about it all. Can't wait to check out the pre-beta files and BURY THEM! If we can work out the bugs and breaks prior to the hardcopy release, everyone benefits. Yes, we paid for the privilege to be testers. I don't remember a PPG being held to my head to force me into this.

J

 

[robject]

Personally, I'm happy about it all. Can't wait to check out the pre-beta files and BURY THEM! If we can work out the bugs and breaks prior to the hardcopy release, everyone benefits. Yes, we paid for the privilege to be testers. I don't remember a PPG being held to my head to force me into this.

J

I should start a blog. Except I'm not a blogger. Maybe I should be. But who cares?