Traveller Store CotI Features New Posts Mark Forums Read Register


Go Back TravellerRPG.com > Citizens of the Imperium > Other Versions of Traveller > Mongoose Traveller

Mongoose Traveller Discussion forums for the Traveller rules from Mongoose Publishing.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old May 11th, 2018, 09:55 AM
Gwahlur Gwahlur is offline
Citizen: SOC-1
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 2
Gallery : 0
Gwahlur Citizen
Default Are you supposed to add Effect from skill rolls to space combat damage rolls?

I have been playing in a Mongoose Traveller (1st Ed, the one published in 2008) for some time now and just started wondering how space combat damage is actually calculated. In ordinary "man-to-man" combat, you add the Effect of the skill roll to the damage caused by weapon (Core Rulebook p. 65). Are you supposed to do the same in space combat? I fail to find any mention of this in the space combat rules.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old May 11th, 2018, 11:37 AM
McPerth's Avatar
McPerth McPerth is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 7,487
Gallery : 0
Visit McPerth's Blog
McPerth has disabled reputation
Default

AFAIK it's not explicited in the rules. See those old discussion o nanother old thread, through.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McPerth View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by aramis View Post
McPerth: you're forgetting one aspect of MGT - margin of success adds to damage. A 1D laser with a good gunner can get a good shot and pen that armor.
I'm not forgetting that, I was just unaware of that fact.

I won't dare to challenge your knowledge of the rules (less so in something I find quite sound), but, can you please tell me where is this rule written? I reviewed the core book (ship combat, weapons and skill descriptions) and didn't find it.

Of course this fact will make weapons quite more powerful and, as you say, make this ship (and any other with armor 6+) vulnerable even to beam lasers (as an example), so giving more sense to having them installed on your ship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aramis View Post
That's because they made it less explicit after playtest... The ship damage (unlike personal) doesn't define rolled damage... personal combat does; the roll of the indicated dice plus the effect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by McPerth View Post
Do you know if this has been ammended on errata? IMHO it should, if this rule is mantained.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aramis View Post
It's not in the errata docs I have, however, it was explicit in playtest that effect was added to all damages.
Quote:
Originally Posted by McPerth View Post
But as most of us (I guess) were not involved in playtest (nor have we access to it), I think it should be hard written in the rules or the errata. Anyway, now knowing about it (TY for that, BTW), I'll use this rule if I play MGT.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aramis View Post
One big problem to be aware of: after the last public beta, they changed the task system, personal and ship combat mechanics. Some of the gaps are likely of that origin; Tasks went to what was obviously an in-house draft, same with Personal Combat; the different wording and turns of phrase in ship combat imply a different era from the other two; it certainly feels like a precursor to Playtest Draft 3's combat mechanics.
__________________
Duke of ShaiaVland 3215 B64A998-E
Marquis of Ashtagz Tyui SR 1818C548786-8
SEH for actions in Extolay

I'm not afraid about bullets, what scares me is the speed at which they're incoming.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old May 11th, 2018, 12:02 PM
Gwahlur Gwahlur is offline
Citizen: SOC-1
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 2
Gallery : 0
Gwahlur Citizen
Default

Thank you for a very thorough answer, McPerth!

It appears that adding the Effect is the authoritative interpretation of the space combat rules. This increases the value of pulse and beam lasers, and also of ordinary missiles, while at the same time devaluing armor somewhat. This suits me fine, thematically I much prefer space combat to be a dangerous affair.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old May 11th, 2018, 12:30 PM
McPerth's Avatar
McPerth McPerth is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 7,487
Gallery : 0
Visit McPerth's Blog
McPerth has disabled reputation
Default

You're welcome (and by the way, also to the board, as I see those are your first posts).

I fully agree with you on it. See that in HG capital ship combaat the crew quality (so the skill level) is a potnetially decisive factor, helping to overcome the armor or highly increasing damage against unarmored ships..

This makes IMHO consistent with HG combat rules to add the to hit task effect (directly related to skill) to damage in small ship combat (the CB system).

EDIT: See that exactly the same thing can be said about FC software END EDIT

But that's only my opinion, and AFAIK there's no official answer to your question.
__________________
Duke of ShaiaVland 3215 B64A998-E
Marquis of Ashtagz Tyui SR 1818C548786-8
SEH for actions in Extolay

I'm not afraid about bullets, what scares me is the speed at which they're incoming.

Last edited by McPerth; May 11th, 2018 at 01:35 PM.. Reason: afterthoughts
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old May 22nd, 2018, 10:48 AM
DickNervous's Avatar
DickNervous DickNervous is offline
Baron
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Levittown NY
Posts: 488
Gallery : 3
Visit DickNervous's Blog
DickNervous Citizen+DickNervous Citizen+
Default

For 1st Edition you use the table that translates a damage number into a specific number of single, double, or triple hits and adding the effect usually didn't change things, so I never did it. Besides, I found that space combat was deadly enough without adding that in

However, since it isn't specified in the rules you can do it however you want, just be consistent.
__________________
]
DickNervous aka Rich Neves
Viscount of Equus - SPIN 2417 Equus B55A858-B
Baron of Ishala - VLAN 2113 Ishala C866651-9
Baron of Enaaka - DENE 0203 Enaaka B777786-6
Knight of Deneb - SPIN 1721 ARBA C200200-C
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old May 22nd, 2018, 11:21 AM
McPerth's Avatar
McPerth McPerth is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 7,487
Gallery : 0
Visit McPerth's Blog
McPerth has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DickNervous View Post
For 1st Edition you use the table that translates a damage number into a specific number of single, double, or triple hits and adding the effect usually didn't change things, so I never did it. Besides, I found that space combat was deadly enough without adding that in

However, since it isn't specified in the rules you can do it however you want, just be consistent.
I fully disagree with you on the fact that adding the effect does not use to change it.

Imagine two gazelle (CB page 123) ships fighting each other. They have armor 8 and are armed wiht beam lasers, sandcasters and missiles. Unless they use nukes (something forbiden in 3I), they are imprevious to each other fire unless the effect is added.

Even a free trader has armor 4, so being unaffected by those weapons 66% of time, and receiving one single hit the other 33%. If you add the effect, they may even receive two single hits (if effect + roll is 9+)...

Even a tiny armor 2 limits the damage of those weapons to one single hit unless effect is added...

The damage table goes by increments of 4, so adding effect (that may be up to 6) will change the table quite often.
__________________
Duke of ShaiaVland 3215 B64A998-E
Marquis of Ashtagz Tyui SR 1818C548786-8
SEH for actions in Extolay

I'm not afraid about bullets, what scares me is the speed at which they're incoming.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old May 22nd, 2018, 02:15 PM
AnotherDilbert AnotherDilbert is online now
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Stockholm 🇸🇪
Posts: 1,663
Gallery : 0
AnotherDilbert Citizen+AnotherDilbert Citizen+AnotherDilbert Citizen+
Default

Sorry, isn't the Beam laser 2D damage?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old May 22nd, 2018, 11:22 PM
McPerth's Avatar
McPerth McPerth is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 7,487
Gallery : 0
Visit McPerth's Blog
McPerth has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnotherDilbert View Post
Sorry, isn't the Beam laser 2D damage?
This was changed in HG, as changes to standard rules. Beam laser does 1d6, while pulse laser does 2d6 damage, but has a -2 to hit (more powerful, less accurate).
__________________
Duke of ShaiaVland 3215 B64A998-E
Marquis of Ashtagz Tyui SR 1818C548786-8
SEH for actions in Extolay

I'm not afraid about bullets, what scares me is the speed at which they're incoming.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old May 23rd, 2018, 11:03 AM
DickNervous's Avatar
DickNervous DickNervous is offline
Baron
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Levittown NY
Posts: 488
Gallery : 3
Visit DickNervous's Blog
DickNervous Citizen+DickNervous Citizen+
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by McPerth View Post
I fully disagree with you on the fact that adding the effect does not use to change it.

Imagine two gazelle (CB page 123) ships fighting each other. They have armor 8 and are armed wiht beam lasers, sandcasters and missiles. Unless they use nukes (something forbiden in 3I), they are imprevious to each other fire unless the effect is added.

Even a free trader has armor 4, so being unaffected by those weapons 66% of time, and receiving one single hit the other 33%. If you add the effect, they may even receive two single hits (if effect + roll is 9+)...

Even a tiny armor 2 limits the damage of those weapons to one single hit unless effect is added...

The damage table goes by increments of 4, so adding effect (that may be up to 6) will change the table quite often.

So I just realized that for MgT1 I have been doing ship combat all wrong for quite some time. I never subtracted the armor from the amount rolled on the dice for damage before checking the table. How the heck neither I nor my players have realized that oversight all this time I am not sure. So yeah, then the effect would make a big difference.

I'm gonna go get my Dunce cap now and sit in the corner for a few days...
__________________
]
DickNervous aka Rich Neves
Viscount of Equus - SPIN 2417 Equus B55A858-B
Baron of Ishala - VLAN 2113 Ishala C866651-9
Baron of Enaaka - DENE 0203 Enaaka B777786-6
Knight of Deneb - SPIN 1721 ARBA C200200-C
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old May 23rd, 2018, 06:04 PM
AnotherDilbert AnotherDilbert is online now
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Stockholm 🇸🇪
Posts: 1,663
Gallery : 0
AnotherDilbert Citizen+AnotherDilbert Citizen+AnotherDilbert Citizen+
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by McPerth View Post
This was changed in HG, ...
Sorry, I had forgotten about that.


I think it's a rather weak argument that you have to add Effect otherwise the worst weapon in the game can't penetrate a medium armoured warship.

As far as I can remember the MgT1 system was quite deadly enough, if you used real weapons...
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Computer Skill Rolls in CT creativehum Classic Traveller 14 January 29th, 2017 12:26 AM
How many rolls? GypsyComet Classic Traveller 12 January 9th, 2009 05:54 PM
Trimming down the rolls? robject Citizens' Information Centre 34 November 24th, 2005 04:30 AM
Mustering Out Rolls scurry T20 - Traveller for the D20 System 1 November 1st, 2002 11:22 AM

This website and its contents are copyright ©2010- Far Future Enterprises. All rights reserved. Traveller is a registered trademark of Far Future Enterprises .
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright (c) 2010-2013, Far Future Enterprises. All Rights Reserved.