Snapfire, Signal GK, and more!
- Thread starter Jeffr0
- Start date
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
There are two setting books there that really interest me:
and
M
Malenfant
Guest
It's really obvious that this is a 'dream list'. It can't possibly be real - there's no way any company could publish all those settings, it simply wouldn't be practical.
Plus, there's no alien generation system mentioned, which the T5 playtest currently has.
Plus, there's no alien generation system mentioned, which the T5 playtest currently has.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
And how many settings books has GURPS produced over the years?
But I agree, it's a wish list.
I wish I had it all
Wargames.
Living Rules.
PDF Format.
Print-on-demand.
Emails everytime there's a revision or bug fix.
Download. Print. Play.
Tournaments.
PBEM.
Some sort of pledge system so that boards and counters or whatever get made on an as they are demanded basis.
A lot could happen in 10 years....
Living Rules.
PDF Format.
Print-on-demand.
Emails everytime there's a revision or bug fix.
Download. Print. Play.
Tournaments.
PBEM.
Some sort of pledge system so that boards and counters or whatever get made on an as they are demanded basis.
A lot could happen in 10 years....
An undeveloped or unrefined wargame is almost worse than no wargame at all.
Can you imagine being stuck with Commander's Edition SFB? Or pre-Compendium Car Wars? Ogre with the seventies' imbalances still in it? Aiii!
Wargames develop in stages... often moving from Initial Release, to Expansion/Bloat, to Consolidation, to Maturity.
I'd love to see any and all of the classic Traveller wargames receive a new iteration of refinement. Even if it never happens, just the fact that Marc has it on his wishlist makes him an okay guy by me.
Can you imagine being stuck with Commander's Edition SFB? Or pre-Compendium Car Wars? Ogre with the seventies' imbalances still in it? Aiii!
Wargames develop in stages... often moving from Initial Release, to Expansion/Bloat, to Consolidation, to Maturity.
I'd love to see any and all of the classic Traveller wargames receive a new iteration of refinement. Even if it never happens, just the fact that Marc has it on his wishlist makes him an okay guy by me.
SFB is not "Mature", it's continuing to grow. It still has most of the same flaws as the commander's edition. Now, if you said designer's or pocket editions, those are actually better games to many than Captain's.
The Compendium didn't change CW rules, it merely consolidated them in on place. Ok, a few had changed, but those changes were in the errata a good while before.
Ogre: biggest change has been increasing complexity due to integration of GEV, Shockwave, and Reinforcement Pack, and the switch to minis scale.
the "ext Layer of Refinement" on Imperiumm resulted in something nearly unplayable. Not that the rules are bad, but they do result in far longer games.
The Compendium didn't change CW rules, it merely consolidated them in on place. Ok, a few had changed, but those changes were in the errata a good while before.
Ogre: biggest change has been increasing complexity due to integration of GEV, Shockwave, and Reinforcement Pack, and the switch to minis scale.
the "ext Layer of Refinement" on Imperiumm resulted in something nearly unplayable. Not that the rules are bad, but they do result in far longer games.
Said it before, will say it again, boardgames and wargames have changed for the better recently. Not that there weren't concise wargames back in the day (Jutland for example is still excellent) but the trend went to length and complexity.
Euro-games and similar have shown that you can model a complex subject in a game that fits on one table, takes three hours tops (if not an hour or less), and has easily understandable rules and pleasing components. Including economics based games and using cooperation instead of competition. For wargames I’ve also seen a better use of cards and area-based maps (GMT and Phalanx Games for example, and some of the recent Avalon Hill releases).
I'd like to see a space trading boardgame that learned from the best of games like Puerto Rico and Settlers of Catan but for space-based mechanics and theme. Starfarers of Cataan came close but it was too Perry Rhodan (which wasn't a problem for Germany
) in look for me to enjoy. Also a card game version so I could play more or less the same game with friends who like card games but not boardgames. ^_^
In other words, I wouldn’t be interested in purchasing reissues of the original GDW games.
Euro-games and similar have shown that you can model a complex subject in a game that fits on one table, takes three hours tops (if not an hour or less), and has easily understandable rules and pleasing components. Including economics based games and using cooperation instead of competition. For wargames I’ve also seen a better use of cards and area-based maps (GMT and Phalanx Games for example, and some of the recent Avalon Hill releases).
I'd like to see a space trading boardgame that learned from the best of games like Puerto Rico and Settlers of Catan but for space-based mechanics and theme. Starfarers of Cataan came close but it was too Perry Rhodan (which wasn't a problem for Germany
) in look for me to enjoy. Also a card game version so I could play more or less the same game with friends who like card games but not boardgames. ^_^In other words, I wouldn’t be interested in purchasing reissues of the original GDW games.
That doesn't preclude concise wargames; in fact it includes them. Phalanx Games has some examples or GMT's recent lighter games. Some of the DTP games as well.
While it'd be nice to see a redone/streamlined SFB, in the meantime I'm not holding my breath and too busy playing Star Fleet Battle Force.
(edit: I can't spell today
)
Border Reiver
SOC-14 1K
Damn there goes my last month's supply of ogres. yumm yumm. I should really just get a life and quit this strange nerdy stuff!! I would be much sexier if I spent half the time I spend on here at the gym.
Playing settlers with all the expansions, it's neither quick nor concise. We play fewer turns, in those 4-6 hours, and actually win in fewer turns, but turns take SOOO much longer.
Success breeds supplements. Supplements breed complexity.
As for Fed Commander, SVC is worse than MWM about fan desires. MWM at least makes the pretense that he will listen. SVC maintains a deathgrip over SFB and all related indicia... and Alienating fans has been recurrent.
Now, as for the games, I hope MWM actually has clear, concise, short rules.
Mayday was a little too short for the subject matter; BL was too long and complex, as way too detailed.
Many of the Eurogames are quite fun, but very few are simulationist... most are gamist with thematic elements to justify the mechanic, not the other way around.
For example, I'd like to see a ship combat game with a detail level about on par with Bk2, but with a streamlined design system, and mayday style movement.
Success breeds supplements. Supplements breed complexity.
As for Fed Commander, SVC is worse than MWM about fan desires. MWM at least makes the pretense that he will listen. SVC maintains a deathgrip over SFB and all related indicia... and Alienating fans has been recurrent.
Now, as for the games, I hope MWM actually has clear, concise, short rules.
Mayday was a little too short for the subject matter; BL was too long and complex, as way too detailed.
Many of the Eurogames are quite fun, but very few are simulationist... most are gamist with thematic elements to justify the mechanic, not the other way around.
For example, I'd like to see a ship combat game with a detail level about on par with Bk2, but with a streamlined design system, and mayday style movement.
(edit: split post in two; part 1 of 2)
Puerto Rico has one expansion and it's just some more cards and buildings. I didn’t even know it existed until just now.
They're far from the only such games; I mentioned them as the two most popular that focus on economics and cooperation instead of warfare and direct competition.
, nor is a good "gamist" game necessarily a bad thing. Main point is a game doesn't have to have micro-detail to present a player with a plausible or historical situation and choices. Also that area maps (instead of hex), auction, bidding, cards, trade, vote, etc. are used more than they used to be for board/card game mechanics, wargame or otherwise.
And I thought Traveller was Gamist / Narritivist anyway.
I don't play it with all the expansions, nor does it say they're required. One or two are nice if you've played the original game many times but they’re not mandatory. Even with all the expansions in play it has to be much shorter than the weekend long monster games.
They're far from the only such games; I mentioned them as the two most popular that focus on economics and cooperation instead of warfare and direct competition.
Which is a main reason I brought up newer games. Games don't *have* to be long playing, complex, and hard to understand or too simplistic. I’m all for clear, concise, and short rules that suit the subject matter.
<shrugs> I'm not talking only about Eurogames (mention of GMT Games and reference to some DTP games previously), neither is Reiner Knizia the only European game designer
And I thought Traveller was Gamist / Narritivist anyway.
(edit: split post in two; part 2 of 2; added bit relating to Traveller after examples)
Some more examples:
Age of Napoleon
Napoleonic War and similar card-based GMT games (For the People, Paths of Glory, Thirty Years War, Wilderness War, etc.)
Wings of War captures WWI dogfighting in a game that takes a couple of minutes to learn and 30 minutes or less to play; this has replaced Dawn Patrol or Blue Max for me
Zero! or any of the other Down in Flames games for WWII dogfighting; again games in 45 minutes or less most times
FFW could be redone (or some other OTU war used) and include economic and political developments re: the first two examples or at least be streamlined, space combat games using cards (including vectors), a Merchant Prince trading game, etc. . The newer version of Imperium looks better but it still seems like it plays much the same, at least in length of game (long).
I didn’t explain this point enough before. On pleasing components I’m referring to things like the use of wood pieces for weight and feel in some cases, larger counters with good graphics on them, and well-made cards and maps.
<shrugs> But this is a pipe dream as far as I’m concerned for new Traveller games. In the meantime I’ve good games to play, even if they have nothing to do with Traveller.
So what’s the Traveller equivalent of wood for sheep?
Some more examples:
Age of Napoleon
Napoleonic War and similar card-based GMT games (For the People, Paths of Glory, Thirty Years War, Wilderness War, etc.)
Wings of War captures WWI dogfighting in a game that takes a couple of minutes to learn and 30 minutes or less to play; this has replaced Dawn Patrol or Blue Max for me
Zero! or any of the other Down in Flames games for WWII dogfighting; again games in 45 minutes or less most times
FFW could be redone (or some other OTU war used) and include economic and political developments re: the first two examples or at least be streamlined, space combat games using cards (including vectors), a Merchant Prince trading game, etc. . The newer version of Imperium looks better but it still seems like it plays much the same, at least in length of game (long).
I didn’t explain this point enough before. On pleasing components I’m referring to things like the use of wood pieces for weight and feel in some cases, larger counters with good graphics on them, and well-made cards and maps.
<shrugs> But this is a pipe dream as far as I’m concerned for new Traveller games. In the meantime I’ve good games to play, even if they have nothing to do with Traveller.
So what’s the Traveller equivalent of wood for sheep?
How about a (series of) book(s) similar to Gurps 3e Time Travel/Alternate Earths 1 & 2 or 4e's Infinate Worlds? Setting rules in either the core rules or a core setting book then at least sketches for each of the eras?
Not as ideal as a big book for each setting but more possible. One thing I liked about T4 in theory was the multiple layers of rules and possibility for multiple eras and perhaps even multiple settings.
(edit: added linkage)
Agree -- T4's attempt to be open-milieu was a nice try. Likewise, T4's layered rules (starships) was also a valiant try.
If T4 hadn't've had so many and varied problems, it would probably be played more, and there wouldn't be any talk about T5, and the line might have survived longer, even perhaps to today. However, there would probably still be talk about MT2 or CT+.
If T4 hadn't've had so many and varied problems, it would probably be played more, and there wouldn't be any talk about T5, and the line might have survived longer, even perhaps to today. However, there would probably still be talk about MT2 or CT+.
Border Reiver
SOC-14 1K
Oops the wife got in here while I was away from the keyboard. RealLife TM gets in the way again.
