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The Fleet Ship designs, strategies, and tactics.

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  #71  
Old October 23rd, 2020, 12:26 PM
kilemall kilemall is offline
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Originally Posted by Proneutron View Post
Diffract means to bend. Bending does nothing to stop EM emissions from leaving the ship and going into space. If you STOP your IR from radiating, your ship will melt in a few minutes. Thus, your fusion PP equipped ship WILL be detected at LONG interplanetary ranges. That isn't a target lock by any means but it means you cannot sneak up on others in space.

Ok great. Neat. You can have your Big Science campaign where no interesting thing can happen cause the Overlord fleets can control the whole damn system easily cause nothing happens that the Sauron sensor arrays won't pick up.


Meanwhile, I will choose handwaved diffraction that allows for stories and player agency.
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  #72  
Old October 23rd, 2020, 02:45 PM
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If you want a way to mask the heat emissions from a ship you need a magic heat sink, or at the very least a directional radiator that radiates your waste heat in a direction you hope sensors are not trained to look.

Over the years I have seen people suggest
subspace heatsinks - I reject those since there is no such thing as subspace in Traveller - jumpspace heatsinks - you can use your jump engine to radiate heat into jump space, I have issues with this one too
gravitic heat sinks - my chosen handwave because grav tech in Traveller is everywhere and is already magical

in one iteration of T5 damper tech had an option that could lower the kinetic energy of particles within the damper field, this could be a magic heat sink.

Mostly though I just go with the directional radiators and that there is no such thing as stealth in space.
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  #73  
Old October 23rd, 2020, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by kilemall View Post
Ok great. Neat. You can have your Big Science campaign where no interesting thing can happen
Fascinating viewpoint. In 40+ years I've never played in a Trav game where the ships were at 4 degrees Kelvin and interesting things happened all the time despite that "deficiency".
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  #74  
Old October 24th, 2020, 03:43 AM
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I'll better explain what is happening. On a nuke they get NEW O2 from the WATER. When you exhale you LOSE O2 as CO2. On a sub they dump that CO2 overboard via reusable scrubbers. When they do that they have LOST that O2 which has to be replaced since it was NOT recycled. On a spaceship they have to CRACK the CO2 to recover the O2. You cannot get new O2 from space.
Sure, crack the CO2, perhaps with some genengineered algae. But you can't count on anything being 100% effective. As I just kibitzplained, a ship could (and probably should) carry a small quantity of water set aside just to replenish crew O2 and also provide a bit of auxiliary fuel. Non-cryo, unpressurized = fail safe.
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Old October 24th, 2020, 03:56 AM
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Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
gravitic heat sinks - my chosen handwave because grav tech in Traveller is everywhere and is already magical

in one iteration of T5 damper tech had an option that could lower the kinetic energy of particles within the damper field, this could be a magic heat sink.
Unless producing the damper field takes more energy than the heat it can damp out... I'm of a mind that making a "shield" of any sort would necessarily be an energy hog. If you can absorb/deflect/disperse a xGJ laser there has to be a comparable energy level in the shield where it is struck, and therefore the whole field has to have that level of energy. Maybe not xGJ, but maybe xGJ/10. It can't "react" and schlep energy from one area to another to reinforce that hit location. Detection, processing, and reaction would each be c limited, and by then your hull is penetrated.

I agree that producing gravitons/grav waves to carry away excess heat is the handiest handwave. But then you are detectable by signature gravitons/grav waves coming from your ship.

The only stealth option is to use LH2 fuel at 10x the normal rate to cool exhaust down to where the grav method is too faint to be separated from all the grav coolers in all the other ships toodling around the system.
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  #76  
Old October 24th, 2020, 10:58 AM
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Sure, crack the CO2, perhaps with some genengineered algae.
More likely you just brute force it since there is plenty of energy from the PP. And plants don't crack CO2 into O2 as that is a high energy task. They use it as is with H2O to make carbohydrates. Plants crack H2O to make O2.

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Originally Posted by Straybow View Post
But you can't count on anything being 100% effective. As I just kibitzplained, a ship could (and probably should) carry a small quantity of water set aside just to replenish crew O2 and also provide a bit of auxiliary fuel. Non-cryo, unpressurized = fail safe.
Yes, that seems very likely especially for long duration trips, as you say it cannot be 100% efficient.
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Old October 24th, 2020, 03:36 PM
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I believe they're trying to create artificial leaves.

So presumably, photosynthesis would be a chemical process.
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Old October 24th, 2020, 03:43 PM
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Umm yes, photosynthesis is a chemical process. Always has been.
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  #79  
Old October 24th, 2020, 06:50 PM
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Photosynthesis:

6 H2O(l) + 6 CO2(g) > C6H12O6(s) + 6 O2(g) → ΔH=+2803KJ/mol

I would rate it middling as far as high-energy tasks go.

Standard enthalpy of formation for CO2 is −393.5 kJ/mol, so direct cracking is more efficient than doing it through photosynthesis.
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Old October 25th, 2020, 01:34 PM
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I would rate it middling as far as high-energy tasks go.
For plants it is beyond high.
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