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  #21  
Old February 19th, 2007, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Shaman:
[QB]In any case, what I think is a mistake is pointing at something in popular fiction, whether it's a book or a movie or a television series, and saying that if it succeeds or fails, then the same will be true of a roleplaying game that is similar to or even licensed from that book, film, or series. The Star Wars movie franchise is the most commercially successful in the history of cinema, but the SWRPG was never the most popular roleplaying game by a long shot, in either its d6 or d20 incarnations - conversely the Dungeons and Dragons movie flopped mightily, and D&D is still the RPG leader by a healthy margin.
That's true, but now I think you're using the dodgy logic - nobody's saying that just because X film is the most popular or unpopular movie of all time, the RPG must also be the most popular or unpopular RPG of all time too. The Star Wars RPGs weren't the biggest ones around, but they were still popular nonetheless. And the D&D film came after the RPG, not before - and it flopped because it sucked enormously.

Aliens was a certainly a good film but to be honest it's a generic scifi movie and not particularly Travelleresque at all, so it's not really fair to point at that and say "oo! it's Traveller!". Cowboy Bebop has a few Travellerish elements (namely, it follows the exploits of a motley crew on a ship) but again is pretty distant from Traveller itself. I think Firefly was a lot closer than either of those to the feel of Traveller (even if the setting was totally different, so it's a much more valid comparison.

I'm sure there must be a fair bit of overlap between those who like Firefly (who are generally of the right demographic to be into RPGs) and those who like Traveller. So if you want to sell Traveller to a new generation, surely the best approach to get their attention is to say "hey, you can do Firefly stuff in this game!"
  #22  
Old February 19th, 2007, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Malenfant:
So if you want to sell Traveller to a new generation, surely the best approach to get their attention is to say "hey, you can do Firefly stuff in this game!"
Spot on.
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  #23  
Old February 19th, 2007, 02:43 PM
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Temporary Thread Hijack

Does anyone remember when one of Vampire the Masquerade's creators slagged off players of all other game systems for being nerds, claiming that Vampire players were cooler, more intelligent, dress better and were all round better company?

At the time I looked at those that played Vampire, Mage and Werewolf at my local club and saw that they weren't that cool but were very self obsessed and miserable about nothing in particular. So at that point I stopped playing.

Back on thread, the first edition Vampire lists a number of inspirations for the game including Anne Rice, Tony Scott's The Hunger and Kathryn Bigelow's Near Dark. I think many player of the game that hadn't read or seen these inspirations sought them out.
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  #24  
Old February 19th, 2007, 02:51 PM
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why do people play rpg's at all?

answer that, and there's your guide on what to do.
  #25  
Old February 19th, 2007, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rhialto the Marvelous:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Malenfant:
So if you want to sell Traveller to a new generation, surely the best approach to get their attention is to say "hey, you can do Firefly stuff in this game!"
Spot on. </font>[/QUOTE]Except that movies (and novels) are passive while RPGs are active. Even console games are largely passive. What I think Shaman is saying, at least as it agrees with what I feel, is that the type of person who will enjoy passive (insert genre of type) such as in a movie, novel or console game is not necessarily the type of person who will be attracted to the active participation inherent in an RPG. Not as an "actor" (player) or "director" (referee). So using the popularity of one to gauge potential interest in the other is largely flawed.
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  #26  
Old February 19th, 2007, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Malenfant:
That's true, but now I think you're using the dodgy logic - nobody's saying that just because X film is the most popular or unpopular movie of all time, the RPG must also be the most popular or unpopular RPG of all time too.
I'm saying that, contrary to what you suggested upthread, success or failure in one medium doesn't necessarily translate to the other.
Quote:
Originally posted by Malenfant:
Aliens was a certainly a good film but to be honest it's a generic scifi movie and not particularly Travelleresque at all, so it's not really fair to point at that and say "oo! it's Traveller!".
Wow, did we see the same movies?!?

The whole quadrology feels very much like a series of Traveller adventures to me.
Quote:
Originally posted by Malenfant:Cowboy Bebop has a few Travellerish elements (namely, it follows the exploits of a motley crew on a ship) but again is pretty distant from Traveller itself.
Again, I disagree, as would two of the players in our group who, when I explained the premise of Traveller without recourse to movie examples, said, "Like Cowboy Bebop?"
Quote:
Originally posted by Malenfant:
I think Firefly was a lot closer than either of those to the feel of Traveller (even if the setting was totally different, so it's a much more valid comparison.
That's clearly a matter of personal taste, but I do agree that Firefly feels like Traveller as well.
Quote:
Originally posted by Malenfant:
I'm sure there must be a fair bit of overlap between those who like Firefly (who are generally of the right demographic to be into RPGs) and those who like Traveller. So if you want to sell Traveller to a new generation, surely the best approach to get their attention is to say "hey, you can do Firefly stuff in this game!"
It's certainly one approach, and one if I were MWM I would probably incorporate as part of a wider approach to influences and sources, but I don't know that it's "surely the best approach" absent some hard marketing data on the relationship between RPGs and genre fiction. I think perhaps that's putting too many eggs in one basket.
  #27  
Old February 19th, 2007, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by flykiller:
why do people play rpg's at all?
I've always figured it was the Peter Pan, Walter Mitty, and such in us. WE are the ones who never grew up and stopped playing Make-Believe but haven't managed (largely) to make it into the careers of Acting and/or Directing and/or Writing, so we play our games [img]smile.gif[/img]

Quote:
Originally posted by flykiller:
answer that, and there's your guide on what to do.
Like most things, answering the question is not the hard part, applying that answer to the problem at hand is the tricky bit.
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  #28  
Old February 19th, 2007, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by far-trader:
What I think Shaman is saying, at least as it agrees with what I feel, is that the type of person who will enjoy passive (insert genre of type) such as in a movie, novel or console game is not necessarily the type of person who will be attracted to the active participation inherent in an RPG. Not as an "actor" (player) or "director" (referee). So using the popularity of one to gauge potential interest in the other is largely flawed.
Proof that I really need an editor when I post - thanks for making sense of what I was trying to write. [img]smile.gif[/img]
  #29  
Old February 19th, 2007, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Border Reiver:
Back on thread, the first edition Vampire lists a number of inspirations for the game including Anne Rice, Tony Scott's The Hunger and Kathryn Bigelow's Near Dark. I think many player of the game that hadn't read or seen these inspirations sought them out.
Was the opposite true? Did people who read the books or saw the movies gravitate toward the game, in your experience?
  #30  
Old February 19th, 2007, 03:27 PM
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A point about ratings, and why sf tv is seen to tank.

The way networks gather ratings is widely inaccurate and will always boost the apparent appeal of mainstream family type shows, meanwhile under representing more niche or minority shows.

It works by volunteer households having a spybox on top of the telly that monitors both how many people are in the room and what is being watched. In the UK it works out as 4500 viewers per person in such a household in the room with the box.

So you can see how crude a measure it is. The spybox can't tell whether someone's actually watching telly, or reading with the tv on in the background, or just talking over it. It doesn't record whether a household member wants to watch something on another telly in the house.

And, in the case of cult tv style shows, how likely is it the typical fan would want the tv networks monitoring their viewing habits? How many on COTI here would allow that?

Despite this tv execs treat the ratings figures like the word of god.

So it is probably the case that sf tv is alot more popular than it seems, and it's just the system that's skewed against it.

Sorry to meander off topic there, guys, just thought it was worth mentioning here. [img]smile.gif[/img]
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