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Cepheus General General discussion of Cepheus Engine products.

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  #21  
Old July 4th, 2017, 05:01 PM
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As a poor teen I was able to dream and play being a rich merchant travelling the stars like Han Solo. I appreciated the joy Marc and the crew brought and show my appreciation by vigorously respecting his IP.

I like to code. Since CT isn't freely available I take the next best thing; CE. I can put code up in public and share it with others who may get the same sort of joy. CE is a way I can bless others as I have been blessed.
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  #22  
Old July 4th, 2017, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ghost View Post
But what thought did you want to compelte with your "If Marc Miller ..." phrase? You said "If", but there was no "then...".
BG, I am not a consistently good writer, sorry.

The "then" I meant is that Mr. Miller will protect his IP as vigorously as John protects Clement Sector and Gypsy Knight Games. It is not only about money nor is it only about credit for creativity. They both play a part. How much of it depends on the individual involved.

A bit of analysis of the situation. Who owns Far Future Enterprises?...I think he knows and has approved or at least aquiesced or there would not be a Cepheus Forum here in the first place,
1.Just look at the bottom of the webpage you are reading
"This website and its contents are copyright ©2010-2013 Far Future Enterprises. All rights reserved. Traveller is a registered trademark of Far Future Enterprises .
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2.I contend that Cepheus Engine is merely doing to Traveller what the OSR and Pathfinder did to D&D. They OGL'ed it and are following the same methodology. The sources cited to create Cepheus:

15. COPYRIGHT NOTICE
Open Game License v 1.0a Copyright 2000, Wizards of the Coast, Inc.
High Guard System Reference Document Copyright © 2008, Mongoose Publishing.
Mercenary System Reference Document Copyright © 2008, Mongoose Publishing.
Modern System Reference Document Copyright 2002-2004, Wizards of the Coast, Inc.; Authors Bill Slavicsek, Jeff Grubb, Rich Redman, Charles Ryan, Eric Cagle, David Noonan, Stan!, Christopher Perkins, Rodney Thompson, and JD Wiker, based on material by Jonathan Tweet, Monte Cook, Skip Williams, Richard Baker, Peter Adkison, Bruce R. Cordell, John Tynes, Andy Collins, and JD Wiker.
Swords & Wizardry Core Rules, Copyright 2008, Matthew J. Finch
System Reference Document, Copyright 2000, Wizards of the Coast, Inc.; Authors Jonathan Tweet, Monte Cook, Skip Williams, based on original material by E. Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson.
T20 - The Traveller’s Handbook Copyright 2002, Quiklink Interactive, Inc. Traveller is a trademark of Far Future Enterprises and is used under license.
Traveller System Reference Document Copyright © 2008, Mongoose Publishing.
Traveller is © 2008 Mongoose Publishing. Traveller and related logos, character, names, and distinctive likenesses thereof are trademarks of Far Future Enterprises unless otherwise noted. All Rights Reserved. Mongoose Publishing Ltd Authorized User.
Cepheus Engine System Reference Document, Copyright © 2016 Samardan Press; Author Jason "Flynn" Kemp

Now if OGL is the problem, well that ship has been sailing since 2000 and if Hasbro thought it was an issue...
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  #23  
Old July 4th, 2017, 07:09 PM
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FWIW, you can always write directly to Marc, tell him what you're planning to write, and ask for permission to make it freely available. He's been very generous with granting permission. That's how most fan-made Traveller software has been released.
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  #24  
Old July 4th, 2017, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan Brazil View Post
Other seem to be editorial decisions to make Cepheus more like CT. Like the format of character generation. There are no event tables and skill packages, even though they were in the SRD.
Yet event tables are in the new Diverse Roles supplement or at least the sample has them.
The basic Cepheus Engine rules do not have the event tables. That's Jason's preference and I don't wish to speak for him concerning his reasoning.

Clement Sector: The Rules (which is our take on Cepheus Engine) is a bit different here and there. That's one of the key differences and that is due to my preferences.
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  #25  
Old July 4th, 2017, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ghost View Post
Just purusing DriveThruRPG I have issues with Cepheus. It just feels like a Traveller knockoff, and in that regard a lawsuit waiting to happen. Right down to the generic black covers.

Whatever.
I think this is because you are not grokking the concept of the OGL and how placing things into an SRD is granting permission of use. You are seeing this as a theft of someone's tool box when, in actuality, it is using someone's tools that they have given you.

And Cepheus doesn't use generic black covers for it's two books. So I've no clue where you have gotten that idea.
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  #26  
Old July 4th, 2017, 11:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ghost View Post
I don't know. It just seems fishy to me. GL to whoever delves into it.
Allow me to explain further. Mongoose placed these rules into an SRD and, under the rules set forth by the OGL, that grants permission for those tools to be used. I assume that this was done by Mongoose with Marc's permission. That means that Marc, through Mongoose, has granted the use of these rules.

If Marc didn't grant permission to Mongoose to place these rules into an SRD, then Marc has a rather serious problem that he needs to iron out with Mongoose! Again, I am not privy to Marc's relationship with Mongoose but I think it's fair to assume that he has granted permission for this to happen. The SRD has been out there for several years now.

I hope to see Marc at Travellercon in late September and hope to have a great conversation with him about all of this (assuming that I am able to be there).
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  #27  
Old July 5th, 2017, 12:26 AM
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I'll wait to read some official posting on Far Future or on Mongoose, because otherwise it seems awfully murky to me.

I have concepts that don't gybe with Marc Miller's OTU canon, but might make a good evening's fun for a gaming group who want something other than than the OTU. But, I'm repeating myself here on that point.
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  #28  
Old July 5th, 2017, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ghost View Post
I'll wait to read some official posting on Far Future or on Mongoose, because otherwise it seems awfully murky to me.
This has already happened. It is called the Traveller SRD. You can find it at the link that I posted earlier in this thread.
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  #29  
Old July 5th, 2017, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyphen View Post
FWIW, you can always write directly to Marc, tell him what you're planning to write, and ask for permission to make it freely available. He's been very generous with granting permission. That's how most fan-made Traveller software has been released.
I've had an e-mail chat with Marc and it went well. The issue is that I'm writing game supplements and directly related book sized works of fiction that would dictate and rely on canon. Not something I want to do and not something anyone else wants me doing.

Since CE allows you to easily modify things that's what I'm going with. It's much more open as in "ended" and as in "source"; both those appeal to me.
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Old July 5th, 2017, 11:36 AM
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I'm not a lawyer, only an interested party in RPG's, open licensing, and Traveller.

Lets not forget that Pathfinder exists. Paizo releases settings for it. Paizo releases adventures for it. Paizo (and everyone else) releases rules additions for it. Some of these products are intended to fill a hole that TSR or WotC (or Piazo for that matter) left. Hasbro chose to allow Pathfinder to exist, and while there are probably reasons beyond "Paizo didn't violate the license", D&D 4E would've likely had a different life if Paizo could be hobbled. Whether terms like "Hit Points" can be copyrighted are murky enough that WotC chose to patent elements of Magic.

I'd expect any of this would be safe (alternate profiles, extensions, locations, persons etc would be 'dangerous') - and within how the OGL has been interpreted in the past 17 years.

To republish Pocket Empires or Dynasty for Cepheus would be heroically stupid. But, given that there's a hole in the generational/uplift/domain management area in Cepheus, if you designed a game that dovetailed into the released SRD, you should be fine legally. Similarly, if I'm a software developer who maintains a word processor, I'd be able to add a feature that Microsoft incorporates into word.

If I were to make something to fill such a hole, I'd think it bad form if one were to fail to notify the owners of the games that inspired it, but bad form/good form isn't the basis of IP law.
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