real-world example of shipping line collapse

[jcrocker]

A little while ago there was some discussion about what would happen if a shipping line went bust. Here's more on the Hanjin line:

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-37604082

The story was dated 14 October and contained this section:

"The ship is docked in Singapore, finally. It's the first time in weeks it has been towed up alongside a pier. Hanjin Shipping went bankrupt in August and since then its vessels have been stranded at sea, not allowed to call at any port.

It's the biggest bust the shipping industry has ever seen. Only once the company came under bankruptcy protection were the vessels (around 100 of them) eventually allowed to go into ports around the globe."

That's at least 6 weeks of legal wrangling, all when everyone is on the same planet, so it could take a little longer across any given subsector. And if your crucial MacGuffin is in a container in one of their holds, well...

 

[Condottiere]

I can up that one.


In their drive to extract full compensation from the Argentine government, a hard-nosed bunch of distressed debt investors have gone to impressive lengths. They’ve pursued the country’s assets around the globe, attempting to seize the presidential plane and menacing the Argentine booth at the Frankfurt Book Fair.

Now they have a big and bizarre fish on the hook: an Argentine naval vessel. NML Capital, a subsidiary of U.S. billionaire Paul Singer’s Elliott Capital, this week won an injunction in Ghanaian superior court to hold the ARA Libertad in the port city of Tema, on the outskirts of the African nation’s capital.

UPDATE: Argentine weekly Perfil reported on Friday that the Argentine state filed a motion before the Supreme Court of Ghana in order to annul the injunction won by NML. Ace Ankomah, lawyer for NML in Ghana, indicated the court scheduled a hearing on the matter for Tuesday October 9 before the commercial division of the high court where the first legal proceeding had started. Ankomah added that if Argentina pays a bond, the boat is free to go.

The 103-meter-long sailing ship, which is used as a training vessel for naval cadets, had left Buenos Aires on June 2 and was carrying a reported total crew of 220, including 69 members of the Argentine Navy and 110 students. New York judge Thomas Griesa awarded NML $1.6 billion from Argentina in a lawsuit that the fund filed after it opted not to accept two separate restructuring offers in 2005 and 2010 on the $100 billion in debt that the country defaulted on a decade ago.

The vessel has not been seized, as some media reported, but rather detained, with its crew on board and following their daily routine, the Argentine Navy confirmed to Forbes. (“They’ve been treated very well by the locals,” a naval spokesman said.) Ghana’s courts will now have to decide whether previous rulings in the U.S. and the U.K. are sufficient to move ahead with NML’s case against Argentina. The West African nation ranks 52nd in the CFS’ rule of law index, well above major emerging nations like Brazil, Mexico, and China, and even above so-called advanced countries like Spain, Portugal, and Brazil.

 

[Whipsnade]

That's at least 6 weeks of legal wrangling, all when everyone is on the same planet, so it could take a little longer across any given subsector. And if your crucial MacGuffin is in a container in one of their holds, well...

While comm lag will make things nastier, the fact that the Imperium (allegedly) has a single legal system on the interstellar level will tend to mitigate the situation. That, plus the fact most starports are Imperial property, will mean that no ship is going to be kept "steaming doughnuts" outside a port or anchored on some distant roadstead like the Hanjin vessels were. Stuck in orbit over the main world most certainly, but not reenacting the Flying Dutchman either.

The real world pratique/zarpe system is perhaps the best way for the referee inflict distant and not so distant legal shipping shenanigans on the players. Putting it very simply, a pratique is permission to conduct business in port and a zarpe is permission to leave port.

While the pratique is primarily a quarantine statement; i.e. "No one aboard has the Tionale Trots...", it can also include inspections of various kinds of the ship itself. Those inspections can than trigger repairs - repairs performed and paid for at local facilities. Hint, hint...

A zarpe is permission to leave port. It generally means that all bills have been paid, all previously noted deficiencies have been made good, and all other legal obligations have been met. Hint, hint...

In the 3I/OTU, the SPA will issue pratiques and zarpes. That process will (allegedly) be performed IAW Imperial policy and (allegedly) free from corruption, personal biases, and local prejudices. Hint, hint...

Outside the 3I, the pratique/zarpe system, along with entry visas, can be used by a canny referee to bedevil any players thinking trading "over the border" among the "natives" is just a matter of flashing Imperial credentials, speaking loudly, and swaggering around.

 

[kilemall]

OOOO ooo oo, don't forget port safety and space lane safety!

 

[Selandia]

Think about it as a normal bankrupcy with the spacetrade equivalent of maritime liens rules. The time lag just make it like the XIX century situation. The financial sector made/make/will make sure that it is easy to seize a ship for its debts as soon as it reaches port, even without a prior judgement (even if the book is actually thick).

A ship at sea cannot be seized. As soon as you secure to a berth the baillif could "nail a writ to the mainmast" as the saying goes and you are impounded.

You get "stuck at sea" not so much because SPA are afraid that you wont be able to pay the port dues (they can readily seize you by refusing the zarpe) its the financiers that want to have their assets protected from "de facto" insolvency until legal protection is set-up.

See TETLEY, William, MARITIME LIENS AND CLAIMS since it is 1511 pages, I wont try to resume it here.

Given the MCr involved, the creditor will pay whatever priority fare is needed to get the info out to the local Legal octopus double quick time.

Have fun

Selandia

 

[aramis]

Even the "Sitting in Orbit" is unlikely - fuel and food resources prevent it. At a certain point, the ship declares GK, and either gets fed & fueled, or allowed to land/dock.

In CT/MT/MGT1/MGT2, PP only have 4 weeks fuel, and 1-2 of that was used getting near port.

In TNE, T4, and GT, ships have at least a year of PP fuel... which obviates Power as a reason for a GK.

In all editions, however, the LS is only 4 weeks aboard in normal ops. After 4 weeks, you begin to starve and suffocate. Not quickly, mind, but things start to go south.

If you get denied in orbit upon arrival, best case, you've got three weeks full rations left. When down to two weeks rations left...

... In CT, MT, T20, MGT1, MGT2: start to consider half-rations.
... in TNE, T4, GT: consider half rations and growing food aboard.
... in any, figure out how to scrub the air.

Note that in TNE, GT, and T4, you've got up to a year's power or longer...

The Current wet-navy equivalent, you can fish over the side and air is free, and neither air nor food actually requires power. VERY different paradigm.

 

[Condottiere]

Enough tonnage being devoted to hydroponic biodomes, plus solar panelling.

And spare parts.

 

[whartung]

Even the "Sitting in Orbit" is unlikely - fuel and food resources prevent it. At a certain point, the ship declares GK, and either gets fed & fueled, or allowed to land/dock.

"Declares GK"? What does that mean?

The Current wet-navy equivalent, you can fish over the side and air is free, and neither air nor food actually requires power. VERY different paradigm.

All of which suggests that this is not a problem in the Imperium. Nobody is going to turn a ship in to a debtors death chamber. There is likely some protocol to stabilize the vessel, evacuate the crew, and even maintain the vessel for some time (i.e. ensure it's orbit is stable). All of those costs will simply accrue, much like a public police lot when a car is towed. Either someone claims the vessel and pays those expenses, or, eventually the Authority will assume ownership and auction the vessel off for expenses.

 

[flykiller]

Either someone claims the vessel and pays those expenses, or, eventually the Authority will assume ownership and auction the vessel off for expenses.

a good way for characters to get a ship, even a good ship, for not too much.

also some angry former owners on their tail ....

 

[Condottiere]

There's probably some barebones spaceport in the middle of a desert where they can set down, until their legal situation is clarified, or resolved.

Along the boundaries is a shanty town of luckless spacers living in abandoned containers, whose ships were confiscated or too broken down to ever lift off again.

 

[aramis]

"Declares GK"? What does that mean?



All of which suggests that this is not a problem in the Imperium. Nobody is going to turn a ship in to a debtors death chamber. There is likely some protocol to stabilize the vessel, evacuate the crew, and even maintain the vessel for some time (i.e. ensure it's orbit is stable). All of those costs will simply accrue, much like a public police lot when a car is towed. Either someone claims the vessel and pays those expenses, or, eventually the Authority will assume ownership and auction the vessel off for expenses.

Signal GK - The vilani equivalent of Proword SOS and/or Mayday and/or Pan.

 

[Selandia]

The whole situation suppose that the concerned ships are broadcasted instructions to remain beyond reach of impounders.

Therefore, the whole situation suppose that Ship's agent or local Cie Rep received instruction to prevent docking/landing/making orbit before the concerned ship shows up. They will acccordingly see to it that appropriate transmission are made and that passengers are landed by shuttle and supplies brought in if needed.

An issue is the cargo that does not belong to the ship's owner and its removal. Of course, if you go bankrupt you may not really care for contractual penalty. Criminal penalties (willingly letting passengers or crew dies from LF failure) are another business.

PC with only partial share of a starship may be offered a fully paid spacecraft to operate as a bumboat with extra pay to be involved in muddy business.

Have fun

Selandia