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Old May 18th, 2013, 02:52 AM
77topaz 77topaz is offline
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Default [T5 ATU] [FS 0930] Sphic.

(This is mainly directed at Magnus, but since others may also benefit from it, I'm posting it here.)

The world Sphic (capital of County Sphic, I presume) is a bit smaller than Earth/Terra. But, it has a population of 500 trillion sophonts (almost a hundred thousand as many as Earth/Terra currently). Since it is in the Permatic Imperium, we can assume the majority are Humans/Humaniti (and Human-sized).
The world also has a Religious Autocracy government (govt code E) with the (very) high law level of G. Plus, its Tech Level is a mere 3, and it has a Atmosphere Code of 3, indicating an atmosphere than normal Humans cannot breathe without assistance.
From this, one can surely gather that it is not a very pleasant place to live...

How can 500 trillion TL-3 Humans live on a world that is only Size 6? Of course, one could say that those 500 trillion don't all live on the mainworld, but even, say, half of 500 trillion is still a huge number. The "closest" thing I could imagine would be a shantytown ten storeys deep covering (nearly) the entire land area of the planet, with sea and underground colonisation as well. With TL-3 building materials, such structures would not be very stable. With TL-3 medical care and such huge levels of crowding diseases would be very widespread as well. Additionally, considering the planet's highly restrictive government, huge population, relatively small amount of farmable land, poor starport (code E) and Amber Zone classification, the question comes up of how are all these people even fed?

Last edited by 77topaz; May 18th, 2013 at 05:26 AM..
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Old May 18th, 2013, 07:37 AM
Vladika Vladika is offline
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Originally Posted by 77topaz View Post
(This is mainly directed at Magnus, but since others may also benefit from it, I'm posting it here.)

The world Sphic (capital of County Sphic, I presume) is a bit smaller than Earth/Terra. But, it has a population of 500 trillion sophonts (almost a hundred thousand as many as Earth/Terra currently). Since it is in the Permatic Imperium, we can assume the majority are Humans/Humaniti (and Human-sized).
The world also has a Religious Autocracy government (govt code E) with the (very) high law level of G. Plus, its Tech Level is a mere 3, and it has a Atmosphere Code of 3, indicating an atmosphere than normal Humans cannot breathe without assistance.
From this, one can surely gather that it is not a very pleasant place to live...

How can 500 trillion TL-3 Humans live on a world that is only Size 6? Of course, one could say that those 500 trillion don't all live on the mainworld, but even, say, half of 500 trillion is still a huge number. The "closest" thing I could imagine would be a shantytown ten storeys deep covering (nearly) the entire land area of the planet, with sea and underground colonisation as well. With TL-3 building materials, such structures would not be very stable. With TL-3 medical care and such huge levels of crowding diseases would be very widespread as well. Additionally, considering the planet's highly restrictive government, huge population, relatively small amount of farmable land, poor starport (code E) and Amber Zone classification, the question comes up of how are all these people even fed?
I think it's obvious that this situation simply can not realistically occur. If this was due to random rolling of dice during generation there should have been GM intervention. If this was a deliberate GM constructed system, well it shouldn't have been.

I could see this escaping anyone's attention if it were generated in mass, by a computer progam, while creating sectors or even sub-sectors.

At any rate, the population just can't be viable.
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Old May 18th, 2013, 07:56 AM
77topaz 77topaz is offline
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Originally Posted by Vladika View Post
I think it's obvious that this situation simply can not realistically occur. If this was due to random rolling of dice during generation there should have been GM intervention. If this was a deliberate GM constructed system, well it shouldn't have been.

I could see this escaping anyone's attention if it were generated in mass, by a computer progam, while creating sectors or even sub-sectors.

At any rate, the population just can't be viable.
I'd asked Magnus when he first posted the starchart (see the comments for the first Far Stars map) whether this was an error, which he confirmed it wasn't. :P
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Old May 18th, 2013, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by 77topaz View Post
I'd asked Magnus when he first posted the starchart (see the comments for the first Far Stars map) whether this was an error, which he confirmed it wasn't. :P
Maybe then, this is a regressed society living off technology it no longer understands, can reproduce, or even maintain?

I still say "Impossible", though I'd love to hear the rationale...
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Old May 18th, 2013, 02:28 PM
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Default [Referee] It's simple really.

One, I was hand generating all the systems since I was testing the rules and since it is the only way I know to do it right. Also, programs don't bring the love rolling dice, not numbers, does.

Two, my ATU has a lot more aliens I just haven't had a chance to any except the Voodgi. They are out there and they may outnumber the humans.


And number three, they aren't humans, but Natives. Check the Extensions. There were at my last check well over a dozen alien Races in just the Far Stars alone, much less the Riftborne Domains or any of the Old Empires. So, if there are check the Alligence code. If it is Im then the Natives are Citizens, if it is Ic or an Imperial Client world then they are Subjects.

Hope that clears that up. Also, Vladika, ain't no such thing as impossible, just something that needs a good winging when the Ref is asked. And since I excel at ass pulling make believe I am pretty sure I am covered.

So, not impossible, just unlikely. Oh and. The resident humans are mix of Tibetians and Andians. Thin Atmo doesn't phase them. How's that rationale grab ya?
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Old May 18th, 2013, 02:49 PM
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Oh and. The resident humans are mix of Tibetians and Andians. Thin Atmo doesn't phase them. How's that rationale grab ya?
Hey, it's YTU
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Old May 18th, 2013, 02:55 PM
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Seriously though,

Quote:
How can 500 trillion TL-3 Humans live on a world that is only Size 6?
Switch "Humans" to "Aliens?". Still, how?

How big are these guys and what do they eat?

BTW, I didn't say impossible, just not viable.
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:oo: “The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.” - George Orwell, Animal Farm :devil:

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Old May 18th, 2013, 03:28 PM
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Arrow [Referee] Realism? You want realism?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladika View Post
I think it's obvious that this situation simply can not realistically occur. If this was due to random rolling of dice during generation there should have been GM intervention. If this was a deliberate GM constructed system, well it shouldn't have been.

I could see this escaping anyone's attention if it were generated in mass, by a computer progam, while creating sectors or even sub-sectors.

At any rate, the population just can't be viable.
I think it is not so obvious, but then recognize that I am playing make believe so I can let a lot slide.

That aside, what makes you say it is not possible? I mean right now we got tons of people on our Size 8 world and we don't have access to magi-tech like we have in Traveller.

I do not agree with Ref intervention when generating systems. I like to let the dice fall where they my. And if you think that is bad, I think there's an asteroid belt with a similar TL issue to the rimward of the Imperium. Can't wait to hear you poo-poo that one too.
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Old May 18th, 2013, 03:36 PM
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Question [Referee] Oh, you did say "impossible"?

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Originally Posted by Vladika View Post
Maybe then, this is a regressed society living off technology it no longer understands, can reproduce, or even maintain?

I still say "Impossible", though I'd love to hear the rationale...
So, this word that bolded, what word is that if not that word you said you didn't say.

And don't think I missed that YTU crack. I know sarcasm when I read it, meaning you think that my explaination is pretty weak. It may be but I sure would like to hear your explaination how you'd justify it.

You don't get to say you would change either, you have to work with the data just like I did.
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Old May 18th, 2013, 03:52 PM
Vladika Vladika is offline
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Originally Posted by Magnus von Thornwood View Post
So, this word that bolded, what word is that if not that word you said you didn't say.
You are right. I am wrong.

I'm going blind (Seriously, no joke about it) and misread what I just wrote. I saw the other post I made "At any rate, the population just can't be viable."

No sarcasm was intended, just amazement and a poor attempt at humor. Will you accept my apology?
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:oo: “The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.” - George Orwell, Animal Farm :devil:

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